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120hz 1080p vs. 60hz 1440p monitor - Page 2

post #11 of 50
I design/code and game on my PC so I went with 1440p. If someone only uses their PC to play games, then I can see 120Hz being useful.
I rather have my display be an all-round performer than a one trick pony.
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post #12 of 50
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by drBlahMan View Post

I prefer watching movies @ 1440p BUT i'm absolutely satisfied @ 1080p for gaming. In all honesty, the resolution difference from 1080p to 1440p for gaming doesn't fascinate me enough to make me spend another $200 to $300 more when I can enjoy 3D Vision with the ASUS VG248QE. My buddy games @ 1440p & it's cool...everything is a bit larger on his 27" display BUT I was not like "OMG, I gotta buy a 1440p."
3D Vision got me sprung wheee.gif

BTW...Nice review to state your opinion based on your personal experience thumb.gif

 

Yeah you are like me. 3Dvision is also a great thing. I got the Asus VG278H and Batman Arhkam Asylum is plain amazing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ivanlabrie View Post

Can you post a few benchmark scores using the different modes.
Say 1920x1080p monitor at 60hz,120hz and 3d and the 1440p one at "stock"?
I think that would help people decide, based on the amount of gpu power needed for each kind of setup.
Would be nice to see. thumb.gif

I wish I could but I just packed my 1440p monitor. Friend will get it from me tomorrow. However I can tell you that 1440p 60hz is about 30-40% more demanding than 1080p 60hz.

 

With 1080p 60hz you can be fine with a single GPU but for 1080p 120hz or 1440p 60hz there are games where a single GPU will not cut it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AznDud333 View Post

i disagree, while 1440p is great... theres a couple of things to consider
1. having to buy a better gpu
2. refresh late too low


people who get 120hz tn do not get it for 3d vision..as that is just a gimmick(trust me i have it)
having played bf3 the real difference is the smoothness...on a 60hz screen theres just too much blurring to be fun. the difference is pretty hard to describe..so just try it yourself and you'll understand.

1080p 120hz or 1080b 3Dvision 60 hz requires twice the power. While 1440p resolution does not.

 

But the refresh rate is low, however the beauty in detail can overcome this for some people. I totally know what you mean. 120hz gaming is definitaly better than 60 hz gaming but for some people out there better colors and better resolution will be the option to go for. IT really depends from a person to person.

Quote:
Originally Posted by B!0HaZard View Post

Just ordered a ViewSonic VP2770. 27" PLS panel, 2560x1440 and according to Prad.de it only has 7 ms input lag, half that of the Dell U2713HM. My BenQ at 60 Hz has the same amount of input lag so it's not bad at all. Question is if it'll be blurry. There was definitely a difference when I switched to my current monitor, but my old monitor could've been much worse.

I'm tired of the low pixel density on my monitor and it's only a 24". I really don't understand why people would want to use a resolution of 1920x1080 on a 27" monitor.

I also agree with you on 1080p and 27 inch monitor. The pixel density is too low. If it was not for 3D purpose, and if I was to aim for a 120 hz monitor only, I would have gone with a 24 inch monitor myself. But I just like 3D in bigger screens. For me 3D makes a difference in 27 inch vs 24 inch.

 

Also in fast scenes it might be blurry for your new 1440p panel, but the colors and sharp textures will probably make it up for you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by h2spartan View Post

Now that I am used to 120hz....I CANNOT go back to 60hz...It's so terrible. I bought a Shimian too to test out a high resolution monitor for comparisons sake. Shortly thereafter, I sold it. The appearance of 1440p vs 1080 is not overly apparent to me in games, at least, not like 120hz is compared to 60. Also, I guess I stuck with my samsung not only because of the refresh rate but because the color reproduction is also close to on par with ips panels. So, I guess that's just an added bonus. Now once reputable companies start making high quality, high res, 120hz monitors(dont mention those Korean models LOL) im content with my 1080p 120hz.

I am praying every day for a 120hz 3D compatible IPS panel with 1440p resolution but I am guessing we are not there yet. If something like that comes up, I will just get it no matter the price :)

post #13 of 50
There's a valid reason to go with a 120 Hz 1080p TN display, less lag. All of the 60 Hz 1440p IPS displays I've seen so far have 1.5-2 frames of lag.

Quote:
Originally Posted by B!0HaZard View Post

Just ordered a ViewSonic VP2770. 27" PLS panel, 2560x1440 and according to Prad.de it only has 7 ms input lag, half that of the Dell U2713HM. My BenQ at 60 Hz has the same amount of input lag so it's not bad at all. Question is if it'll be blurry. There was definitely a difference when I switched to my current monitor, but my old monitor could've been much worse.

I'm tired of the low pixel density on my monitor and it's only a 24". I really don't understand why people would want to use a resolution of 1920x1080 on a 27" monitor.

The overall lag consists of input lag and pixel response time. TFTCentral measured 26 ms of average lag.
post #14 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by villain View Post

There's a valid reason to go with a 120 Hz 1080p TN display, less lag. All of the 60 Hz 1440p IPS displays I've seen so far have 1.5-2 frames of lag.
The overall lag consists of input lag and pixel response time. TFTCentral measured 26 ms of average lag.

Yes, but I think they are wrong. Prad.de got half the input lag of the Samsung S27A850D when they tested the VP2770 and they use the most accurate method. The pixel response times were the same (when using similar overdrive settings) because the two monitors use the same panel, but the input lag was lower on the VP2770. The TFT central reading has to be 5-10 ms too high.

Additionally Prad.de mentioned briefly that they got a 9 on the pixperan readability test. That's the same as I get on my BenQ XL2420T 120 Hz monitor. If true, the VP2770 pixel response time is very good.
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post #15 of 50
A good 1440p/1600p panel will have little to no motion blur, and if you have the power to lock games at 60FPS @ 60hz its quite smooth.
Both options are great there is nothing like gaming at this rez.
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post #16 of 50
Very good post! However, have you ever tested LightBoost for 2D?
Quote:
Originally Posted by iARDAs View Post

I actually played BF3 today in both screens. 120hz 1080p (2ms respond time) and 60hz 1440p (5ms respond time).
Response time of the liquid crystal isn't the only factor.
You need to factor into the response time of the strobe backlight modes.
120 Hz without stroboscopic backlight - 8.33ms sample-and-hold
120 Hz with LightBoost storboscopic backlight - 2.4ms strobe length
120 Hz with LightBoost stroboscopic backlight - 1.4ms strobe length

Motion blur is proportional to the amount of time a visible frame is displayed for.
From motion tests, the VG278H (2ms panel) actually has a measured Motion Picture Response Time of 1.4ms, which compares to the sample-and-hold Motion Picture Response Time of 8.33ms
Quote:
Although the 120hz
You are aware that the best 120 Hz has more than 5x less motion blur than a typical 120 Hz mode?
Have you tested the LightBoost tweak in 2D mode?
Quote:
I think in 2013, the only reason that a person grabs a 120hz TN panel will only be because of 3Dvision
Have you heard about the LightBoost tweak discovery, now being covered in several media articles including TechNGaming and pcmonitors.info, etc?
Media articles about LightBoost zero motion blur tweak for 2D gaming
Quote:
One other note. Playing a game at 1080p 120hz stable or 1080p 3D 60hz stable will require more beef ( GPU power) than playing that exact game with exact settings at 1440p 60hz.
That's very true.
post #17 of 50
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdrejhon View Post

Very good post! However, have you ever tested LightBoost for 2D?
Response time of the liquid crystal isn't the only factor.
You need to factor into the response time of the strobe backlight modes.
120 Hz without stroboscopic backlight - 8.33ms sample-and-hold
120 Hz with LightBoost storboscopic backlight - 2.4ms strobe length
120 Hz with LightBoost stroboscopic backlight - 1.4ms strobe length

Motion blur is proportional to the amount of time a visible frame is displayed for.
From motion tests, the VG278H (2ms panel) actually has a measured Motion Picture Response Time of 1.4ms, which compares to the sample-and-hold Motion Picture Response Time of 8.33ms
You are aware that the best 120 Hz has more than 5x less motion blur than a typical 120 Hz mode?
Have you tested the LightBoost tweak in 2D mode?
Have you heard about the LightBoost tweak discovery, now being covered in several media articles including TechNGaming and pcmonitors.info, etc?
Media articles about LightBoost zero motion blur tweak for 2D gaming

That's very true.

I heard about it but did not test yet.

 

I did a clean install of my system and BF3 is taking ages to download. So far the only game I have now is Batmah Arkham Asylum. I am waiting on reinstalling other titles and will try that lightboost tweek. I am just wondering if it has any side effects to the monitor though.

post #18 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by iARDAs View Post

I heard about it but did not test yet.
I did a clean install of my system and BF3 is taking ages to download. So far the only game I have now is Batmah Arkham Asylum. I am waiting on reinstalling other titles and will try that lightboost tweek. I am just wondering if it has any side effects to the monitor though.
It has no side effects on the monitor -- LightBoost is always enabled during 3D Vision. All the tweak does is enable it without needing to use 3D shutter glasses.

LightBoost is simply a 3D Vision feature that helps eliminate crosstalk by eliminating pixel persistence from becoming visible to the human eye. Less pixel persistence visible, less leakage between left and right eye. This is accomplished by keeping pixel persistence in total darkness between refreshes, and strobing the backlight on fully refreshed frames (the property that makes 3D shutter glasses possible; alternating fully refreshsed frames for left/right eye quickly -- this wouldn't be possible if pixel persistence leaked too much between frames). High speed video of the synchronized strobe backlight of LightBoost. What was found by a lot of us, is that a major beneficial side effect of that is the elimination of motion blur; which is useful for 2D even if you're not interested in wearing the 3D glasses. There is a tweak: LightBoost zero motion blur HOWTO .... So all future major monitor reviews now need to factor this feature in, since more people worldwide are apparently interested in that than interested in 3D Vision. They just didn't know about it; some people miss the perfect-clarity of CRT, and want to get that in LCD.

The problem is nVidia never made this feature easy to enable if you don't buy the 3D glasses...
(Hint: nVidia should....)

For example:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skyviper 
So I finally got the VG248QE hooked up last night and was able to play around with it for a couple hours. The other monitor that I have is a HP ZR30W which is a 30" 2560x1600 IPS monitor so I will be comparing the VG248QE to that a lot in this review.

Right off the bat, I noticed the color quality seems to be a lot worse than the ZR30W. Everything looks to be washed out, dull and not to mention the monitor suffers from poor viewing angles. On the ZR30W, there is next to no color shifting when I move my head around unlike the VG248QE, but that's a common problem with all TN monitors. I tried calibrating the monitor a little bit using some of the values posted online, but it still doesn't compare to the HP.

Moving on, the first thing I tried was 144 Hz gaming. I loaded up Borderlands 2 just to see how it is and I can definitely say it felt smoother. There is no screen tearing at all on the ASUS, unlike how it is on the HP if i don't turn on Vsync. Although the game felt smoother at 144 Hz and there was less blurring, I found that having to play on a lower res (1920x1080 vs 2560x1600) and poorer color reproduction made the overall gaming experience WORSE. Granted this isn't a competitive, online FPS game so I might have benefited more from having a faster refresh rate, but I would have probably stuck with playing this game on the 30" IPS monitor rather than a 24" TN.

At this point I felt like I may have wasted $300 bucks on a monitor that is full of compromises. The next thing I tried of course was using the Lightboost hack. This was the main reason why I bought the monitor in the first place since there are plenty of other 120 Hz monitors that I could have gotten that I'm sure had better color reproduction.

So I downloaded the hacked INF file and followed Mark's instructions. After turning on Lightboost, I noticed the monitor became a little bit brighter so I loaded up PixPerAn just to verify everything is working. The first thing I noticed was that I can actually read "I need more socks" at full speed! This was cool since I've never been able to read it going so fast before on any LCD monitor.

I then proceeded to load up Borderlands 2 again not having much expectations. The first thing that happened was I noticed the FPS drop down to around 1-2 fps, but then I remembered to hold down "Ctrl-T" for a few seconds to turn off the 3D effect which fixed the FPS problem. So I loaded up a game and the first thing that came to my mind was...

SWEET MOTHER OF GOD!

Am I seeing this correctly? The last time I gamed on a CRT monitor was back in 2006 before I got my first LCD and this ASUS monitor is EXACTLY like how I remembered gaming on a CRT monitor. I was absolutely shocked and amazed at how clear everything was when moving around. After seeing Lightboost in action, I would have gladly paid twice the amount for something that can reproduce the feeling I got when playing on a CRT. Now I really can't see myself going back to my 30" 2560x1600 IPS monitor when gaming. Everything looks so much clearer on the ASUS with Lightboost turned on.


If you do any kind of gaming, you should definitely get this monitor. For everything else however, an IPS monitor would probably be better.

Thankfully I am lucky enough to have both smile.gif
Look at how he pans TN, and thinks 120 Hz is no big deal.... until he saw LightBoost. Just like many of us who are sensitive to motion blur. The LightBoost HOWTO has had over 10,000 pageviews a week and it is currently a popular feature of VG248QE's amongst HardForum and OCN users (plus a bunch of others); more popular than 3D Vision in some forums. It's like having high-definition during fast motion -- fast pans are as perfectly as clear as stationary images. (The CRT effect)

But the effect only works well when you get 120fps@120Hz, so you are very right, you need more GPU power. It does NOT work well in demanding games like Crysis series because of that, but works very well in less demanding games like Team Fortress 3, for example. You can really see it in fast movements, flick turns, strafing, high speed passes, zoom bys in racing, you have to track your eyes on fast-moving objects to see the benefit of LightBoost. It doesn't benefit all games, mind you. But for games that it benefits and you have the GPU power, the effect is dramatic to a portion of the market. Not everybody, though, is sensitive to motion blur, but if you are a person who can see 120 Hz LCD's does not have as clear motion as CRT, LightBoost can give a surprise to some.
Edited by mdrejhon - 3/10/13 at 3:25pm
post #19 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by sugarhell View Post

I disagree.You need more gpu power to keep your frames at 120 with good IQ. At 1440p you dont even need AA,
Quote:
Originally Posted by AznDud333 View Post

i disagree, while 1440p is great... theres a couple of things to consider
1. having to buy a better gpu
2. refresh late too low


people who get 120hz tn do not get it for 3d vision..as that is just a gimmick(trust me i have it)
having played bf3 the real difference is the smoothness...on a 60hz screen theres just too much blurring to be fun. the difference is pretty hard to describe..so just try it yourself and you'll understand.

you dont have to have constant 120fps to enjoy 120hz... my 670 maintains around 90fps in bf3, which makes it liquid smooth...a friend of mine who has the same setup on a 1440p monitor can't even manage to maintain above 50fps at all times(which looks to be a bit choppy for my tastes)

and i dont even use AA for 1080p..so no argument there
 
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post #20 of 50
I'd take the lightboost 2d hack any day of the week...but I don't dig the current nvidia cards (except maybe a titan which I can't afford...yet)
There's a lightboost compatible ips monitor by Asus, 120hz too I think. Think it was 23" and 1080p, am I right?
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