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[xbitlabs] AMD: We Are On Track With Steamroller Micro-Architecture in 2013. - Page 19  

post #181 of 718
Quote:
Originally Posted by malmental View Post

no problems @ 22nm...! they have always had issues at every process.. headscratch.gif
bet money..?!

GF's 28nm is not even producing yet(which means they are lagging a year+ behind TSMC, which is significantly behind Intel), their next die-shrink from 28nm is 20nm and by the time that gets producing AMD CPU(AMD have always had issues with the quality/yield ofGF dieshrink process) on that process,Intel would be well on its way to 10nm.


AMD is lagging so far behind in Fab tech that Intel only needed about 70% of an Ivy Bridge Die(the IGPU takes about 30% space), or about 112 mm^2 out of a 160mm^2 die to place enough CPU transistors to match/beat FX-8350 built on a 315mm^2 die, it doesn't take a math genius to figure out that Intel's per chip production cost is far below that of AMD after the fab have been paid off by Intel's massive 60% margins.
Edited by sherlock - 4/1/13 at 1:40pm
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post #182 of 718
Quote:
Originally Posted by sherlock View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by malmental View Post

no problems @ 22nm...! they have always had issues at every process.. headscratch.gif
bet money..?!

GF's 28nm is not even producing yet(which means they are lagging a year+ behind TSMC, which is significantly behind Intel), their next die-shrink from 28nm is 20nm and by the time that gets producing Intel would be well on its way to 10nm.
teaching.gif speak it 'sherlock'...
post #183 of 718
Quote:
Originally Posted by malmental View Post

my point is really not surpassing nor matching Intel, always behind.
I agree Vishera a tweak os Zambezi but you missed the sarcasm with the 'wink'... as do you think FX-Bulldozer was much of an improvement
over Deneb C3 or Thuban E0..?

i do remember that Bulldozer was a let down in single threaded compared to Deneb and Thuban.

but it was almost as good as intel 1000 dollar core i7 965...(according to anandtech's bench)
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post #184 of 718
Quote:
Originally Posted by 47 Knucklehead View Post

True, but then again, AMD stated late last year they aren't interested in trying to beat Intel in that game anymore.
Advanced Micro Devices Inc. Chief Executive Officer Rory Read, May 15 2012

but didn't amd release a statement denying that was ever true?

uh i guess not lol tl;dr ftw thumb.gif
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post #185 of 718
Quote:
Originally Posted by 47 Knucklehead View Post

True, but then again, AMD stated late last year they aren't interested in trying to beat Intel in that game anymore.
Advanced Micro Devices Inc. Chief Executive Officer Rory Read, May 15 2012

Key word: on every laptop
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post #186 of 718
Quote:
Originally Posted by kzone75 View Post

But really lousy overclocking..

Nehalem chips actually OC much better than Piledriver ones. It's not about the pure frequency, it's about the percentage of the increase.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sherlock View Post

GF's 28nm is not even producing yet(which means they are lagging a year+ behind TSMC, which is significantly behind Intel), their next die-shrink from 28nm is 20nm and by the time that gets producing AMD CPU(AMD have always had issues with the quality/yield ofGF dieshrink process) on that process,Intel would be well on its way to 10nm.


AMD is lagging so far behind in Fab tech that Intel only needed 2/3 of an Ivy Bridge Die(the IGPU takes 1/3 space), or about 107 mm^2 out of 160mm^2 to place enough CPU transistors to match/beat FX-8350 built on a 315mm^2 die, it doesn't take a math genius to figure out that Intel's per chip production cost is far below that of AMD's per die after the fab have been paid off by Intel's massive 60% margins.

This is what some people seem to miss, AMD is not really close to catching up to intel... If push comes to shove intel can just slap a pair of cores to their mainstream designs and enthusiast designs, after a gen or two if they haven't upped the core count they can slap a few more cores on the dies...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Master__Shake View Post

i do remember that Bulldozer was a let down in single threaded compared to Deneb and Thuban.

but it was almost as good as intel 1000 dollar core i7 965...(according to anandtech's bench)

965 is launch day nehalem... Came out 3 years before BD. And when overclocked the 965 is slower than D0 920s/930s/950s etc.
 
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post #187 of 718
Quote:
Originally Posted by sugarhell View Post

Key word: on every laptop

He wasn't talking about just laptops. He was talking about processors in general.

He went on to further say ...
Quote:
Computing is increasingly moving to the cloud -- data centers that supply services over the Internet -- creating a need for chips that are tuned for displaying video and other media and don’t need to crunch large amounts of information, Read said. It’s shifting the competition to a race for chips that contain multiple functions, exactly where phone-chip makers excel, he said.

Qualcomm, Nvidia Corp. (NVDA) (NVDA) and other makers of chips based on ARM Holdings Plc (ARM) technology will gain an entry into the PC market later this year when Microsoft Corp.’s Windows 8 debuts in versions capable of working on the type of chip which dominates the mobile-phone industry.

Shares of Sunnyvale, California-based AMD fell 2.2 percent to $6.60 at the close in New York. The stock has gained 22 percent in 2012, after two straight years of declines.

Introducing Trinity

For now, Read is touting the company’s new line of chips, called Trinity, whose designs predate his tenure at the company. The former International Business Machines Corp. and Lenovo Group Ltd. (992) executive took over as AMD’s chief executive in August after a seven-month search to replace his ousted predecessor Dirk Meyer.

Trinity is one of the first steps in AMD’s attempts to produce processors that combine multiple functions rather than an emphasis on speed. Almost half of Trinity is devoted to graphics processing, something Read said will be important in displaying and enhancing processing work done elsewhere, in cloud computing.

The new chip design also has one model that uses less than half the power of current processors, making it better suited for the thinnest and lightest laptops. That will give AMD-based notebooks the ability to go all day on a single battery charge. Trinity will also have 70 percent better graphics performance that comparable Intel chips, AMD said.

Steal the Bacon

Delivering Trinity will also help AMD (AMD) (AMD) prove to suppliers that it’s becoming more reliable. It won’t suffer from the supply shortages that held back sales of its predecessor, Read said. In addition, AMD’s pricing means that computer makers will be able to produce thin and light machines that are cheaper than the Ultrabooks being pushed by Intel, he said.

“I think we come in and steal the bacon around the whole thin-and-light movement and capture a significant portion of the opportunity there,” he said.

Read is trying to turn around a company that’s struggled against its larger rival ever since it was founded a year after Intel in 1969. AMD has reported five annual profits in the last 10 years, with losses dwarfing net (AMD) income over that period.

To change that, Read said he’s implementing a greater use of statistics and measurements in AMD operations and demanding employees take personal responsibility for mistakes. His strategy of differentiating AMD’s products from those made by Intel, which has more than 80 percent of the market for PC processors, will fully manifest in 2015, he said.

“It can be a very different AMD going forward, but we have a long way to go,” he said. “There’s been a passion for innovation but there needs to be a passion for delivery and a passion for the customers.”

Edited by 47 Knucklehead - 4/1/13 at 1:45pm
post #188 of 718
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alatar View Post

965 is launch day nehalem... Came out 3 years before BD. And when overclocked the 965 is slower than D0 920s/930s/950s etc.

IIRC, back in the C0 days the Phenom II 940 shortly held the 3DMark crown, above the Nehalems.

That did change when Intel fixed the i7s and brought the D0s though...


@Knucklehead: Seems like Read's main focus is customer support and business image. Something they quite lost during the past years, with a less than stellar Phenom advertising, and we know the whole Zambezi fiasco.
Edited by Artikbot - 4/1/13 at 1:55pm
   
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post #189 of 718
Quote:
increasing IPC by 30% means that a good portion of the Intel IPC/Single Core Speed advantage is gone. (In regards to IB, Haswell will be more improvements on top of that)

Except it won't be. The decode change will be most of it and that will primarily benefit multi-threaded scenarios (Basically they are eliminating a bottleneck when two threads are active on a single module). Single core speed won't go up 30%.
Quote:
This is what some people seem to miss, AMD is not really close to catching up to intel... If push comes to shove intel can just slap a pair of cores to their mainstream designs and enthusiast designs, after a gen or two if they haven't upped the core count they can slap a few more cores on the dies...

This. Intel could sell 6 cores at the same price they sell the mainstream i7 3770k's and still make a profit, though not as much. Right now they are making bank because AMD can't compete. If they even started coming close they could just drop the price of the high end stuff and put AMD back to where they were.
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post #190 of 718
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artikbot View Post

IIRC, back in the C0 days the Phenom II 940 shortly held the 3DMark crown, above the Nehalems.

That did change when Intel fixed the i7s and brought the D0s though...


@Knucklehead: Seems like Read's main focus is customer support and business image. Something they quite lost during the past years, with a less than stellar Phenom advertising, and we know the whole Zambezi fiasco.

Yes they did hold the 3dmark crowns since they OC'd phenomenally on LN2

Funny looking back at days when you could get a 3dmark WR with air cooled cards...
Edited by Alatar - 4/1/13 at 2:02pm
 
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[250GB 840EVO +2x SpinpointF3 1TB RAID0] [LD PC-V2 SS Phase Change] [XSPC X2O 750 pump/res] [Monsta 360 full copper + EK XT 360 + XT 240] 
MonitorPowerCaseAudio
[Crossover 27Q LED-P 1440p+ASUS 1200p+LG 1080p] [Corsair AX1200] [Dimastech Easy v3.0] [Sennheiser HD558s] 
CPUCPUMotherboardGraphics
FX 8320, FX 8350, Phenom II x2 555BE i7 3930K, i7 860, i7 4770K, 68x Celeron D CVF, commando, 2x RIVE, Z87X-OC Asus 4870x2, Sapphire 4870 
GraphicsGraphicsGraphicsGraphics
2x 5870, 5850, 5830, 5770 2x 3870x2, 3870 GTX Titan, GTX 480, GTX 590 GTX 285, GTX 260, 4x 9800GT, 8800GTX 
RAMHard DriveCoolingCooling
4x4GB vengeance, 2x4GB predatorX, 2x1GB OCZ DDR2 Intel X25-M 80GB LD PC-V2 SS Phase Change OCN Marksman 
CoolingCoolingOSPower
2x old tek slims (GPU) Various watercooling stuff win7, winxp AX1200 
Case
test bench / cardboard box 
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Overclock.net › Forums › Industry News › Hardware News › [xbitlabs] AMD: We Are On Track With Steamroller Micro-Architecture in 2013.