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[The Register] Apple asked me for my Bank statements, says outraged reader - Page 3

post #21 of 86
She was in IT not IT security...
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post #22 of 86
Hmm, asking for statements isn't that rare. I get clients to send them all the time in order to confirm things.

I am confused as to why it was necessary in this case though, did they have reason to flag her purchase as possible fraud?

Maybe they've had issues with people using stolen cards to buy macs?
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post #23 of 86
Prehaps the high CC charges with stolen credit cards is becoming more common over at Apple Online?
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post #24 of 86
Bank statements are one thing (bank statements include nothing more than the name of the individual, mailing address, and the last several digits of your account number.), but to ask for a drivers license, color copy of a passport, and full credit card number? And then, they justify it by saying it's in their ToS...

I try not to get into these Apple "doom and gloom" threads, but this really has me angry. A company has no right to intrude on someone's life to this extent just so you can buy a slab of technology. Renting? Sure. Mortgage? You have to prove your identity, so that info can be very important. Purchasing a tablet? NO. Absolutely not. A fraudulent transaction is a drop in the bucket compared to the can of worms Apple has opened for themselves with this one.

Go screw yourself Apple.
Edited by Mad Pistol - 5/13/13 at 11:19pm
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post #25 of 86
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mad Pistol View Post

Bank statements are one thing (bank statements include nothing more than the name of the individual, mailing address, and the last several digits of your account number.), but to ask for a drivers license, color copy of a passport, and full credit card number? And then, they justify it by saying it's in their ToS...

I try not to get into these Apple "doom and gloom" threads, but this really has me angry. A company has no right to intrude on someone's life to this extent just so you can buy a slab of technology. Renting? Sure. Mortgage? You have to prove your identity, so that info can be very important. Purchasing a tablet? NO. Absolutely not. A fraudulent transaction is a drop in the bucket compared to the can of worms Apple has opened for themselves with this one.

Go screw yourself Apple.

All I am thinking about is actually how unsafe this is.

By trying to verify people's identity like this, all those scans etc must just be sitting there on a server... Jackpot for whoever hacks it.
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post #26 of 86
http://store.apple.com/Catalog/uk_inst/Images/salespolicies_individual.html

5.3 If you are paying by credit card, then you must supply your credit card details when you place your Order. Your credit card will be charged when we issue your Invoice or on shipment of your Products. We will not commence the manufacture of your Products neither will we supply the Products to you nor perform the Services until your credit card issuer has authorised the use of your card for payment of the Products ordered. If we do not receive such authorisation we shall let you know. Your credit card billing address must be in the United Kingdom or the Isle of Man. We reserve the right to verify the identity of the credit card holder by requesting appropriate documentation.

About this: "...our reader - who works in the IT industry and does not want to incur the fruity firm's wrath by revealing her name".

Yeah if you are stupid enough to not read the fine print and panic after you've handed over all of the info, and then complain about it. Pffft. And you know what. She may as well just answer the phone or poor some tea/coffee in the cups of the real IT guns. Like it matters what she does for a living, because to me the only thing that counts is what she did i.e. e-mail a copy of her passport. Which IMHO she should not have done in the first place.

Now the crux of the story. Apple will only do this when they believe that something suspicious is going on. They have to verify the identity as a counter measure to address credit card fraud / identity theft. Let's not forget folks that Apple may in fact have info, from credit card firms for example, that this person/card is used (before) in fraudulent transactions. But nobody really knows... without additional details.

I for one like what Apple did, simply because that may eventually stop my card from getting used by someone else. And if you've been hit by fraudulent transaction, then and only then you will know what it means.

Edit: It doesn't matter what she does so I changed my post a bit.
Edited by Pike - 5/14/13 at 5:35am
post #27 of 86
Maybe regular people should have Terms of Service as well since this looks like a method of having your own way irrespective to the rights of others.
Maybe people should start asking for id when they purchase something, or pay taxes, or have to deal with the police. I mean everyone wants to check our id or "info" for something, why can't we do the same? Because we're not a corporation?

Such as:

"Good morning, I'd like to purchase that tablet but first I'd like to see your id, your organizational chart and your company's bank statements to verify the legitimacy of this establishment. Also where were you on the night of February the 29th and have you recently been to Nicaragua?"
post #28 of 86
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pike View Post

I for one like what Apple did, simply because that may eventually stop my card from getting used by someone else. And if you've been hit by fraudulent transaction, then and only then you will know what it means.

You know what works even better? The vendor calling the credit card company, asking them to verify the card owner's identity and intent to purchase, and the CC company relaying that information back to the vendor with no personal information being exchanged.
    
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post #29 of 86
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pike View Post

http://store.apple.com/Catalog/uk_inst/Images/salespolicies_individual.html

5.3 If you are paying by credit card, then you must supply your credit card details when you place your Order. Your credit card will be charged when we issue your Invoice or on shipment of your Products. We will not commence the manufacture of your Products neither will we supply the Products to you nor perform the Services until your credit card issuer has authorised the use of your card for payment of the Products ordered. If we do not receive such authorisation we shall let you know. Your credit card billing address must be in the United Kingdom or the Isle of Man. We reserve the right to verify the identity of the credit card holder by requesting appropriate documentation.

The key word in this is appropriate, and that can and should be argued in court. Color copy of a passport? Inappropriate. A bank statement or utility bill to your address that gives them the information they want without compromising your own security? Probably appropriate. I doubt a fair judge would rule in Apple's favor.


As an aside, the immediate reactions that people on forums have against victims is pathetic.
post #30 of 86
Quote:
Originally Posted by BBEG View Post

You know what works even better? The vendor calling the credit card company, asking them to verify the card owner's identity and intent to purchase, and the CC company relaying that information back to the vendor with no personal information being exchanged.
I don't think so. First. The CC holder is verified already, and no CC company is going to call vendors for every transaction. Not to mention that this would be prone to (human) errors and open a new attack vector.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbles37 View Post

The key word in this is appropriate, and that can and should be argued in court. Color copy of a passport? Inappropriate. A bank statement or utility bill to your address that gives them the information they want without compromising your own security? Probably appropriate. I doubt a fair judge would rule in Apple's favor.
A colour copy of a passport is appropriate to ID a CC holder. Especially for someone with a name/background that triggered special attention – I'm not saying that this is the case, but Apple never asked me for a copy of my passport. And I presume that the intention was to compare her copy with that what Apple got from the CC company, or that Apple would ask the CC company do verify it for them. All to protect Apple and the CC holder from getting lured into a scam.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbles37 View Post

As an aside, the immediate reactions that people on forums have against victims is pathetic.
I don't understand why you would call her a "victim" because A) no harm was done and B) Apple did what she would have known when she had read and understood that document.
Edited by Pike - 5/14/13 at 1:40am
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