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[Bloomberg] Advanced Micro Devices Sues Ex-Worker Over Trade Secrets - Page 3

post #21 of 46
Seeing as Nvidia is not part of the suit, I can only imagine that theres no evidence pointing any of this to them, in the aspect of them encouraging or plotting to get a hold of those docs. Whether the ex employees showed or gave the docs, and Nvidia saw them, it'd be hard to prove and even harder to reverse the effect of those docs. The true culprits are already being sued in this case ( no pun intended).
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post #22 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsm106 View Post

And yet they didn't turn this guy away. Or send him to the Feds.

Probably because nVidia didn't know about the data theft. If they did and didn't say anything then they could be an accomplice. Again, I highly doubt they knew, or maybe they did know and alerted AMD. Either way these people will probably need to find a new field to work in since if convicted, they will never get a job in this valley again, unless it is flipping burgers...
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post #23 of 46
So many people with great reading skills. smile.gif
post #24 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by airbozo View Post

Probably because nVidia didn't know about the data theft. If they did and didn't say anything then they could be an accomplice. Again, I highly doubt they knew, or maybe they did know and alerted AMD. Either way these people will probably need to find a new field to work in since if convicted, they will never get a job in this valley again, unless it is flipping burgers...

"Hey guys. You don't mind if I bring in like 100,000 electronic files that have AMD's fingerprints all over on them and use them on some of our projects, right?"

Two scenarios:

1. Management dials 911 and their lawyers (didn't happen)

2. Management happily takes the data

3. Employee didn't mention about the files to anyone, yet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boinz View Post

Seeing as Nvidia is not part of the suit, I can only imagine that theres no evidence pointing any of this to them, in the aspect of them encouraging or plotting to get a hold of those docs. Whether the ex employees showed or gave the docs, and Nvidia saw them, it'd be hard to prove and even harder to reverse the effect of those docs. The true culprits are already being sued in this case ( no pun intended).

Or, AMD doesn't have evidence proving that Nividia used the data. All they know is that a person walked off with 100,000 pages of stuff.

Now if they get the court to issue a search warrant, then it'll be interesting to see what did Nividia do with the data.
Edited by A Bad Day - 5/17/13 at 1:25pm
post #25 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by A Bad Day View Post

"Hey guys. You don't mind if I bring in like 100,000 electronic files that have AMD's fingerprints all over on them and use them on some of our projects, right?"

Two scenarios:

1. Management dials 911 and their lawyers (didn't happen)

2. Management happily takes the data

3. Employee didn't mention about the files to anyone, yet.
Or, AMD doesn't have evidence proving that Nividia used the data. All they know is that a person walked off with 100,000 pages of stuff.

Now if they get the court to issue a search warrant, then it'll be interesting to see what did Nividia do with the data.

True, the evidence of the 100,000 pages getting stolen is as good as it's going to get for now.
As for the search warrant, they'll need a curious enough judge to issue it. And if Nvidia do use any of that data, that's stolen property and would certainly put Nvidia in a really crappy position of using stolen goods and trying to prove that they somehow didn't have intent to steal those docs in the first place and thats a lot of money wasted for what could or could not be useful stolen data.
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post #26 of 46
Going to work for a competitor is a bit of a puppet show. You see you can make decisions and suggestions based on your previous work knowledge but often you can't reveal to your current employer the trade secrets or proprietary information that lead you to the decision. My guess, if the allegations are true, is that some of these people grabbed as much information as possible with which to work within that context. So it wouldn't be surprising that Nvidia and it's people were not directly involved or implicated.
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post #27 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vesku View Post

Going to work for a competitor is a bit of a puppet show. You see you can make decisions and suggestions based on your previous work knowledge but often you can't reveal to your current employer the trade secrets or proprietary information that lead you to the decision. My guess, if the allegations are true, is that some of these people grabbed as much information as possible with which to work within that context. So it wouldn't be surprising that Nvidia and it's people were not directly involved or implicated.

Oh no doubt, but without proof, it won't make it to court. And you can bet your tuckus that if Nvidia was somehow involved, they'd be cutting off ties or traces with these former employees FAST.
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post #28 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by DuckieHo View Post

No... if anything, Nvidia would say "We are calling the cops on you".

This has been done in the past and companies are not stupid enough to even handle stolen docs.

Exactly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by A Bad Day View Post

OR: What if Pepsi decided it wouldn't make economic sense? If they produced a product that tasted like the Coke, then Coco-Cola would've had to slash their products' prices to compete. Then Pepsi would've been left with the choice of either reducing the prices of their products to match Coco-Cola, or not compete. The result would be that both companies' profit margins would've crashed.

http://www.freakonomics.com/2006/07/07/how-much-would-pepsi-pay-to-get-cokes-secret-formula/


For Nivida however, knowing AMD's stuff allows them to implement what made AMD's GPUs and CPUs strong, and avoid drawbacks that weakened AMD's products. The trick is to not get caught by AMD and have the court stop all sales of Nividia's products that used AMD's information.

It's the same though, the GPU architectures are so different that nVidia can't just get (For example) the design of the ROPs or something and throw it in theirs, they'd have to do as much work as simply redesigning the ROPs but also carry the risk of it being found out and then their GPUs being barred from sale.
What they would find valuable (Same with Pepsi) is the knowledge of what their competitor is doing, Coke launched/relaunched 4 products in 2006-2007 and that knowledge would have given Pepsi a chance to compete better..It's not worth the risk though as corporate espionage fines are pretty massive.
Quote:
Originally Posted by A Bad Day View Post

"Hey guys. You don't mind if I bring in like 100,000 electronic files that have AMD's fingerprints all over on them and use them on some of our projects, right?"

Two scenarios:

1. Management dials 911 and their lawyers (didn't happen)

2. Management happily takes the data

3. Employee didn't mention about the files to anyone, yet.

Or, AMD doesn't have evidence proving that Nividia used the data. All they know is that a person walked off with 100,000 pages of stuff.

Now if they get the court to issue a search warrant, then it'll be interesting to see what did Nividia do with the data.

I'm going to wager that there's a 4th option, employee didn't mention the files to anyone but used the ideas and the like inside it in order to argue for certain features and the like inside nVidia's future GPUs.
For example, both companies would have rough designs for their 2016 GPUs, this person might know AMD plans for it to be 2x as fast as their 2014 GPUs and are adding features x, y and z but instead of saying that to nVidia he presents the features as his own ideas and tries to get the 2014 GPUs to be a bit faster or something.

Not many companies are stupid enough to actually make use of information like this, it's way too risky considering what happens if they get caught...Especially if the hardware has patented ideas from AMD inside.
    
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post #29 of 46
They're at it again.
You can bet some engineer/designer has copies of the files stashed away for later perusal.
They probably just turned the employees in to cover their butts.
post #30 of 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by A Bad Day View Post

"Hey guys. You don't mind if I bring in like 100,000 electronic files that have AMD's fingerprints all over on them and use them on some of our projects, right?"

Two scenarios:

1. Management dials 911 and their lawyers (didn't happen)

2. Management happily takes the data

3. Employee didn't mention about the files to anyone, yet.
Or, AMD doesn't have evidence proving that Nividia used the data. All they know is that a person walked off with 100,000 pages of stuff.

Now if they get the court to issue a search warrant, then it'll be interesting to see what did Nividia do with the data.

Until we know more about this case, #1 could still be true, although you don't dial 911, you have your legal department contact the other guys legal department and take it from there. Believe it or not competitors have it in their best interest to report all instances of this sort of behavior. Many years ago a SUN employee went to work for SGI/MIPS and was caught with proprietary information regarding the SPARC designs. Mind you he was not trying to sell it but he left some files on his desk when his supervisor came in to speak with him (or her). Said supervisor contacted legal, the legal department contacted SUN and turned over the information he had. SUN decided not to pursue charges, but the guy/girl will never work in the computer industry again.

#3 may be the most plausible and AMD found out from their IT department that said employees had transferred certain information to a USB stick or something.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brutuz View Post

Exactly.
It's the same though, the GPU architectures are so different that nVidia can't just get (For example) the design of the ROPs or something and throw it in theirs, they'd have to do as much work as simply redesigning the ROPs but also carry the risk of it being found out and then their GPUs being barred from sale.
What they would find valuable (Same with Pepsi) is the knowledge of what their competitor is doing, Coke launched/relaunched 4 products in 2006-2007 and that knowledge would have given Pepsi a chance to compete better..It's not worth the risk though as corporate espionage fines are pretty massive.
I'm going to wager that there's a 4th option, employee didn't mention the files to anyone but used the ideas and the like inside it in order to argue for certain features and the like inside nVidia's future GPUs.
For example, both companies would have rough designs for their 2016 GPUs, this person might know AMD plans for it to be 2x as fast as their 2014 GPUs and are adding features x, y and z but instead of saying that to nVidia he presents the features as his own ideas and tries to get the 2014 GPUs to be a bit faster or something.

Not many companies are stupid enough to actually make use of information like this, it's way too risky considering what happens if they get caught...Especially if the hardware has patented ideas from AMD inside.

This is especially true of companies with a lot to lose. Like nVidia.
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