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[YT] Frame Rating and FCAT Explanation and Discussion with NVIDIA - Page 22  

post #211 of 311
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majin SSJ Eric View Post

If the frame time issue was as bad as is being claimed why did it take over a year for anybody to really start screaming bloody murder about it? Sure there are those few like Ragin who have been complaining for a while (why you didn't just go with Nvidia back then if its so bad is beyond me) but the vast majority of CF users have enjoyed their setups for years with no major eruption of complaints until now that TR and PCPer have come out with their damning stories. When 12.11 released it was tested to high heaven by every review site there is and NOBODY complained about any major stuttering or frame times until TR three months later. Seems odd for such an unplayable issue?

I've been watching these forums for years.... people have been screaming about ATis/AMDs drivers. For quite a long time. ATi used to be the leader, just like AMD was with CPUs. I had my 1500+, my mobile barton, my 64-bit 4000+. Core Duo came out and it was over for AMD. With, ATi I had my soft modded 9500-9700 Pro, 9800 Pro. NV was a joke with the FX series... terrible GPUs. 6800 Ultra came out... changed everything.

Multi-GPU were then reintroduced. I've had X1900 Crossfire.... actually lost FPS. 8800 GT SLI meh.... HD 6950 Crossfire... good in BF3, a few other games.

GTX 480 SLI... wonderful...just too damn hot. HD 7970 crossfire.... disaster... stutter all over the place. GTX 670 surround. Outstanding.

Nvidia makes the best GPUs and they make progress. AMD puts out the price-performance. That's been the mantra for the last 8 years or so. But the absolute constant i've seen and experienced over those years is constant complaining about AMD drivers. AMD users literally fiend for the next drivers. When new drivers come out for NV... my attitude is "okay I guess i'll try them." When I was using AMD... I couldn't wait for the next driver set... hoping... praying.

The frametime issue is just the continuing pattern of poor AMD driver cheats and lack of game support... As evidence by this video, NV sees a problem and addresses it. AMD sees a problem and gives you free games.

We have been complaining... AMD and the fanboys just refuse to listen.
    
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post #212 of 311
Quote:
Originally Posted by lajgnd View Post

Have you considered logging your system and sending your results to AMD itself and the multitude of review sites that have independently confirmed that the problem not only exists but is present in every single Crossfire Setup on the planet? I'm certain AMD would love some data to prove them wrong so they wouldn't have to waste so many resources trying to fix this mess.

The problem is others have issue, not everyone has the same setup, I could log and send them my data but would they even give an importance to it? They are professional working on a fix for others having issue. The fix may even make my gameplay from smoothness to silky smoothness as well....
    
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post #213 of 311
Quote:
Originally Posted by ltulod View Post

The problem is others have issue, not everyone has the same setup, I could log and send them my data but would they even give an importance to it? They are professional working on a fix for others having issue. The fix may even make my gameplay from smoothness to silky smoothness as well....

How can the fix affect your gameplay if, as you say, you don't have a problem to begin with?

How can a fix correct a problem that doesn't exist?
Edited by lajgnd - 5/11/13 at 12:12pm
post #214 of 311
For those who actually have CF there are fairly easy ways of checking how much micro-stutter there is. First of all you have to understand that the problem is mostly limited to scenarios of <60 FPS and without vsync or other FPS limiters. Having more FPS will of course make the problem less evident, and I'm sure a lot of people using CF are in fact always 60+ FPS and possibly vsync on too, which means for the most part they won't come across the problem in a meaningful way. But that's not the case for all. A lot of people will rather have maxed settings and <60 FPS as a result of that. In that case you can use a third party FPS limiter or an in-game console command (Crysis has one for example). Setting the FPS limit below the current average FPS will even the output and you should see the difference between stuttering and smooth output just by pressing an on/off button on the limiter. When I had my CF setup the differences were clear cut on most games, the supposedly lower limited FPS was far smoother. Of course there's some outliers that don't necessarily follow the trend. CPU limited scenarios will exhibit less stutter since the CPU limitation will in fact delay the frame output and unintentionally balance it to a degree. You could say this is one of the reasons those AMD demos with CF+BD setups felt smoother that CF+SB. tongue.gif Usually though with multi-gpu setups you're GPU bound. In any case, people should really try these things out before making accusations of bias to one way or another. Unfortunately most people can't do that and instead like to make assumptions...
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post #215 of 311
Quote:
Originally Posted by KaRLiToS View Post

Are you telling us we can't see microstutter?

Sorry, its not like we are new to computer gaming, I have been gaming on PC for 20 years. I just can't play when there is microstutter or even picostutters.

Who are you to tell me that some are more sensible to me. The way you sound :

Nvidia users: Sensible
AMD users: Not sensible


wth.gif

I can't stand to play PS3 at 30 fps, I notice every lag, now don't tell me some are more sensible to it. When you have A LOT of experience with PC gaming, you want the best experience and you notice every small errors. Even if they are nano errors.

If we speak about Far Cry3, of course there was micro stutters, I would even say, mega stutters.

Nope, what I actually meant was that a users setup may not be affected like another users setup. Meaning that if you are a lucky one and don't have an issue with you cards than that is great news! But seeing that some people have a problem on their setup, means we can't say that the problem does not exist for them.

Oh and the bolded part of your post... your bias really shines through there. Never said that or implied that once.

tldr
You can't tell anyone what they should be experiencing, because you are not that person and you don't have their setup.
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post #216 of 311
spacin9 - I like where your head is at... thumb.gif
post #217 of 311
Quote:
Originally Posted by spacin9 View Post

I've been watching these forums for years.... people have been screaming about ATis/AMDs drivers. For quite a long time. ATi used to be the leader, just like AMD was with CPUs. I had my 1500+, my mobile barton, my 64-bit 4000+. Core Duo came out and it was over for AMD. With, ATi I had my soft modded 9500-9700 Pro, 9800 Pro. NV was a joke with the FX series... terrible GPUs. 6800 Ultra came out... changed everything.

Multi-GPU were then reintroduced. I've had X1900 Crossfire.... actually lost FPS. 8800 GT SLI meh.... HD 6950 Crossfire... good in BF3, a few other games.

GTX 480 SLI... wonderful...just too damn hot. HD 7970 crossfire.... disaster... stutter all over the place. GTX 670 surround. Outstanding.

Nvidia makes the best GPUs and they make progress. AMD puts out the price-performance. That's been the mantra for the last 8 years or so. But the absolute constant i've seen and experienced over those years is constant complaining about AMD drivers. AMD users literally fiend for the next drivers. When new drivers come out for NV... my attitude is "okay I guess i'll try them." When I was using AMD... I couldn't wait for the next driver set... hoping... praying.

The frametime issue is just the continuing pattern of poor AMD driver cheats and lack of game support... As evidence by this video, NV sees a problem and addresses it. AMD sees a problem and gives you free games.

We have been complaining... AMD and the fanboys just refuse to listen.

I'm a professional myself, I will complain if I bought a defective product...but it's just smooth for me...I have both platforms gtx 690 and xfire 7950 as well....smooth on both.
    
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post #218 of 311
Quote:
Originally Posted by fashric View Post

Lol it's amazing how its the Nvdia users (read fanboys) who are most upset about this. Unless you are paid by Nvdia to use their cards and try to bash other manufacturers I don't see what you would get out of coming into a thread on a topic that has zero effect on you and get so aggressive and upset. It really boggles the mind.

Let me elaborate. I use Nvidia for now but that in no way makes me a fanboy. I have a Nvidia card because of this CF issue. I'm here talking about this issues because I had 7970CF for nine months and it wasn't pleasent. I'm here because I need CF to be an eligible candidate for my next GPU solution. I'm not here because I have Nvidia and want to banish AMD from this world. I'm here because I want AMD to do better.

The question is why are there so many here talking the issue down with zero objective evidence to back their opinions. No matter what GPU you own, you're doing yourself and everyone else harm. The issue is proven to exist and it has been proven to affect a considerable amount of people. What boggles my mind is this: when the most you seem to be able to say about the issue is that it doesn't bother you, it sure seems to bother you a lot. rolleyes.gif
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post #219 of 311
Quote:
Originally Posted by ltulod View Post


I'm a professional myself
wth.gif

j/k.. tongue.gif
post #220 of 311
Quote:
Originally Posted by criminal View Post

Nope, what I actually meant was that a users setup may not be affected like another users setup. Meaning that if you are a lucky one and don't have an issue with you cards than that is great news! But seeing that some people have a problem on their setup, means we can't say that the problem does not exist for them.

Oh and the bolded part of your post... your bias really shines through there. Never said that or implied that once.

tldr
You can't tell anyone what they should be experiencing, because you are not that person and you don't have their setup.

Ok, fair enough.

But I'm not bias. sneaky.gif
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