Overclock.net › Forums › Cooling › Specialized Cooling › Peltiers / TEC › TEC Liquid Chiller suggestions.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

TEC Liquid Chiller suggestions. - Page 2

post #11 of 33
Either way you do it, a peltier will only get you so far. Adding rads to cool stuff will heat the water cause you'll be using ambient air (which is hotter than your fluid).
Running separate loops like that doesn't seem like a very good idea.
I've seen threads like this popping up and 99% of the time the OPs decided to do someting else cause TEC's are not really viable anymore. They were all the fury back in the pentium 2 era but modern cpus put out much more heat to be really cold under them. frown.gif
post #12 of 33
Excuse me but please go troll somewhere else ! Some of the members can and do run sub-zero temps so unless you can come up with absolute truth to the contrary please leave us alone with your negative views. thumbsdownsmileyanim.gif
Double Vision
(19 items)
 

(0 items)
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Ivy Bridge 3770K with IHS removed Asus Max V gene Gigabyte Windforce OC 670 X 2 G Skills Trident X 2 x 4gig 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Crucial M4 SSD Samsung Sony 24X Tfc Monsta 420 and Tfc Xchanger 360 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
Rp 452 res with 2 x D5 varios and DD Cp pro for... Arqtic dual TEC chiller with 2-400watt Qmax tec... Ek supreme Cpu block with modified plate and 2 ... 9 x CM 120 mm R4 fans-1 x 140 Bitfenix Pro fan ... 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
7 Ultimate Phillips 234 23 inch Logitech G110 Seasonic X-1250 
CaseMouseMouse Pad
Dual CM Haf 922`s CM Sentinel Advance 2 Big 
  hide details  
Reply
Double Vision
(19 items)
 

(0 items)
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Ivy Bridge 3770K with IHS removed Asus Max V gene Gigabyte Windforce OC 670 X 2 G Skills Trident X 2 x 4gig 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Crucial M4 SSD Samsung Sony 24X Tfc Monsta 420 and Tfc Xchanger 360 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
Rp 452 res with 2 x D5 varios and DD Cp pro for... Arqtic dual TEC chiller with 2-400watt Qmax tec... Ek supreme Cpu block with modified plate and 2 ... 9 x CM 120 mm R4 fans-1 x 140 Bitfenix Pro fan ... 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
7 Ultimate Phillips 234 23 inch Logitech G110 Seasonic X-1250 
CaseMouseMouse Pad
Dual CM Haf 922`s CM Sentinel Advance 2 Big 
  hide details  
Reply
post #13 of 33
Thread Starter 
I just had an idea biggrin.gif


What if I used the 400watt peltier, and put a seeback effect generator on it the hotside of the peltier
http://www.customthermoelectric.com/powergen.html

Then put the heatsink on the backside of that, then use the power from the generator to power those high dTmax peltiers.

(Just brainstorming)

Obviously only use 1 or 2 of those high DTMax ones
Edited by ZytheEKS - 3/22/13 at 7:38pm
The Laboratory
(11 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
AMD FX-8350 Vishera 8-Core 4.0GHz Asus Crosshair V Formula-Z Radeon R9 290X Generic 1333MHz R.A.M. 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
Wester Digital 5400RPM HP CH20L "The Russian Winter" Windows 8 
KeyboardPowerCase
Steel Series Merc Fatal1ty 1000Watt PSU DIY Rig 
  hide details  
Reply
The Laboratory
(11 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
AMD FX-8350 Vishera 8-Core 4.0GHz Asus Crosshair V Formula-Z Radeon R9 290X Generic 1333MHz R.A.M. 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
Wester Digital 5400RPM HP CH20L "The Russian Winter" Windows 8 
KeyboardPowerCase
Steel Series Merc Fatal1ty 1000Watt PSU DIY Rig 
  hide details  
Reply
post #14 of 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by ivanlabrie View Post

Either way you do it, a peltier will only get you so far. Adding rads to cool stuff will heat the water cause you'll be using ambient air (which is hotter than your fluid).
Running separate loops like that doesn't seem like a very good idea.
I've seen threads like this popping up and 99% of the time the OPs decided to do someting else cause TEC's are not really viable anymore. They were all the fury back in the pentium 2 era but modern cpus put out much more heat to be really cold under them. frown.gif

You are a bit mistaken, and are maybe thinking about old crappy 60 and 80watt TECs that were used BITD. Modern TECs are much more powerful and efficient, as are modern PSUs. Add in the technology available to even control their duty cycle based on calculated dew points and TECs are making a comeback.

The OP's idea has a few holes in it that will keep it from working properly, but both in line chillers and IHS mounted TEC systems are definitely still viable - I have been running a single direct IHS setup myself 24/7 for months. My PC is never turned off - TECs are silent and have a much smaller footprint then a phase chiller.

In this case, replacing one side of the block with acrylic is a bad idea since it will reduce surface area of the inside of the block, and those TECs are a poor choice for a chiller since they are too weak. Max delta values are measured in optimum environments, and if a weak TEC is overloaded by the heat its trying to dissipate it won't get anywhere near its listed Dt. The 400 watter listed when ran at 12v will use less power and still perform better then 4 of the weak stacked ones.

If I were making a TEC chiller, I would have a machine shop mill me two simple straight channel base plates out of copper that each fit two 62mm TECs side by side, then mill an acrylic top and sandwich the two TECs between it. Run the cold plate side with a single pump and as short as possible with no radiators, and put as much rad as you can fit on the hot side with dual pumps to prevent too much drop from running so many radiators in series. Drill the CPU waterblock to install a temp probe on it, and set up the two TECs on a controller so you don't have them running 100% 24/7 sucking up hundreds of watts for no reason, and you're good to go.

Sure, it won't be cheap, but it will be a nice way to get your CPU to better then water cooling temps for 24/7 use.
Edited by Puck - 3/22/13 at 7:42pm
Behemoth
(25 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
Intel i7 4790K "Relidded" @ 5ghz <50c Asus Sabertooth Z97 MK1 Custom WC'd 7970 3GB @ 1100/1500 stock volts Custom WC'd 7970 3GB @ 1100/1500 stock volts 
RAMHard DriveCoolingCooling
2X4GB Patriot Viper Extreme 1TB Velociraptor 10k RPM w/ 64MB Cache Two Arqtik TEC Chillers in Series Archimedes TEC block w/TN660 TEC 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
Two Ported/tapped MCP655 Pumps 2x Black Ice GTX 480 Gen2 Rads DD dual drive bay Res with LCD water temp monit... GPU Loop: Modded Enzotech Sapphire CPU blocks, ... 
CoolingOSOSMonitor
36x Globe 120mm 80cfm server fans Win 10 Pro Mint 15(KDE) 4K 28" Samsung U590D 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Logitech G710+ Mechanical CM Silent Power M 1000watt Main, OCZ Z850W Slave Custom Mountain Mods Extended-Extended Ascension Logitech G502 Proteus 
Mouse PadAudioAudioAudio
Homemade 16ga 304 Stainless pad, Neoprene backed Aune T1 DAC Various Tubes: Mostly switching from 60's GE "S... AKG K7XX Headphones 
  hide details  
Reply
Behemoth
(25 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
Intel i7 4790K "Relidded" @ 5ghz <50c Asus Sabertooth Z97 MK1 Custom WC'd 7970 3GB @ 1100/1500 stock volts Custom WC'd 7970 3GB @ 1100/1500 stock volts 
RAMHard DriveCoolingCooling
2X4GB Patriot Viper Extreme 1TB Velociraptor 10k RPM w/ 64MB Cache Two Arqtik TEC Chillers in Series Archimedes TEC block w/TN660 TEC 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
Two Ported/tapped MCP655 Pumps 2x Black Ice GTX 480 Gen2 Rads DD dual drive bay Res with LCD water temp monit... GPU Loop: Modded Enzotech Sapphire CPU blocks, ... 
CoolingOSOSMonitor
36x Globe 120mm 80cfm server fans Win 10 Pro Mint 15(KDE) 4K 28" Samsung U590D 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Logitech G710+ Mechanical CM Silent Power M 1000watt Main, OCZ Z850W Slave Custom Mountain Mods Extended-Extended Ascension Logitech G502 Proteus 
Mouse PadAudioAudioAudio
Homemade 16ga 304 Stainless pad, Neoprene backed Aune T1 DAC Various Tubes: Mostly switching from 60's GE "S... AKG K7XX Headphones 
  hide details  
Reply
post #15 of 33
Thread Starter 
=.= nvm, they don't have anywhere near enough watts to be practical XD
The Laboratory
(11 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
AMD FX-8350 Vishera 8-Core 4.0GHz Asus Crosshair V Formula-Z Radeon R9 290X Generic 1333MHz R.A.M. 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
Wester Digital 5400RPM HP CH20L "The Russian Winter" Windows 8 
KeyboardPowerCase
Steel Series Merc Fatal1ty 1000Watt PSU DIY Rig 
  hide details  
Reply
The Laboratory
(11 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
AMD FX-8350 Vishera 8-Core 4.0GHz Asus Crosshair V Formula-Z Radeon R9 290X Generic 1333MHz R.A.M. 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
Wester Digital 5400RPM HP CH20L "The Russian Winter" Windows 8 
KeyboardPowerCase
Steel Series Merc Fatal1ty 1000Watt PSU DIY Rig 
  hide details  
Reply
post #16 of 33
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Puck View Post

You are a bit mistaken, and are maybe thinking about old crappy 60 and 80watt TECs that were used BITD. Modern TECs are much more powerful and efficient, as are modern PSUs. Add in the technology available to even control their duty cycle based on calculated dew points and TECs are making a comeback.

The OP's idea has a few holes in it that will keep it from working properly, but both in line chillers and IHS mounted TEC systems are definitely still viable - I have been running a single direct IHS setup myself 24/7 for months. My PC is never turned off - TECs are silent and have a much smaller footprint then a phase chiller.

In this case, replacing one side of the block with acrylic is a bad idea since it will reduce surface area of the inside of the block, and those TECs are a poor choice for a chiller since they are too weak. Max delta values are measured in optimum environments, and if a weak TEC is overloaded by the heat its trying to dissipate it won't get anywhere near its listed Dt. The 400 watter listed when ran at 12v will use less power and still perform better then 4 of the weak stacked ones.

If I were making a TEC chiller, I would have a machine shop mill me two simple straight channel base plates out of copper that each fit two 62mm TECs side by side, then mill an acrylic top and sandwich the two TECs between it. Run the cold plate side with a single pump and as short as possible with no radiators, and put as much rad as you can fit on the hot side with dual pumps to prevent too much drop from running so many radiators in series. Drill the CPU waterblock to install a temp probe on it, and set up the two TECs on a controller so you don't have them running 100% 24/7 sucking up hundreds of watts for no reason, and you're good to go.

Sure, it won't be cheap, but it will be a nice way to get your CPU to better then water cooling temps for 24/7 use.




^^^ That's the kind of feedback I was hoping for XD

Really with the 400? It's that much better eh? X(
We'll I guess that's what I'll go with then.
The Laboratory
(11 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
AMD FX-8350 Vishera 8-Core 4.0GHz Asus Crosshair V Formula-Z Radeon R9 290X Generic 1333MHz R.A.M. 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
Wester Digital 5400RPM HP CH20L "The Russian Winter" Windows 8 
KeyboardPowerCase
Steel Series Merc Fatal1ty 1000Watt PSU DIY Rig 
  hide details  
Reply
The Laboratory
(11 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
AMD FX-8350 Vishera 8-Core 4.0GHz Asus Crosshair V Formula-Z Radeon R9 290X Generic 1333MHz R.A.M. 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
Wester Digital 5400RPM HP CH20L "The Russian Winter" Windows 8 
KeyboardPowerCase
Steel Series Merc Fatal1ty 1000Watt PSU DIY Rig 
  hide details  
Reply
post #17 of 33
Thanks for clearing that up...It's just that from what I've read so far, people shy away from tecs for modern systems (Sandy/Ivy).
Too much investment for little cooling power compared to a single stage. Most people who want really chilly temps just get a ln2 pot and dice or ln2 and call it a day, and run air or water or whatever for regular use. Phase is nice but noisier and bigger as you say, so yeah, if I already had a water loop I'd give these new tecs a shot. thumb.gif
post #18 of 33
Thread Starter 
Or I could just vent the heat into another dimension, that would probably work best
The Laboratory
(11 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
AMD FX-8350 Vishera 8-Core 4.0GHz Asus Crosshair V Formula-Z Radeon R9 290X Generic 1333MHz R.A.M. 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
Wester Digital 5400RPM HP CH20L "The Russian Winter" Windows 8 
KeyboardPowerCase
Steel Series Merc Fatal1ty 1000Watt PSU DIY Rig 
  hide details  
Reply
The Laboratory
(11 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
AMD FX-8350 Vishera 8-Core 4.0GHz Asus Crosshair V Formula-Z Radeon R9 290X Generic 1333MHz R.A.M. 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
Wester Digital 5400RPM HP CH20L "The Russian Winter" Windows 8 
KeyboardPowerCase
Steel Series Merc Fatal1ty 1000Watt PSU DIY Rig 
  hide details  
Reply
post #19 of 33
Not sure if serious...rolleyes.gif
We were discussing thermodynamics not quantum physics, remember? tongue.gif
post #20 of 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by ivanlabrie View Post

Thanks for clearing that up...It's just that from what I've read so far, people shy away from tecs for modern systems (Sandy/Ivy).
Too much investment for little cooling power compared to a single stage. Most people who want really chilly temps just get a ln2 pot and dice or ln2 and call it a day, and run air or water or whatever for regular use. Phase is nice but noisier and bigger as you say, so yeah, if I already had a water loop I'd give these new tecs a shot. thumb.gif

It is true that they aren't the best bang for buck since a proper setup is expensive, and they are not very efficient as far as watts used vs watts cooled, but they are still feasible.

Just have to be a bit crazy to take the plunge I guess smile.gif. It's a shame Arqtik shut down shop - they had a real trick setup that was reasonably priced that could have brought TEC cooling to a lot more people. The "direct die" blocks like I have just replace the CPU block in a watercooling loop and optionally use a controller to prevent condensation. Solves a lot of problems for a modest daily use TEC rig, and the Quad block was a monster for benchers that can tame even a highly OC'd Ivy Bridge. The tiny single like I have is rated for 130w while maintaining 20* DT to your water temps but it does OK up to ~150 and starts losing its delta @ ~4.7ghz/1.4v on my 3770. Above that the temps quickly start rising until you may as well just have plain water...I have a poor OCer that needs lots of voltage so I can't see if my chip can do 4.8+ since at the voltages it needs it lets off too much heat and starts overloading the single TEC.

At 4.7ghz though it doesn't break 40c when gaming smile.gif
Behemoth
(25 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
Intel i7 4790K "Relidded" @ 5ghz <50c Asus Sabertooth Z97 MK1 Custom WC'd 7970 3GB @ 1100/1500 stock volts Custom WC'd 7970 3GB @ 1100/1500 stock volts 
RAMHard DriveCoolingCooling
2X4GB Patriot Viper Extreme 1TB Velociraptor 10k RPM w/ 64MB Cache Two Arqtik TEC Chillers in Series Archimedes TEC block w/TN660 TEC 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
Two Ported/tapped MCP655 Pumps 2x Black Ice GTX 480 Gen2 Rads DD dual drive bay Res with LCD water temp monit... GPU Loop: Modded Enzotech Sapphire CPU blocks, ... 
CoolingOSOSMonitor
36x Globe 120mm 80cfm server fans Win 10 Pro Mint 15(KDE) 4K 28" Samsung U590D 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Logitech G710+ Mechanical CM Silent Power M 1000watt Main, OCZ Z850W Slave Custom Mountain Mods Extended-Extended Ascension Logitech G502 Proteus 
Mouse PadAudioAudioAudio
Homemade 16ga 304 Stainless pad, Neoprene backed Aune T1 DAC Various Tubes: Mostly switching from 60's GE "S... AKG K7XX Headphones 
  hide details  
Reply
Behemoth
(25 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
Intel i7 4790K "Relidded" @ 5ghz <50c Asus Sabertooth Z97 MK1 Custom WC'd 7970 3GB @ 1100/1500 stock volts Custom WC'd 7970 3GB @ 1100/1500 stock volts 
RAMHard DriveCoolingCooling
2X4GB Patriot Viper Extreme 1TB Velociraptor 10k RPM w/ 64MB Cache Two Arqtik TEC Chillers in Series Archimedes TEC block w/TN660 TEC 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
Two Ported/tapped MCP655 Pumps 2x Black Ice GTX 480 Gen2 Rads DD dual drive bay Res with LCD water temp monit... GPU Loop: Modded Enzotech Sapphire CPU blocks, ... 
CoolingOSOSMonitor
36x Globe 120mm 80cfm server fans Win 10 Pro Mint 15(KDE) 4K 28" Samsung U590D 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Logitech G710+ Mechanical CM Silent Power M 1000watt Main, OCZ Z850W Slave Custom Mountain Mods Extended-Extended Ascension Logitech G502 Proteus 
Mouse PadAudioAudioAudio
Homemade 16ga 304 Stainless pad, Neoprene backed Aune T1 DAC Various Tubes: Mostly switching from 60's GE "S... AKG K7XX Headphones 
  hide details  
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Peltiers / TEC
Overclock.net › Forums › Cooling › Specialized Cooling › Peltiers / TEC › TEC Liquid Chiller suggestions.