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[THG] Challenging FPS: Testing SLI And CrossFire Using Video Capture - Page 4

post #31 of 86
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artikbot View Post

Same here, but from the other party.

I cannot stress how terrible was the 8800GT SLI. Most of the games had terrible screen tearing. Others scaled like crap. But overall, most of them flat out refused to work.

I swear I'm never getting a dual GPU card solution from any of the parties, before extensively testing beforehand.

That's how I've been for a few months now. Been debating on getting another 660 ti or just waiting for next gen, selling my current and going another single card. Really, really don't want to deal with dual card issues.
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post #32 of 86
Quote:
Originally Posted by dealio View Post



some of us do know that, all else being equal, that feel when no SLI/CF is smoother

Thought UNOE said it pretty well Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Quote:
Originally Posted by UNOE View Post

I don't think everyone commenting understands what this article is pointing out. Its saying the middle frames are pretty much useless. Look at this pic or the video in OP at 18:14 the middle frame is useless. People are not taking this frame latency measuring to far this is telling the story I have witnessed all year for the most part my thee 7970's work better with crossfire disabled a majority of the time.

Why measure frame rates? if the middle frame rate is a small sliver that you can't see anyway. So look at the pink frame below. Can you even see that frame at first glance? It means nothing to me if I can't see the frame.


If you want to choice what GPU's you want to buy based upon frame rate then your making a huge mistake. They might as well give you three frames as slivers taking up 1% of the screen just to make you happy and feel like you have more FPS. The truth is out this is the kind of things I been experiencing and have known something wasn't right all along. Two 570's I owned previously felt much smoother for games that use less than 1.5gb of Vram at 120hz. But I can never understand why when I had 30% to 200% more FPS.

Open that screen in a new window. you can see that little Pink slither...that's a "frame" lol
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post #33 of 86
I have no idea how I posted. Delete.
     
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post #34 of 86
Quote:
Originally Posted by almighty15 View Post

I would like to a see a graph showing the amount of people that can actually see the difference, because I can't.

Read the anandtech article from yesterday, they have well written section on just this.

It will always be difficult to make subjective analysis into objective data. That is the difficulty with the direction many review sites have taken. And though some have taken steps to try and rationalize it, it will be almost impossible to come to any sort of consensus between reviewers. That is why we have been stuck with inaccurate/misleading data for both teams.

Nvidia and amd both dislike fraps and other fps/latency recorders because there are inherent issues that are hard to explain and show to the consumer. Hence why nvidia gave TR their own program.
     
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post #35 of 86
So this means CFX does not get as much fps as its reporting. AMD is working on this to bring the drivers out that fix is problem. More performance i never had for 2x HD 7970.
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post #36 of 86
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZealotKi11er View Post

So this means CFX does not get as much fps as its reporting. AMD is working on this to bring the drivers out that fix is problem. More performance i never had for 2x HD 7970.

It depends really. I urge people to read the CFx section in the anandtech article, it fleshes this out very well. In short, amd is using latency shortening in cfx to keep frames as smooth as they can, hence why you see the huge blobs with cfx latency graphs. This is done on purpose as they believe this is the best way ATM to reduce micro-stuttering. The other side of the, frame time, is not being focused on (the time between actual frame display). A future driver will incorporate a slider that will adjust between these two variables.
     
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post #37 of 86
I could believe it. When I tested out a friends single 7970 I noticed a lot of skipping and stuttering even as a single card, something I would not have expected from a high end GPU. It almost made me switch to nvidia. I ended up getting the MYST and it's a lot better than the 7970 in terms of quality of frames. Maybe 13.3 beta 3 helps a bit too. Either way I would like to see some old catalyst drivers run to find out if that extra 10% of performance in their never settle drivers came from a lower quality of frame. If so, that is quite the dirty trick IMO
post #38 of 86
Quote:
Originally Posted by 8800GT View Post

I could believe it. When I tested out a friends single 7970 I noticed a lot of skipping and stuttering even as a single card, something I would not have expected from a high end GPU. It almost made me switch to nvidia. I ended up getting the MYST and it's a lot better than the 7970 in terms of quality of frames. Maybe 13.3 beta 3 helps a bit too. Either way I would like to see some old catalyst drivers run to find out if that extra 10% of performance in their never settle drivers came from a lower quality of frame. If so, that is quite the dirty trick IMO

the testing done on other sites seem to indicate the 7970 and 680 both deliver latency free smooth playing experiences; as the driver fixes for the radeon seem to have nuked their frame rate variance in single card setups. so your experience might be caused by any number of factors from the system the card was installed on to a faulty driver...

Glad to hear your myst.ed 7870 works properly. though had i seen what you saw at your friends place i probably wouldn't have got a radeon.

it seems vsync fixes a lot of the radeon xfire issues in these very same tests. something to look into for future tom's testing.
 
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post #39 of 86
Quote:
Originally Posted by lacrossewacker View Post

There's plenty of people here that've had both Crossfire and SLI and it seems for the most part, they say it just "feels" smoother on SLI

Yes and I'm one of them and there's no difference....
post #40 of 86
We still arguing over latency and stuttering not meaning anything? Have you guys NOT read up on all the articles that mention this? Though I guess most of them don't get into it, so read this (read the comments):

http://blogs.valvesoftware.com/linux/faster-zombies/

Read why latency is an issue, if this stuttering is a symptom of latency than all of this matters. Maybe not today, the latency might be within reason to have current games play well. The problem, especially with SLI, is later down the road (for those that plan ahead). That latency is a performance hit, no matter where it's coming from in the driver stack. Maybe fixing it could helps with vsync, or more, if they can get these latency issues smoothed out it helps everyone. EVERYONE. Even single card performance.

This is why I am going to stick with my original affirmation, Nvidia beats AMD in drivers and software. It will be a while yet before they are as good, they might release drivers that are close to being on par now. The thing is, Nvidia was aware of it. Why do you suppose that is? They just randomly happened upon this and went "oh gee, we should fix this". Not really, they have a better dev team (should say, they have dev teams with more specialties) which probably means they use more extensive methods to dev test their stuff. Even one of the TR articles goes into how the dev software can be used to better determine where latency is, when it is happening, ect...

http://www.overclock.net/t/1375220/anand-amd-comments-on-gpu-stuttering-offers-driver-roadmap-perspective-on-benchmarking

So, yeah, Nvidia is still the better team. Hopefully things like this cause AMD to re-design how they go about their dev process. It makes you wonder, if latency is so tight on Nvidia what would they do with AMDs hardware? I'm sure if AMD fixed everything and we did benchmarks, we might see the 7950 easily go blow to blow and probably overtaking the 670 (they go blow to blow now, just not easily and IMO the 670 still wins overall). That's just it, not only is Nvidia good at making hardware but they are good at making products that beats out other products. They have been in this game longer than AMD, I expect this still. This is the first gen that I've seen AMD make that has actually been on par with Nvidia over all. Next year should be a bit better, should.

I have a feeling Nvidia isn't exactly going out all stops here, they still have some beastly cards that are designed for workstation use only and they have decided to push both series in their specific directions.
The Titan was the first commercial product we saw for desktops based off their workstation chips, who knows what we will see if they start doing more heavy development work instead of refining the current processes. They did poop out the Fermi cards, I have faith they can poop out another great product. I also have faith AMD is now learning the game, so don't take this as a "nvidia will trump amd" statement. Take this as serious competition is going to come out more and more, with both companies having to make changes and do new things. It's just unfortunate for AMD, they have more on their plate than Nvidia currently does with a smaller net share. Even if they have a larger team, Nvidia has more money to drop into R&D. They also have less fields to specialize in, it's an edge for them.
Edited by mushroomboy - 3/29/13 at 12:10am
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