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post #11 of 18
It may not be a deal breaker for you, but the AF system of the 5D3 (plus dual card capabilities, full HD out with Magic Lantern, etc) are things that some people do get some use out of. Sports shooters, for example, who don't limit themselves simply to that genre, get lots out of their 5D3s. Also, it's not 'clinging' to AF when you're trying to shoot a fast paced event like a wedding. Manual focus isn't always the most viable option.
Edited by MistaBernie - 6/1/13 at 6:36am
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post #12 of 18
I might be slightly silly but I rarely use anything else but the center focus point. That obviously might be because I'm used to working with abysmally bad cameras.

The card slots are handy, I agree. What puzzles me though is that 6D has WiFi which seems like quite a high-end feature. I could imagine the two cameras being side-by-side in the same price bracket, and even then I'd pick the 6D, but when the other one is a thousand bucks cheaper it's not even a fair competition.
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post #13 of 18
wifi is only useful if you are uploading directly from your camera without any postprocessing (journalists). so it really isnt a deal breaker for most users, it is a nice feature to have but i dont see myself using it.

on the other hand the 1000 dollar i save is a big deal on the 6d, but the AF and dual cards are an even bigger deal on the 5d3....so i would rather spend 1000 more and get a 5d3.
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post #14 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by seepra View Post

However, taking into account the price, I still don't get why someone would get ever so slightly worse performance for significantly more.

And.... enter the D600.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mz-n10 View Post

cause the 6d has a dated AF system....

Which makes the D600 even more attractive than the 6D.

Quote:
Originally Posted by seepra View Post

That's not a deal breaker for me, having worked for pay with Rebels numerous times. Besides I mostly shoot very dark venues like clubs and gigs, so manual focusing is most of the time essential. I only understand clinging to AF for people like bird/sports/car photographers, but for most photographers it'd seem counter-intuitive to rely so heavily on modern technology to get your shots done.

The other argument I've heard against the 6D is the "rebel-like body". Okay it's not magnesium or unobtanium, but how on earth does that affect the photos? From purely photographical point of view, I can't fathom getting a 5DmkIII over the 6D.

Actually, both the 5DIII and 6D have a magnesium chassis. The size of the 6D is extremely close to the 7D, which is far from being "Rebel-sized". And manual focusing in low light with a modern DSLR? Awful. The only company to get this right is Sony, since they offer focus-peaking in the finder -- otherwise you're dealing with (on Canon) a focusing screen with f/2.8 sensitivity, making manual-focusing with any wider aperture setting a horrible guessing game.

Quote:
Originally Posted by seepra View Post

I might be slightly silly but I rarely use anything else but the center focus point. That obviously might be because I'm used to working with abysmally bad cameras.

The card slots are handy, I agree. What puzzles me though is that 6D has WiFi which seems like quite a high-end feature. I could imagine the two cameras being side-by-side in the same price bracket, and even then I'd pick the 6D, but when the other one is a thousand bucks cheaper it's not even a fair competition.

Wifi is more of a gimmick on the 6D, since people who are most likely to use it are either, as mentioned, photojournalists, sports photographers or studio photographers -- none of which are choosing the 6D over the 5DIII, and in the case of studio photography you'll not likely find a Canikonsony very often, as studio photographers tend to gravitate to larger formats.


The downside to the D600, of course, is the nagging oil-on-sensor issue, which kept me from buying one. The upshot is that it's got better image quality than both the 6D and 5DIII and in a smaller, lighter package to boot (blessing/curse scenario there, though). If somebody wants it all, has the money and is brand-agnostic, the D800 is still the absolute best DSLR in my opinion. The 6D is still an excellent deal, but in 2013 it should have shipped with the 7D's AF system -- of course, Canon might have thought that was too good, and risked cannibalizing 5DIII sales, despite numerous other advantages (framerate, buffer size, etc) the 5D offers.
post #15 of 18
Hmm, I guess I have to grit my teeth and try getting used to the Nikon ergonomics if it's that much better (obviously I'm first going to scoot off and read a few thousand reviews and measurements on it before even considering it seriously). Most of my glass is useless anyway since they're meant for crop bodies.

Someone might see it a bit stupid how concerned I'm over signal/noise ratio at high ISOs, but I'm slightly interested in astrophotography, where a difference in SNR translates quite directly into added fidelity in the end-result exposure stack. For most users, I guess the 5DmkIII would be a better idea, although I'm still scratching my head a bit since I've never had that much issues with AF on consumerist bodies and would really love WiFi etc etc etc.

Then again, I get paid for very lame gig photography that's more for blogging than actual publishing/advertisement/anything, so maybe I shouldn't be too worried about IQ and just stick to my 550D/T2i instead
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post #16 of 18
nikon really did do a number on the fullframe market, the d600 is extremely nice for the price and the d800 is on a whole new level compared to every other fullframe DSLR.

and imo thats the problem with the d600, the d800 is only 800 bucks difference and it completely baffles the mind at the IQ.
Quote:
Originally Posted by seepra View Post

Hmm, I guess I have to grit my teeth and try getting used to the Nikon ergonomics if it's that much better (obviously I'm first going to scoot off and read a few thousand reviews and measurements on it before even considering it seriously). Most of my glass is useless anyway since they're meant for crop bodies.

Someone might see it a bit stupid how concerned I'm over signal/noise ratio at high ISOs, but I'm slightly interested in astrophotography, where a difference in SNR translates quite directly into added fidelity in the end-result exposure stack. For most users, I guess the 5DmkIII would be a better idea, although I'm still scratching my head a bit since I've never had that much issues with AF on consumerist bodies and would really love WiFi etc etc etc.

Then again, I get paid for very lame gig photography that's more for blogging than actual publishing/advertisement/anything, so maybe I shouldn't be too worried about IQ and just stick to my 550D/T2i instead

you probably never noticed the AF problem cause youve never used a high end dslr.

from someone that jumped from the sony equivalent of a rebel to full frame, stick with your beginner dslr and figure out exactly what it lacks then purchase the system that does what you need. you will waste alot of money buying a fullframe first then patching the system to make it work. full frame glass is 2-3x more expensive then crop glass on the wide and normal ranges....

full frame isnt all its cracked up to be for everyone.
Edited by mz-n10 - 6/3/13 at 2:12pm
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post #17 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by seepra View Post

I'm first going to scoot off and read a few thousand reviews and measurements on it before even considering it seriously

I'll save you the trouble:

- Huge dynamic range up to ISO 800
- Better low-light performance than both the 5D and 6D
- Possible issues with dust/oil on sensor, Nikon offered a real half-assed "fix" for this (send your camera in), or you can just clean it yourself.
- Slightly larger than the D7000, not noticeable in-hand (personal experience)
- Excellent color depth (better than Canon's offerings once more)
- Same 39-point AF system as D7000 -- literally. Much lower frame coverage than the D700/D800/5DIII

Now that the techie crap is out of the way, if it fits your hand and the lenses you want are available at prices you can afford, buy it. It's a great camera, and better than the 6D in my opinion. Some people can't deal with Nikon's control layout, which I find odd because there is much less combo-pressing then Canon's non-1-series layouts and oft-used functions can be mapped to the dual front buttons. The dual control dials are easier to manipulate when shooting one-handed, and both direction and function can be set to your liking. One trivial detail that most Canon owners will never notice is that lens mounting/unmounting is easier with Nikon because when you're changing one-handed, you release the lens by turning toward the finger depressing the lens release button, which means less chance of dropping the lens once it's been released. It's probably six and one as far as most people are concerned, but it makes sense to me (and this is after shooting Canon bodies for a long time).
post #18 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by mz-n10 View Post

you probably never noticed the AF problem cause youve never used a high end dslr.
Or maybe I use AF in slow enough scenes to work for me. I just don't see it as a big compromise, if even the 6D would be a huge upgrade from the 550D, in terms of speed if not the amount of focus points. The 5DmkIII seems awfully redundant for someone who only uses the center focus point anyway, I', comfortable doing that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mz-n10 View Post

figure out exactly what it lacks then purchase the system that does what you need. you will waste alot of money buying a fullframe first then patching the system to make it work.
I think I mentioned, and my main issue is with high ISO sensitivity noise, because I shoot gigs in rather dark environments and would love to get into astrophotography at some point. There's not much ASP-C sized sensors can offer me, most models would be a lateral switch as opposed to an actual upgrade.

What I don't really get, is that if the 6D seems more than fast enough of a focuser for me, that arguments seems to get invalidated by every other professional photographer, even though for me gains in AF performance over a certain point are diminishing returns, a relatively small thing. The "fastness" seem to be the only merit people pay attention to, when I say I almost exclusively use the center AF point, and the center AF point in 6D works at -3EV, 5DmkIII's works at -2EV. Start seeing the pattern? Yet another enormous point, the near identical/slighty better IQ of 6D for half the price from the 5DmkIII, seems to get completely glossed over. I only get paid in two digit numbers for gigs, for me the savings of a thousand quids are enormous. People seem to forget we are comparing cameras in two completely different price brackets that share similar IQ, for me it's a no-brainer.

The D600 seems like a great competitor for the 6D, and it too is one of the cheapest FFs so I'll have to consider it hard, although the several FF compatible Canon lenses and preferred ergonomics/UI are tipping the scale quite drastically towards Canon, unless there's a huge sale somewhere on D600 suddenly. The differences in ultimate IQ are not enormous from the sample photos and reviews I looked at


Edited by seepra - 6/7/13 at 3:09am
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