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[xbitlabs] AMD: We Are On Track With Steamroller Micro-Architecture in 2013. - Page 55  

post #541 of 718
Quote:
Originally Posted by looniam View Post

edit: oh yeah, how is the PCI 3.0 working out on those . .oh nevermind . . .

How are those x16/x16 and x8/x8/x8/x8 boards working out? . .oh nevermind . . .

PCI-e 3.0 is useless when we have twice as many lanes anyway. tongue.gif
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post #542 of 718
Quote:
Originally Posted by computerparts View Post

A Z77 Sabertooth is the Intel equivalent of a 990FXA Sabertooth. Sabertooth is the model of the board. It's not a brand name lol. Brand name would be the manufacturer ie: Asus. But thank you for pointing out your lack of education. I suggest you spend more time doing your homework than trolling the forums.
my lack of education?
ah sabertooth is a brand name, the Z77 chipset is the same exact board as the Z77-v pro except with the tuff armour. go compare it yourself. you obviously are not familiar with branding - ti also includes models.
Quote:
Brand, a name, logo, slogan, and/or design scheme associated with a product or service

btw, since i am a nice guy:
BIOSTAR TA990FXE $129.99
BIOSTAR TZ77XE3 $124.99
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post #543 of 718
Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

How are those x16/x16 and x8/x8/x8/x8 boards working out? . .oh nevermind . . .

PCI-e 3.0 is useless when we have twice as many lanes anyway. tongue.gif

oh so a x16/x16x/16/x16 PCI 2.0 is greater than x8/x8/x8/x8 PCI 3.0?

interesting . . .

edit: you do know that PCI 3.0 is twice as fast as PCI 2.0 right? i mean never having it may affect your knowledge . .
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post #544 of 718
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdlvx View Post

I don't want to be that guy, but read the last few pages of the thread. You may learn something about how Blizzard compiled code is crippled on AMD hardware and it's not representative of its full performance.

As far as I am concerned, the only benchmarks that are a true and even test of raw CPU performance are ones where the tester compiles it themselves so they're aware of of the compiler optimizations done and that the source is available and the tester is capable of understanding it.

People are learning that if one product is running x87 code when it doesn't even have the x87 part of the CPU and the other is using SSE natively in an application, that a benchmark of that application is meangingless.

I could *easily* go into Linux, compile Blender on an Intel to not even use SSE, let alone AVX, SSE versions > 1, etc and then bench it against Piledriver with AVX, SSE, FMA, etc.

Does that seem fair to you? Because that's basically what Anandtech Bench is. Although SYSMARK is an exception, because Intel basically owns BAPCO.

So really, is it much of a surprise that 3570k is winning "80%" of the time like you claim?

If you want to prove that 3570k is superior to FX 8350, you need to prove that all of those benchmarks are using fair instruction sets on both platforms. Otherwise all you're doing is proving that a specific piece of software is faster on a specific piece of hardware. You're basically testing a small sample size that you have no idea how it works, and then saying that every piece of software in the entire world will behave the same.
What's the point when most applications I use favor Intel? This is not about Intel vs AMD. This is about choosing the best deal for me.
Quote:
The reasons why AMD guys don't trust Anandtech is that they've been knowingly using benchmarks that are compiled or programmed in a way that more efficiently uses Intel's CPUs resources than AMD's.

Many review sites benched 8350. The verdict is mostly the same, i5 is superior.

http://www.behardware.com/articles/880-1/amd-fx-8350-review-is-amd-back.html
http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/2012/11/06/amd-fx-8350-review/1
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu/display/fx-8350-8320-6300-4300.html
http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/amd_fx_8350_processor_review,1.html

I'm sure you can find another 20 sites that say literally the same thing.
Quote:
I don't think you "lol look at the graphs!!! THIS ONE IS BETTER BETTER GRAPHS LOL!!!" understand that I could compile benchmarks my own way and make FX 8350 humiliate 3570k. Most benchmarks don't have anything to do with raw performance and more to do with the compiler. Hell, I'd bet I could "deoptimize" a 3930k to lose to an FX 8320 if I had to.

Okay, point taken, but what application does this have in everyday use? For people like me, my mom, my sister, my grandma, my classmates, people who play league of legends, my co-workers who only use office software, etc? i5-2570k offers me much more than FX 8350, and the same can be said for many, if not most people.
Quote:
I showed you before the extreme example with CRAY and I've given you my anecdote about how the same margin of improvement applies to Blender as well. Then I linked you to FX 8350 and 3770k Blender benchmark and let you extrapolate. What was I showing you? That software optimizations can make something twice as fast. When you sit here and call something absolutely superior because it's 10% faster in some benchmarks, you look like you're completely inept and you have no idea what's actually being tested. Only that you go "ohh me get big bar graph bigger better SYSMARK and Starcraft 2 are like every other piece of software created and compiled with the only compiler in the world!!!!!!"

You're absolutely right, but most of the programs I run favor Intel. I'm willing to be that most people only run programs that favor Intel, which is why I favor i5 2570K over an FX 8350. I don't understand what you're trying to explain to me. I know that Intel compilers favor Intel, and that programs can be written in other compilers, in other languages, in other ways to favor AMD over Intel. I never denied that, but for me and most other people who will build a computer, an i5 3570K is the better deal.
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post #545 of 718
Quote:
Originally Posted by HanSomPa View Post

You're absolutely right, but most of the programs I run favor Intel. I'm willing to be that most people only run programs that favor Intel, which is why I favor i5 2570K over an FX 8350. I don't understand what you're trying to explain to me. I know that Intel compilers favor Intel, and that programs can be written in other compilers, in other languages, in other ways to favor AMD over Intel. I never denied that, but for me and most other people who will build a computer, an i5 3570K is the better deal.

the problem is, it's not fundamentally about logic. it's about principle/religion/voo-doo. if you're smart you will never look at this thread again, heh
post #546 of 718
Quote:
Originally Posted by perfectblade View Post

the problem is, it's not fundamentally about logic. it's about principle/religion/voo-doo. if you're smart you will never look at this thread again, heh

Lol, I know. I'm kinda sick and tired of seeing this argument over and over again. I'm not promoting any ideology or product, bur people reply to me like I am. I mean it's pretty simple to grasp that for all "normal" intents and purposes, i5 3570K is the better deal, but hey I better shut up and hope nobody jumps on me.
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post #547 of 718
Quote:
Originally Posted by looniam View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

How are those x16/x16 and x8/x8/x8/x8 boards working out? . .oh nevermind . . .

PCI-e 3.0 is useless when we have twice as many lanes anyway. tongue.gif

oh so a x16/x16x/16/x16 PCI 2.0 is greater than x8/x8/x8/x8 PCI 3.0?

interesting . . .

edit: you do know that PCI 3.0 is twice as fast as PCI 2.0 right? i mean never having it may affect your knowledge . .

Right. and 1155 only comes with X16 or x8/x8 3.0.

AMD comes with x16/x16 or x8/x8/x8/x8 2.0.

See how that works?
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post #548 of 718
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryude View Post

Anti-competitive practices hurt everyone, not just AMD fans. Intel owners need to realize this and complain about it. If not, we will be stuck at the same performance for the next 5-10 years and paying higher prices each year.


I agree, I've advocated this for a while. I simply bought an intel this time around because I really needed the lower TDP and better performance. Most people don't but will buy what is marketed best.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sherlock View Post

Or mainly a Mix of PowerPC & Xeon According to Top500 which tracks he 500 most powerful (non-distributed) computer systems in the world.

In the Top10, we have 1 Opteron(Titan), 3 Xeon ,1 Fujitsu & rest are IBM chips.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Top500


Yeah, I wish IBM would just buy AMD already. IBM knows how to make a CPU arch... They've been successful at it for a long time. They certainly have the R and D budget.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SCollins View Post

no, it would still take 300+ years per cpu to even out.

Um read my post. When you have to keep an AMD cooler because of higher power draw and TDP it costs more.
Quote:
Originally Posted by maarten12100 View Post

well if you need twice the power for the same peformance cooling it with huge AC units it is gonna cost you a lot in terms of cooling equipment, a capable building, power bill.

What do you think the point of oil submerged servers was in the first place if you think it was lower temps you are only partly correct the main was more efficient cooling with the energy stored in a liquid which you can simply guide to a radiator outside. (a 1Kw pump system vs a 20Kw AC system seems like a pretty solid solution)

That's kind of what I was pointing to and bean counters know this and take it into account.
 
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post #549 of 718
As a settlement to this thread:

Steamroller's quad module advantage: Crysis 3, BF4, and other highly threaded tasks. If the tasks also support HSA, then Kaveri may have an advantage over many or all only-CPU solutions, as a CPU will have difficulty competing against GPUs in highly paralleled tasks. Try running a software render mode on a CPU.

Intel's hexacore solution may match or overcome Steamroller's advantage, but Intel is most likely not going to price the hexacores at AMD's price range.


Intel's quad core advantage: Skyrim, Starcraft 2, Planetside 2 and other semi-threaded or highly CPU-dependent tasks. Since Haswell's CPU+GPU combo is not as integrated or advanced as AMD's combo, it will most likely not benefit much from GPU accelerations compared to Kaveri, especially if the GPU acceleration was built for a HSA-compatible architecture.
post #550 of 718
Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

Right. and 1155 only comes with X16 or x8/x8 3.0.

AMD comes with x16/x16 or x8/x8/x8/x8 2.0.

See how that works?

does it?
lets see:
GIGABYTE GA-990FXA-UD3 $139.99
PCI Express 2.0 x16 4 (x16, x16, x4, x4)

GIGABYTE GA-Z77X-UD3H $139.99
PCI Express 3.0 x16 2 (x16, x8)
PCI Express 2.0 x16 1 @x4

oh yeah! that extra x4 slot makes all the difference! so how is that quad-fire working out for you? or even that tri- fire?
rolleyes.gif
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