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2500k 4.8ghz daily use - Page 3

post #21 of 83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FEAST View Post

Lol, he is running his 25ook at nearly the same voltage I run my Ivy Bridge 3770.

That voltage is fine - however no one here seems to be commenting on what an OC failure this is.

" vcore load 1.344
vcore idle 1.368"

^ BAHAHAHAHAHA. Why is your vcore lower at load than it is at idle?! You need more (in general) vcore during load to maintain stability. In this case you need less at idle. Lower your vcore, then crank your LLC to ultra/extreme so that you get a result like this:

vcore load 1.344
vcore idle 1.310

Then maybe even move into using offset voltage so you get something like this:

vcore load 1.344
vcore idle 1.100

I'm trying to not use high llc because as far as i know this will help you only under load and you may get bsod in idle . when i tweaked the voltage i tried to set a weaker llc and always used as reference the under-load voltage because using a weaker llc will give maybe a little bit more than enough voltage to run stable in idle and when comes from a high to low load , since the load is the lowest in idle then cpu doesnt stress much and temps are normal . i think is bad for cpu to use a high voltage and llc at full power because llc just pump up the vcore when cpu is under stress so vdroop is reduced . so basically if you set a 1.4vcore , under load the llc will pump it to 1.41 or even higher .
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post #22 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyph3r View Post

Your post, my friend, was in fact the real "fail".

Please Google "vdroop" and enjoy the knowledge smile.gif. There is nothing wrong with his load vcore being slightly lower than the idle vcore.

I'd bet around 95% of OCN experience this and a lot of people dislike the highest levels of LLC as
1. It puts extra stress on the motherboard for no real gain.
2. It puts the vcore higher than what is set, its safer for the vcore to go lower than what you set instead of higher as atleast then you know youre setting a maximum rather than a ballpark figure.
3. The CPU will experience quite high vcore spikes at the highest levels of LLC. I know I don't want big vcore spikes.

So don't call him out for something that isn't even an issue.

1. The "Gain" is real. Having your processor idle at a lower voltage means that it will last longer, and stay cooler. Sounds like real gain to me.
2. You can easily track what your vcore jumps to at 100% load and set you voltage accordingly...this is essentially a non issue. He could at least set it so that he isn't dropping voltage so that he could squeeze a higher multi out of the chip - at not cost to voltage.
3. Vcore spikes? Last time I checked, that's what high levels of LLC are SUPPOSED to do - to compensate for vdroop. This is what enables you too keep your idle voltage low. Then the cpu will spike to the desired voltage when under load.
Quote:
Originally Posted by francisw19 View Post

High/Extreme LLC puts a lot more stress on the VRMs. Given that the OP is concerned about the life-span of his CPU, I'd think the same applies to his motherboard. wink.gif

Unless his offset voltage is absurdly high, there is no reason to jack the LLC, IMO. smile.gif

The life span of a cpu is far more fragile than that of a VRM. By increasing his LLC he will be lowering his chip voltage significantly...thus increasing the life of his CPU - which as you stated he is concerned about. Please refer me to the part where he said VRM lifespan was a priority.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dragoss91 View Post

I'm trying to not use high llc because as far as i know this will help you only under load and you may get bsod in idle . when i tweaked the voltage i tried to set a weaker llc and always used as reference the under-load voltage because using a weaker llc will give maybe a little bit more than enough voltage to run stable in idle and when comes from a high to low load , since the load is the lowest in idle then cpu doesnt stress much and temps are normal . i think is bad for cpu to use a high voltage and llc at full power because llc just pump up the vcore when cpu is under stress so vdroop is reduced . so basically if you set a 1.4vcore , under load the llc will pump it to 1.41 or even higher .

You will only BSOD in idle if your voltage is too low. I'm not sure what you mean by "only help you under load" because it helps reduce voltage and thus temps during idle - by allowing the voltage to jump during load. Also, you don't have to worry about your idle voltage being too low at the moment - because it is WAYYYYYYYYYY too high. Which is why I am recommending offset voltage and a high LLC. You don't actually have to use a high LLC - depending on how you set your offset voltage.

"so basically if you set a 1.4vcore , under load the llc will pump it to 1.41 or even higher"

Which is why you set your vcore to 1.39 or lower...really, this is not that complicated. Some of the arguments you make are fine - if you are using offset voltage. However it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever to have an idle voltage higher than a load voltage - from the standpoint of processor life, heat, and attaining the fastest multiplier possible.

I'm the one pointing this out - setting a better LLC and using offset will help you. But whatever. It's your chip you can do whatever you want with it.
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post #23 of 83
GB's Gen.1 LLC has only 2 settings apparently
Either on or off, AFAIK while it's ON my voltage is actually lower than set but it stays there, doesn't budge under load
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post #24 of 83
Thread Starter 
"so basically if you set a 1.4vcore , under load the llc will pump it to 1.41 or even higher"

Which is why you set your vcore to 1.39 or lower...really, this is not that complicated. Some of the arguments you make are fine - if you are using offset voltage. However it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever to have an idle voltage higher than a load voltage - from the standpoint of processor life, heat, and attaining the fastest multiplier possible.

I'm the one pointing this out - setting a better LLC and using offset will help you. But whatever. It's your chip you can do whatever you want with it.[/quote]

I'm going to explain how I figured I need a lower llc and a higher vcore because I'm still learning about oc sandy bridge .

I found out that my CPU's stable vcore under high load is 1.344 , basically this vcore it's enough for 100% and 0% load also , right ?


Setting a bios vcore 1.345 with LLC1 , under high load the llc will instantly pump the vcore for example to 1.365 (1.35 cpu-z reading) to be sure the CPU gets right voltage even a bit higher .

Now after getting 1.365 vcore under high load the LLC1 will lower a bit vcore in idle state , so my vcore in idle will go under 1.344 (let's say 1.328) wich gives me bsod .

Also in IBT I've noticed any vcore problem under high load results in BSOD , but I've also noticed I got errors in IBT only when load was 0 and cpu was preparing for a new problem .

I played a lot with LLC and vcore and the conclusion I got is LLC may help you find quick the enough voltage for running stable but it's not an accurate result and the real values are not the same , most likely they will be higher .

I've also managed to run some tests with a similar vcore target but with LLC1 and LLC3 or 4 . The results was how I expected LLC1 = higher temps under load , but yeah rock solid .

And I also know that an electrical component no matter what component will degrade faster if voltage is higher under stress because the power consumption and temperature will go higher . So basically under the idle state the cpu is not affected at all by a higher voltage .

I know I may not be right but as I said I'm still learning , so I beg you to correct me if I'm wrong .
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post #25 of 83
If you are stable at load @ 1.345v then you should be stable at idle around 1.15v. Generally just subtract .2v and you should be stable. My first question is do you have speedstep enabled? And secondly, does your cpu idle at 0%? I used to own a 2600k before my current 3770k and I OC'd both my brothers 2500k and 2550k. You should be stable at 1.2v idle with speedstep or something is wrong man.
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post #26 of 83
Thread Starter 
I have disabled speedstep and any other power saving feature to ensure it's all about cpu capabilities . Tomorrow I will start over with C1 C3 C6 speedstep and maybe turbo . I saw there are some settings for C-state package , is there something important that I should know ? such as enabling only one C state , C1 or C3 ... or disable any of them ?

Basically if now I found out that my cpu is fully stable at 4.8 under load @ 1.344 with all features disabled , this voltage should be fine for running with them enabled too , right ?
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post #27 of 83
Looks good, although 1.344v seems a bit low for 4.8ghz so dont be surprised if it needs a little more juice down the line after you break it in. Definitely turn on your c states to keep volts low in idle states as most have suggested. Not sure if it's the same on all boards but in my case raising my offset raised my idle voltage as well which turned out to be necessary for stability in low power states. Its been almost 2 years for me at 4.7/1.375v (1.384v* actual) and no issues to report.
Edited by LavishB - 4/5/13 at 6:31pm
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post #28 of 83
Thread Starter 
What's the default voltage where I must add the offset ? I mean VID + 0.020 ?

Ok , I've enabled anything , actually restored defaults in bios and pumped multiplier to 48 and voffset 0.020 .

I never used that offset voltage , now I tried +0.040 or +0.020 , the vcore goes to crazy values like 1.55 and still getting bsod within minutes no matter load or idle . Even with negative offset -0.030 the cpu gets 1.44 and bsod , weird .
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post #29 of 83
Hi all,

What about mine? Is it still save or i have to lower the clock to get better temps?
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)



Ambient is 29c
Edited by Formula44 - 4/6/13 at 7:43am
post #30 of 83
Safe, that's a good chip you have there
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