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post #21 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by phill1978 View Post

UDP = Usually dropped packets redface.gif

I think you may have misread the title tongue.gif
post #22 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plan9 View Post

I think you may have misread the title tongue.gif

Actually I think it could have been a dig at my post tongue.gif
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post #23 of 32
Lets get to the topic smile.gif

If you disable it on your router, you are disabling it for ALL hosts connected to your router.
If you disable it thru Windows, you are disabling it ONLY for that host connected to your router.

If you have 3 PCs connected to your router, and you disable it on those three PCs, it is almost* like disabling it on the router. It would be faster (and better) to disable it on the router.

(Note, that the router implementation is usually a hardware one while the Window's is usually a software one. There is a difference)
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post #24 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by tompsonn View Post

Actually I think it could have been a dig at my post tongue.gif
[/quote]

So he was. Sorry guys redface.gif
post #25 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by riahc3 View Post

Lets get to the topic smile.gif

If you disable it on your router, you are disabling it for ALL hosts connected to your router.
If you disable it thru Windows, you are disabling it ONLY for that host connected to your router.

If you have 3 PCs connected to your router, and you disable it on those three PCs, it is almost* like disabling it on the router. It would be faster (and better) to disable it on the router.

(Note, that the router implementation is usually a hardware one while the Window's is usually a software one. There is a difference)

This is true, but for good measure (and especially on laptops) disable it everywhere.
    
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post #26 of 32
Can someone explain to a pitiful network noob what UPnP does (in a nutshell) and whether disabling it will interfere with my networking:

- Windows 7/XP PCs sharing using passwords and user accounts (homegroup disabled) and participating in LAN games.
- Dedicated game server running for LAN + internet clients.
- Blu Ray player, xbox and TVs accessing DLNA server on one of the PCs
- Blu Ray player accessing shared folders on various PCs (CIFS)
- Xboxes connecting to xbox live

do any of those activities need UPnP?

I think UPnP was disabled by default in PFSense, but I enabled it a while ago to try and solve issues with windows PCs randomly not being able to see other ones (in Explorer) and sometimes not even being able to connect via \\COMPUTERNAME. However, I don't think it actually made any difference to that, so I'm wondering if I should re-disable it.
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post #27 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oubadah View Post

Can someone explain to a pitiful network noob what UPnP does (in a nutshell) and whether disabling it will interfere with my networking:

- Windows 7/XP PCs sharing using passwords and user accounts (homegroup disabled) and participating in LAN games.
- Dedicated game server running for LAN + internet clients.
- Blu Ray player, xbox and TVs accessing DLNA server on one of the PCs
- Blu Ray player accessing shared folders on various PCs (CIFS)
- Xboxes connecting to xbox live

do any of those activities need UPnP?

I think UPnP was disabled by default in PFSense, but I enabled it a while ago to try and solve issues with windows PCs randomly not being able to see other ones (in Explorer) and sometimes not even being able to connect via \\COMPUTERNAME. However, I don't think it actually made any difference to that, so I'm wondering if I should re-disable it.

Why not read Wikipedia? That's what the site is there for and there's little anyone on here can post that isn't already explained pretty will in the wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_Plug_and_Play

In answer to your specific set up, DLNA uses UPnP for discovery. So if you're want to use DLNA streaming then you'll need UPnP enabled.

The Windows discovery issue is to do with NetBIOS or WINS or something. It's not UPnP, it will be some crappy proprietary solution Microsoft have kludged together.
post #28 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oubadah View Post

Can someone explain to a pitiful network noob what UPnP does (in a nutshell) and whether disabling it will interfere with my networking:

- Windows 7/XP PCs sharing using passwords and user accounts (homegroup disabled) and participating in LAN games.
- Dedicated game server running for LAN + internet clients.
- Blu Ray player, xbox and TVs accessing DLNA server on one of the PCs
- Blu Ray player accessing shared folders on various PCs (CIFS)
- Xboxes connecting to xbox live

do any of those activities need UPnP?

I think UPnP was disabled by default in PFSense, but I enabled it a while ago to try and solve issues with windows PCs randomly not being able to see other ones (in Explorer) and sometimes not even being able to connect via \\COMPUTERNAME. However, I don't think it actually made any difference to that, so I'm wondering if I should re-disable it.

UPnP is a collection protocols that allows device to seamlessly discover each other on a network and establish services for various tasks such as communication, entertainment, or sharing of files. UPnP is not for the enterprise.
Conceptually, UPnP is an extension to "plug and play" (i.e. Windows plug and play), in the sense you can connect network devices and they just work with each other (hence universal), however it is not related to "plug and play", nor does it depend or physically extend it.

UPnP consists of:

Addressing - The device either assigns itself an address or talks to a DHCP server (i.e. an IP address for the device must be obtained automatically without the need for configuration).
Discovery - Once an address has been established for a UPnP device, the device uses SSDP (simple service discovery protocol). This allows the device to advertise its services to the rest of the network.
Description - An XML file that contains information about the type of UPnP device and other information.
Control - Device-type specific services that enable the UPnP device's services to be communicated with (for example, a router implementing UPnP may expose a port forwarding control point).
Event notification - Also called "eventing", this is implemented by UPnP devices to notify others that a value pertaining to a UPnP service has changed - other devices subscribe to events that they want to receive updated information for.
Presentation - Basically can allow the user to control the device or view status information about it via a web page, if the UPnP device exposes one.

One specific thing we were talking about here is called NAT traversal which is actually called IGD (Internet Gateway Device Protocol). This is implemented by residential UPnP gateway devices (such as home routers). Control points might consist of getting an external (WAN) IP address, or add/remove port mappings - for example a game may communicate with an IGD control point to traverse the NAT firewall on a gateway so that it can be accessed from the Internet. This requires knowledge of what NAT is and how it works.

Disabling UPnP on your gateway/router should not interfere with any of the services you listed. My DLNA networking still works without UPnP on the gateway.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plan9 View Post

Why not read Wikipedia? That's what the site is there for and there's little anyone on here can post that isn't already explained pretty will in the wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_Plug_and_Play

In answer to your specific set up, DLNA uses UPnP for discovery. So if you're want to use DLNA streaming then you'll need UPnP enabled.

The Windows discovery issue is to do with NetBIOS or WINS or something. It's not UPnP, it will be some crappy proprietary solution Microsoft have kludged together.

Windows file sharing talks over TCP/IP - there's no NetBIOS or WINS anymore, unless a legacy device requires NetBIOS over TCP/IP. Windows does use SSDP for discovery in Windows Vista and later.

For the record Microsoft do not "kludge" things together.

smile.gif
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post #29 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by tompsonn View Post


Disabling UPnP on your gateway/router should not interfere with any of the services you listed. My DLNA networking still works without UPnP on the gateway.

What about his DLNA clients? That uses UPnP for discovery.
post #30 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plan9 View Post

What about his DLNA clients? That uses UPnP for discovery.

Turning it off on the router won't make a difference. It just disables UPnP control points and services for itself. Other devices can still advertise themselves via UPnP.
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