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[theinquirer] AMD claims 20nm transition signals the end of Moore's Law - Page 2

post #11 of 50
I just read the entire article and it's simple enough to understand.
It's the end of "Moore's Law." Nothing more, nothing less.
Processors will continue to shrink.
The process goes on.
Only the Law dies. The Law has become ludicrous.
It just doesn't apply any longer. It's been rendered moot.
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post #12 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrAlex View Post

That article isn't so good, since the transistors themselves are still 20nm.

http://semiaccurate.com/2013/04/02/arm-and-tsmc-tape-out-20nm-finfet-coretex-a57-cpu/#.UVswfxykoxg

Oh thanks for clarifying, why were they claiming 16nm then?

I just found out about this, and haven't looked into it further.
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post #13 of 50
Thread Starter 
AMD was not in good position and Intel was one of those factors involving illegal rebates, bribery and threats at OEM's and shops...

AMD now has three mainstream console's the Wii U, Xbox 720 and PlayStation 4... AMD's revenue from fourth quarter involving Xbox 720 and PlayStation 4 will be at least 283M$ and that is not an optimistic estimation at all so AMD's revenue in 2014 will be a bit 1B$ so profit would be above 220M$ and that is enough to pay of its staff/employees. This estimation only includes Xbox 720 and PlayStation 4 revenue, if we include Wii U then AMD's profit would be then above 260M$...

That's just estimation from several sites, now we should look at tablet's and tablet/laptop hybrids. AMD has Temash, a powerful APU that consumes less than 5-17watts depending on a model and its specifications. AMD will survive and pushing to a smaller and smaller and smaller nm introduces more and more problems and more and more expenses at R&D and that will hurt Intel since they will need to solve problem with 14nm...

Broadwell is 14nm and Intel did not confirm that it will be LGA nor BGA, but since 14nm introduces various problems that can't be easily solved BGA is only solution to reduce power leakage and smaller chances that it burns out or what ever problems below 20nm introduces.
post #14 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2010rig View Post

I understood it, I read the article a few times, and also saw this part.
I also made another discovery while on that site, TSMC tapes out ARM Cortex A57 using 16nm FinFET transistors
http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/2258650/tsmc-tapes-out-arm-cortex-a57-using-16nm-finfet-transistors

So it's not just a fab issue it seems.

Agreed with everything, but I believe they are talking about the main thing that is the real world performance outcome from that extremely tiny fabricated chips. Will that chip really have been improving performance as a rate with same as some older chips were improving than their predecessor. ?

Well... whatever they were talking about I just know power consumption at least will obviously reduce smile.gif And that matters.
Edited by sumitlian - 4/2/13 at 12:34pm
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post #15 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by vampirr View Post


That's just estimation from several sites, now we should look at tablet's and tablet/laptop hybrids. AMD has Temash, a powerful APU that consumes less than 5-17watts depending on a model and its specifications. AMD will survive and pushing to a smaller and smaller and smaller nm introduces more and more problems and more and more expenses at R&D and that will hurt Intel since they will need to solve problem with 14nm...

Broadwell is 14nm and Intel did not confirm that it will be LGA nor BGA, but since 14nm introduces various problems that can't be easily solved BGA is only solution to reduce power leakage and smaller chances that it burns out or what ever problems below 20nm introduces.




Except you didn't see this article: Intel Changes Plans: Set to Continue with Upgradeable LGA Platforms Even with Skylake Chips
Quote:
Intel will retain LGA packaging for 95% of desktop central processing units
5% BGA desktop, big deal as I am sure all the Celeron/Pentium owners really want LGA.

Not to mention since the AMD/GF split AMD always had issues with GF. It is highly likely that AMD/GF have more trouble with their 28nm process than Intel have with their 14nm.

Currently Intel is 1 node ahead(soon to be 1.5 node ahead with 14nm vs 28nm), and that allows them to match FX-8350( 315mm^2)'s CPU performance with a 160mm^2 die(3770K) that only have about 110mm^2 dedicated to CPU transistors, It is very clear which side have the authority on fabrication technology.
Edited by sherlock - 4/2/13 at 12:40pm
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post #16 of 50
I don't think we would have seen much innovation over the last 1,000 years if everyone followed the laws to a tee... :/
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post #17 of 50
Just my 2 cents for what it's worth. By the way I have a 2500k, a Phenom II, and an Athlon II so no fanboy talk accusations smile.gif.

I just find it a bit silly that someone on here with zero chip fabrication experience is challenging a company that is world-known for their fabrication. Even if earnings are down that does not change the fact that they have been doing this for a long time. How many chips have you built? To me this is comparable as claiming that you can beat an NBA benchwarmer in a game. First or not AMD deserves a level of respect for their knowledge and experience.
post #18 of 50
Who cares about Moore's Law? I has lasted 48 years ... which is 4 years longer than AMD has been in business. CPU's are getting smaller and faster .. PERIOD. If something has to be adjusted in CPU power over time ratios after HALF A CENTURY, then so be it.
post #19 of 50
well if soooo many people think AMD is "doing it wrong" im sure they'd love to invite you on out for an afternoon of "tell us how to do it better"...
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post #20 of 50
GlobalFoundries 20nm process and beyond.

http://www.brightsideofnews.com/news/2012/6/19/globalfoundries-readies-the-20nm-process-node.aspx

The gains GlobalFoundries are going to get from 20nm will probably be relative to what TSMC are going to get.

TSMC is starting 20nm early.

http://focustaiwan.tw/news/atod/201304010042.aspx
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