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[PCG] Nvidia surprised the Titan outsold the year-old GTX 690 in just 3 months. - Page 30  

post #291 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by SniperTeamTango View Post

K20s or K20x's yes. They have 0 displays out, so what?

Still a GK110
Still 6gb VRAM

•Better Scaling
•Can work together on networks
•Costs 3 times what the titan does
•Doesn't care about how fast it does something, wants it done right.
•Much lower wattage at 100%.
•Does work worth millions of dollars instead of playing games.

Yes welcome to the enterprise environment. The argument for frametime is actually made look completely silly when I'm talking about a card that will restart a test that will take 9 hours because it thinks it didn't do something quite right. And I wouldn't have it any other way.

Fact is, you're playing the familiarity card, I've gamed on a 690, and Ive used a fair few GK110s, and believe me, I had a hard time justifying a 7990, bet cher buns I'm gonna be using it frequently.

EDIT: Im off, its 5am, fun chat mate, PCE! thumb.gif


...I really, really shouldn't wade into this again...but when NVidia contracts TMSC to produce a wafer of chips (say GK104, GK110), all the vid connections are already there the way a chip is "produced" - whether they become Tesla K20X without any vid connections.. or whatever later....it's not like they have some little old ladies glue the i/o on afterwards...because they do not know the yield for certain upfront...

...that's the ROI (return on investment) brilliance of NVidia...get a reject on K20X, sell it as a 'Titan' - which genuinely blows the doors off any current single GPU solution....so instead of throwing out a not-quite-$3k solution, they sell it as a more-than-you-got $1k solution...brilliant ! (I'm close to ordering, I got my mind set on 3x 780ies w/custom VRMs)

...as I said, I shouldn't have gotten involved...Bon Weekend smile.gif
Edited by Joa3d43 - 5/19/13 at 2:21am

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post #292 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

You claim it's a problem. Many people (who actually own the cards mind you) say it's not. So ya.

My claims are accompanied with proof and agreed upon by tons of professional reviewers. Your claims have nothing to back them up but your word.
Quote:
You defend far too hard to just be proving a point. While it could be said that my defence is ALSO to feel superior (though it's only ever in retaliation to Titan owners who make a near non-existent frame problem into a mountain), yours is undoubtedly so. Just look at the thread where new people think you're an nVidia rep due to how bias you are. That says something. Maybe it's time to chill or atleast make your motives less obvious.

I try to take every single post on its own, to see the merits in that single post. I couldn't care less what piece of hardware someone uses as long as they can argue the point well, I apply the same point to my own posts. Continuously denying proof and saying you can't see anything isn't a good argument.
Quote:
Be that as it may, all you argued was my 7950s. If you want cherry picked, I'll go grab a few dozen that put the 690 more than 40% higher than the Titan. Really want a benchmark war? The Titan won't win. You know this.

And then I'll post a few dozen benches where SLI didn't work properly. It's all about averages in a general argument like this. And I've also never said the Titan would win in pure fps. The selling points of the card are something other than that.
Quote:
I know that all you can see there are numbers, not a display. Your video didn't make a difference either, so you rely on the graph behind it as if it'll change anything? Besides the point, how do you plan to defend against the 690? Oh, and thank you for giving us proof that Masta is full of it. Just look at the smoothness of the 690 that he claimed was absolute hell. It's the same as the Titan's line. Is he calling your graph fake too, or will you concede that it means nothing?

No, I will just point out that the 690 has excellent hardware based frame metering but due to the inherent problem with dual GPUs even this doesn't help all the time





which brings us back to the whole single GPU vs. dual GPU consistency point. Dual GPU solutions will fail to deliver more often.
Quote:
Please don't pull this "doesn't mean anything" lies, you know better. You bench. More importantly though, and what I was pointing out, you didn't read your own graphs correctly.

While benching only numbers matter you're correct.

But while I'm enjoying a gaming experience I could care less about some random numbers. All I want is a smooth gaming experience with as little problems as possible. Guess where the Titan excels?
Quote:
The difference is non existent. I suggest you see a doctor and ask about something called "placebo effect". See? I can claim my senses as fact for everyone too!

The difference is that your claim isn't backed up by testing conducted by numerous professional reviewers.
Quote:
Keep in mind Alatar. I have 2 cards. This means I can actually turn one off, and play. There is no difference.

And drop your fps in half?
Quote:
Others have told you there is no difference. Yet others say there's a difference where your evidence says there is none. Maybe it's time you get over it and enjoy your overpriced card without the need to justify it beyond "I wanted one and I could afford it".

Also, Alatar, it's not the tires that get the power to the road for top speed, they just give you the traction for acceleration. wink.gif

You're correct it needs no more justification. That doesn't mean that I wont come in here and correct people who spout nonsense like "frame metering is a scam".

Look here's a crash course on frame times:

Let's take two GPU setups that have similar average fps. Say 100 fps both on average.


The Nvidia setup:
100 average fps
10ms average frame time



The AMD setup:
100 average fps
10ms average frame time

But now the difference is this:

The AMD setup has a bunch of 0ms frames. you cannot see these frames due to them lasting 0ms. Even though these frames contribute to the average frame time / fps number they do not do anything to the gaming experience.

This brown line is what reviews will have you believe is the gaming experience:



Here are the frames that need to be removed due to you not seeing them:



Here the blue represents the actual frame times that you can see:



And this brown line is the final real life average frame time / frame rate that you're left with:



And them compare to the brown real life line on the Nvidia side:



You will get a real life experience of 100fps with the nvidia setup and 50fps with the amd setup. Saying you can't see the difference proves nothing but that you cannot distinguish the difference between 100 and 50fps.

Now compare that to all the professional reviews and explain why I'm wrong.

Thank you.
Edited by Alatar - 5/19/13 at 2:52am
 
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post #293 of 338
Does anyone think the titans price will come dowm once they release the 700 series?
post #294 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by taafe View Post

Does anyone think the titans price will come dowm once they release the 700 series?

Highly unlikely. Nvidia has historically rarely reduced prices of previous gen cards once new ones come out. Retailers and/or personal users getting rid of theirs may have some good deals though, just to get rid of stock.
post #295 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by taafe View Post

Does anyone think the titans price will come dowm once they release the 700 series?
Lol!thumbsdownsmileyanim.gif
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post #296 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by armando666 View Post

That's your problem, not ours rolleyes.gif
It's pay to play. I have a friend who is a student, but he bought two Titans. I have another friend who is unemployed and he bought a Titan.
If you love a hobby, you can't put a price on it . rolleyes.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by Masta Squidge View Post

How much money you make is almost irrelevant to what you can afford.

Being able to afford something is also a matter of opinion as well, so, that could explain it.

I guess you two did not get my drift.

@armando, you kidding me right?

@Masta, I can buy one or four right this minute, the question for me is what for? when what I have can play the game that titan can play....

I would rather overclock my status in life then balance everything for smooth sailing.....you get my point right?
    
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post #297 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by ltulod View Post

something special?

really now?lachen.gif

There's nothing special on computer parts. They get replace pretty fast......

But but, it looks so shiney! smile.gif
post #298 of 338
For gaming and the such I wouldn't consider Titan too special, but for GPGPU workloads it's quite sweet. NVIDIA nerfed the GPGPU performance of GTX600-series severely, and since Radeon cards only support the much less mature OpenCL (which has very little commercially available rendering programs), and since a Tesla/Quadro setup is way beyond most amateur artist's price point, the Titan is certainly very appealing. If I currently had $1k, I would be hard pressed deciding do I want a prosumer DSLR or a Titan..
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post #299 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by seepra View Post

For gaming and the such I wouldn't consider Titan too special, but for GPGPU workloads it's quite sweet. NVIDIA nerfed the GPGPU performance of GTX600-series severely, and since Radeon cards only support the much less mature OpenCL (which has very little commercially available rendering programs), and since a Tesla/Quadro setup is way beyond most amateur artist's price point, the Titan is certainly very appealing. If I currently had $1k, I would be hard pressed deciding do I want a prosumer DSLR or a Titan..

For cuda compliant software, absolutely. Anything remotely opencl related, Kepler in general is just bad.

BTW, these past 10 pages are probably the most epic debating I have seen on here in a while lol.
     
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post #300 of 338
Is it a coincidence that the few people arguing vehemently against the Titan own entirely AMD powered computers? I don't even know how AMD got into this conversation as this was Nvidia vs Nvidia.

Here is how I break this down:

690
  • Faster avg frame rate, nice hardware metering
  • Not an excellent overclocker
  • Less Vram for high res
  • Runs hotter and possibly louder if you use custom fan profiles
  • Physically larger (could be a problem for some cases)
  • Possible Multi-GPU scaling issues


Titan
  • More consistent frame times than a dual GPU solution
  • More Vram for high res
  • Full compute abilities
  • Better overclocking capabilites
  • Not priced well for its position between "flagship" single cards and dual cards
  • Somewhat slower



The way I see it, the only thing to complain about a Titan at all is the price. If it had come out at, say $749 which is where it really belongs I think there would be a lot less backlash. Nvidia obviously did their research and found that people would pay a grand for it, because pay they did. Naturally this is what they want because they are a company out to make money, not to make friends with you. Literally the only reason you would want a 690 is that its faster, but int he world of video cards that makes up probably 95% of purchases, you usually always want to get the faster card for your money.
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