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The No Steam Game Selling rule... - Page 2

Poll Results: Sell keys on OCN?

 
  • 100% (2)
    Yes, we should be able to
  • 0% (0)
    No, it will cause too many headaches
2 Total Votes  
post #11 of 53
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bitemarks and bloodstains View Post

Your membership here
http://www.overclock.net/a/terms-of-service

The games are free, you paid $220 for a GPU and got some games with it, anyone purchasing the GPU before or after the promotion will pay $220 for a GPU with no games.

Again the entire FS/wanted is at your own risk.

You can bundle the software with the hardware it came with.

If the entire thread is at our own risk, then I don't see what is the big deal then. If you get ripped off that's your problem, not the sites.

Then why are we allowed to sell anything else on the forum then? I hate using ebay to sell games on because off the associated fees. Craigslist is just..sketchy.
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post #12 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by kaivorth View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bitemarks and bloodstains View Post

Your membership here
http://www.overclock.net/a/terms-of-service

The games are free, you paid $220 for a GPU and got some games with it, anyone purchasing the GPU before or after the promotion will pay $220 for a GPU with no games.

Again the entire FS/wanted is at your own risk.

You can bundle the software with the hardware it came with.

If the entire thread is at our own risk, then I don't see what is the big deal then. If you get ripped off that's your problem, not the sites.

Then why are we allowed to sell anything else on the forum then? I hate using ebay to sell games on because off the associated fees. Craigslist is just..sketchy.

There is a reason the OCN FS/T section has decreased dramatically in the last year.

Edit: On virtual items though, they are tough in nature to verify transaction wise. Turns into a he said she said issue if something goes bad. Where a physical item comes with a tracking number and other such identifiers. Although at some point there is not going to be physical media. A solution would be needed in the future to allow for sales of them or just no software sales at all.
Edited by Gnomepatrol - 5/19/13 at 2:30pm
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post #13 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gnomepatrol View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by kaivorth View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bitemarks and bloodstains View Post

Your membership here
http://www.overclock.net/a/terms-of-service

The games are free, you paid $220 for a GPU and got some games with it, anyone purchasing the GPU before or after the promotion will pay $220 for a GPU with no games.

Again the entire FS/wanted is at your own risk.

You can bundle the software with the hardware it came with.

If the entire thread is at our own risk, then I don't see what is the big deal then. If you get ripped off that's your problem, not the sites.

Then why are we allowed to sell anything else on the forum then? I hate using ebay to sell games on because off the associated fees. Craigslist is just..sketchy.

There is a reason the OCN FS/T section has decreased dramatically in the last year.

Edit: On virtual items though, they are tough in nature to verify transaction wise. Turns into a he said she said issue if something goes bad. Where a physical item comes with a tracking number and other such identifiers. Although at some point there is not going to be physical media. A solution would be needed in the future to allow for sales of them or just no software sales at all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gnomepatrol View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by kaivorth View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bitemarks and bloodstains View Post

Your membership here
http://www.overclock.net/a/terms-of-service

The games are free, you paid $220 for a GPU and got some games with it, anyone purchasing the GPU before or after the promotion will pay $220 for a GPU with no games.

Again the entire FS/wanted is at your own risk.

You can bundle the software with the hardware it came with.

If the entire thread is at our own risk, then I don't see what is the big deal then. If you get ripped off that's your problem, not the sites.

Then why are we allowed to sell anything else on the forum then? I hate using ebay to sell games on because off the associated fees. Craigslist is just..sketchy.

There is a reason the OCN FS/T section has decreased dramatically in the last year.

Edit: On virtual items though, they are tough in nature to verify transaction wise. Turns into a he said she said issue if something goes bad. Where a physical item comes with a tracking number and other such identifiers. Although at some point there is not going to be physical media. A solution would be needed in the future to allow for sales of them or just no software sales at all.

AS you stated the forsale area is an at your own risk. problem solved by the readers responsibility to make sure only to do business with members that have a lot of rep / activity. and to make sure proper payment thru paypal. using purchase of digital goods

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bitemarks and bloodstains View Post

First of all you may not profit for your membership so selling or trading games you got for free would violate the ToS.

While the marketplace is at your own risk for all transactions there are simply more problems with digital items that we are not comfortable with.

2 scenarios
Member A sells a key to member B
Member A activates it before sending it or even before the sale
Member B has no proof that they did not activate the key

So Member A has the money and the key

Member A sells a key to member B
Member B states the key does not work and member A refunds
Member B activates the key

So Member B has the money and the key.

There is simply no way to verify to keys have not been used by the seller prior to sale/the buyer prior to a refund.


Thats why you only do business with known people or well ranked members, and also make sure to use a proper payment method like paypal buying digital goods.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bitemarks and bloodstains View Post

Your membership here
Quote:
||Advertising/Promotion/Commercial Use ||



You ARE NOT allowed to use Overclock.net to:
Advertise or promote products and/or services that you or someone you know has an "interest" in
This includes linking to a personal website
Display affiliate links of any kind
Copy content, images or any other Overclock.net assets (in part or in whole)
Recruit people for other websites/projects/jobs or any other reason
Directly or indirectly profit from your relationship with the site and the people you meet here, now or in the future
http://www.overclock.net/a/terms-of-service

The games are free, you paid $220 for a GPU and got some games with it, anyone purchasing the GPU before or after the promotion will pay $220 for a GPU with no games.

Again the entire FS/wanted is at your own risk.

You can bundle the software with the hardware it came with.


Technically according to the first sale doctrine this is completely legal, the maker of the video card or retailer, already bought said games essentially. they are free to distribute each purchased copy any way they see fit.

the same goes for any subsequent owners:

The first-sale doctrine creates a basic exception to the copyright holder's distribution right. Once the work is lawfully sold or even transferred gratuitously, the copyright owner's interest in the material object in which the copyrighted work is embodied is exhausted. The owner of the material object can then dispose of it as he sees fit. Thus, one who buys a copy of a book is entitled to resell it, rent it, give it away, or destroy it. However, the owner of the copy of the book will not be able to make new copies of the book because the first-sale doctrine does not limit copyright owner's reproduction right. The rationale of the doctrine is to prevent the copyright owner from restraining the free alienability of goods. Without the doctrine, a possessor of a copy of a copyrighted work would have to negotiate with the copyright owner every time he wished to dispose of his copy. After the initial transfer of ownership of a legal copy of a copyrighted work, the first-sale doctrine exhausts copyright holder's right to control how ownership of that copy can be disposed of. For this reason, this doctrine is also referred to as "exhaustion rule."


For digital goods, the use of the cd key ensures the non duplication to ensure only one person can own the game.

problem and legality solved. provided you can prove lawful ownership of said game or cd key then sale or trade should be permitted just as any other object. (most cards come with a little piece of paper with the CD key on it, just take a pic (blurring out the full key) and your OCN name like most other things for sale and their you go.


http://www.1up.com/news/selling-digital-games-feasible-court-decision

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First-sale_doctrine
Edited by Fieldsweeper - 5/19/13 at 2:47pm
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post #14 of 53
My question is, what does AMD says about selling these?
post #15 of 53
AMD/Nvidia/whoever is usually fine with these being sold, but OCN management/staff do not want them sold here.
post #16 of 53
What about selling it unscratched? And have to physically mail the card?
post #17 of 53
Again refer to the the ToS
Quote:
||Advertising/Promotion/Commercial Use ||



You ARE NOT allowed to use Overclock.net to:

Directly or indirectly profit from your relationship with the site and the people you meet here, now or in the future
http://www.overclock.net/a/terms-of-service
post #18 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by ghostrider85 View Post

What about selling it unscratched? And have to physically mail the card?

Quite honestly it really isn't worth the hassle of trying to meet the vast list of requirements. I would just head over to another forum and do it there. There are plenty of other options.
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post #19 of 53
Bottom line here:

This site gets hassles from the sale of these items, and no/little profit for the trouble.

Ebay takes a cut of your sale, so they're willing to deal with the headache of disputes.
post #20 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bitemarks and bloodstains View Post

First of all you may not profit for your membership so selling or trading games you got for free would violate the ToS.

While the marketplace is at your own risk for all transactions there are simply more problems with digital items that we are not comfortable with.

2 scenarios
Member A sells a key to member B
Member A activates it before sending it or even before the sale
Member B has no proof that they did not activate the key

So Member A has the money and the key

Member A sells a key to member B
Member B states the key does not work and member A refunds
Member B activates the key

So Member B has the money and the key.

There is simply no way to verify to keys have not been used by the seller prior to sale/the buyer prior to a refund.

Middle men.
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