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[AnandTech] Choosing a Gaming CPU: Single + Multi-GPU at 1440p, April 2013 - Page 4

post #31 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by ghostrider85 View Post

no 3570k? seriously?

I guess you missed the part that the Reviewer don't have a i5-3570K to test?
Quote:
Originally Posted by borandi View Post

Don't have those chips in. About half the chips in the article were from my motherboard reviewing (which I tend to get given the top end CPU to make the motherboard the bottleneck) and the other half are ones I own personally as a top UK HWBot overclocker. I have an opportunity soon to rummage through a parts bin for a few days of testing; I'll be going through some important CPUs then for the next through, including some of the Haswell line.

So the motherboard reviews still have to come out while I'm testing stuff like this. I wanted to publish my data pre-Haswell to generate interest for the post Haswell results, which should include more processors with some of the ones suggested in the comments (Core2Quad, AM2, i5-3570K, Phenom II X3, FX-42xx).

Edited by sherlock - 5/9/13 at 6:58am
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post #32 of 87
Thread Starter 
probably did as it's cool to have the article man himself hitting this thread.
but like I stated earlier just add to the performance numbers of the 2500K by 5-9% as a 'rough' estimate.
I know it's not exact or precise but if been in this game for long enough a person should be able to get a good idea.
at least I think so...
post #33 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by malmental View Post

probably did as it's cool to have the article man himself hitting this thread.
but like I stated earlier just add to the performance numbers of the 2500K by 5-9% as a 'rough' estimate.
I know it's not exact or precise but if been in this game for long enough a person should be able to get a good idea.
at least I think so...

While that could be case, the reviewer said he is not comfortable recommending something he haven't tested himself.
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post #34 of 87
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sherlock View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by malmental View Post

probably did as it's cool to have the article man himself hitting this thread.
but like I stated earlier just add to the performance numbers of the 2500K by 5-9% as a 'rough' estimate.
I know it's not exact or precise but if been in this game for long enough a person should be able to get a good idea.
at least I think so...

While that could be case, the reviewer said he is not comfortable recommending something he haven't tested himself.
true, but we (you and I for example) know the 3570K is the updated 2500K so I consider it more common sense factorization.
so let's say we're both right.
smile.gif
post #35 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by malmental View Post

I was looking at that, seems it's more for Eyefinity or Surround set-ups..
also looks like AMD takes a performance loss past CF-X and SLi (dual) configurations, so any tri or quad set-up should be Intel.

It also coincides with a weird lane arrangement. Intel can provide 16x 8x 8x in PCIe 3.0 mode, while AMD delivers the same on 2.0 mode. Aside of a processor lack of power, there can also be a PCIe bandwidth problem.
   
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post #36 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by malmental View Post

true, but we (you and I for example) know the 3570K is the updated 2500K so I consider it more common sense factorization.
so let's say we're both right.
smile.gif

WUT???
reasonable estimation factiodism!
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post #37 of 87
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artikbot View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by malmental View Post

I was looking at that, seems it's more for Eyefinity or Surround set-ups..
also looks like AMD takes a performance loss past CF-X and SLi (dual) configurations, so any tri or quad set-up should be Intel.

It also coincides with a weird lane arrangement. Intel can provide 16x 8x 8x in PCIe 3.0 mode, while AMD delivers the same on 2.0 mode. Aside of a processor lack of power, there can also be a PCIe bandwidth problem.
leaning more towards the CPU than the PCI lanes..
and this also touches my 2500K to 3570K point.

pci_express_20_vs_30_gpu_gaming_performance_review

Quote:
PCIe 2.0 sometimes faster than PCIe 3.0?

There were some instances in our testing as you saw where the PCIe 2.0 platform seemed to be a few percent faster than PCIe 3.0. There were a few cases of this in our testing. Some of the performance between 1-2% can be attributed to the margin of error we have talked about. However, there is another component to PCI Express besides just the raw bandwidth benefits of PCIe 3.0 versus PCIe 2.0. We are talking about latencies.

Just like your RAM modules, the PCI Express bus also has latencies and timings. As we all know, changing the timings/latencies on your RAM modules can affect the bandwidth or performance of your RAM. The tighter the timings, the better the performance. The same is true for PCI Express. It is possible that there are some timing or latency aspects that are different between the Sandy Bridge platform and motherboard we tested with versus our Ivy Bridge platform. This is just a theory of course, but without knowing the specific latencies and timings involved it is impossible to say for sure. It is a logical theory however that could account for a percent or two of performance differences experienced.

Think about it like this, in a bandwidth starved situation, PCIe 3.0 will more likely show a performance benefit over PCIe 2.0. However, when bandwidth is not starved, and not an issue, then aspects like timings and latencies play a role in performance. We may be seeing some of this where bandwidth isn't an issue. In most cases, it appeared that bandwidth was not a major issue in any of these games.

The Bottom Line

We have put forth a great effort to get to the bottom of the PCIe 2.0 versus PCIe 3.0 debate. We put a lot of time into testing performance and verifying that our data is accurate. Except for a couple of specific scenarios, most of the performance advantage had under PCIe 3.0 was well under 10%. This actually falls in-line with the kind of performance advantages one might expect using n Ivy Bridge CPU clock-for-clock compared to a Sandy Bridge CPU. The IPC can affect performance by as much as 4-7% in favor of Ivy Bridge easily. As you noticed, most of our data when we experienced an improvement on the Ivy Bridge system was in this range of improvements.
post #38 of 87
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by looniam View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by malmental View Post

true, but we (you and I for example) know the 3570K is the updated 2500K so I consider it more common sense factorization.
so let's say we're both right.
smile.gif

WUT???
reasonable estimation factiodism!
I'm gonna use that next time... tongue.gif
post #39 of 87
Very lengthy and meaty article, but in some ways, fundamentally flawed. As many others have mentioned, no minimum frame rates. But there's more.

No frame rate time graphs. Anandtech seems to be the last major site still clinging on to avg fps bar graphs.

Why choose primarily GPU dependent games for a CPU buying guide? It's pretty much been known for years that a game like Metro doesn't care what CPU you throw at it. Why should I make a meaningful CPU purchase decision based off of the results of a game where the CPU isn't meaningful?

No multiplayer benchmarks. Multiplayer is where the CPU is stressed MUCH harder than GPU and where the CPU performance REALLY counts. Obviously this is the hardest to perform since it lacks a level of consistency. That doesn't stop other sites from performing this. They key with this type of benchmark isn't even specific numbers anyways, it's trends. Sure the exact scenes can not be repeated but the trends can. This one I suppose I can let slide.

And finally, no Hitman Absolution benchmarks? One of the most notoriously CPU hungry games in recent memory that comes with a standard benchmark wasn't tested? Wow.

The author obviously had a massive task to undertake when signing up to write this article. But there are so many problems with it, and apparent decisions to take the easy route instead of providing meaningful results.

Based off of these benchmarks it seems like my 6 core 3930K would be completely irrelevant for gaming... Which from personal experience couldn't be anything further from the truth.

Nevertheless, this was still a massive undertaking so I don't want to rag on the author/anandtech too hard. Definitely a difficult job to do.
Edited by lajgnd - 5/9/13 at 7:56am
post #40 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by lajgnd View Post

Very lengthy and meaty article, but in some ways, fundamentally flawed. As many others have mentioned, no minimum frame rates. But there's more.

No frame rate time graphs. Anandtech seems to be the last major site still clinging on to avg fps bar graphs.

Wrong, Anandtech do use FCAT in their recent GPU reviews. The problem is this reviewer is in GB while the reviewer with FCAT is in the U.S.
Edited by sherlock - 5/9/13 at 8:09am
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