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[Anand] The Xbox One: Hardware Analysis & Comparison to PlayStation 4 - Page 18

post #171 of 249
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePath View Post

Just keep mind that quad core jaguar @1.6Ghz is not as fast 17w i3 3217U, so, octa core jaguar is not as fast as two i3 3217U

i5 2500 should easily beat two i3 3217U

In other words, even if those consoles have octa core, it has much less performance than quad core desktop CPU. People should not worry about how much cores they have, what really matters is how powerful is your CPU

your statement is not true for multithreaded performance. in well multithreaded benchmarks like cinebench r11.5 multithreaded the quad core jaguar is as fast (even slightly ahead) of a core i3 at same clocks.

http://hothardware.com/Reviews/AMD-2013-ASeries-Kabini-and-Temash-Mobile-APUs/?page=5

The 8 Jaguar cores in PS4 / Xbox One will push developers to adopt wide multithreading in next gen console games.

http://www.guerrilla-games.com/presentations/Valient_Killzone_Shadow_Fall_Demo_Postmortem.pdf

read "what we've learned" slide. the developer says "Wide multithreading is a must, consider using jobs"

What you can expect is AMD's Steamroller FX to outperform Haswell core i5 (maybe even core i7) as most next gen console to PC ports would be fully capable of exploiting 4+ threads.
Edited by raghu78 - 5/26/13 at 2:45am
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post #172 of 249
Quote:
Originally Posted by paulerxx View Post

RRoD or not, we're talking about units. Which the Xbox 360 has sold more, people wouldn't have re-bought the console unless they really enjoyed it.


Xbox 360 72.24 mil vs PS3's 72.20
steamcommunity.com/app/221410/discussions/0/828939797057469949/

...As people mentioned, they were invested in the console. If I'd just paid for 12 months XBL Gold I'd likely buy a new 360. Hell, I've gone through 3 of the damn things because I already had games, etc.

Besides, you completely ignored my other point: The PS3 has definitely shipped more consoles, but the X360 has sold more...Where are Sony shipping those PS3s to if demand is not ramping up?
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post #173 of 249
Quote:
Originally Posted by raghu78 View Post

your statement is not true for multithreaded performance. in well multithreaded benchmarks like cinebench r11.5 multithreaded the quad core jaguar is as fast (even slightly ahead) of a core i3 at same clocks.

http://hothardware.com/Reviews/AMD-2013-ASeries-Kabini-and-Temash-Mobile-APUs/?page=5

The 8 Jaguar cores in PS4 / Xbox One will push developers to adopt wide multithreading in next gen console games.

http://www.guerrilla-games.com/presentations/Valient_Killzone_Shadow_Fall_Demo_Postmortem.pdf

read "what we've learned" slide. the developer says "Wide multithreading is a must, consider using jobs"

What you can expect is AMD's Steamroller FX to outperform Haswell core i5 (maybe even core i7) as most next gen console to PC ports would be fully capable of exploiting 4+ threads.

While agree about gaming favoring AMD eventually as more games are developed multi threaded, saying SR > Haswell is wishful thinking and misinformed. By the time games are well enough threaded for SR to overtake Haswel we will be a couple of gens ahead and be arguing about 10/12 AMD cores vs 4-6 Intel cores. Though I still have high hopes for SR, and still sorta want a 8320.
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post #174 of 249
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePath View Post

Just keep mind that quad core jaguar @1.6Ghz is not as fast 17w i3 3217U, so, octa core jaguar is not as fast as two i3 3217U

i5 2500 should easily beat two i3 3217U

In other words, even if those consoles have octa core, it has much less performance than quad core desktop CPU. People should not worry about how much cores they have, what really matters is how powerful is your CPU

That line of thinking would've been valid back in 2005.

This is 2013. There's a concept called, "GPU-computation".

Intel's HD IGPs would've been way too weak for their usage, even if they tripled the die size. There are many benchmarks that show AMD's APUs beating similarly priced Intel's equivalents in gaming, especially if paired with fast RAM. They would've also demanded a high price, like what they did with the iPhone (Hint: It doesn't uses Intel's CPU).

AMD on the other hand has HSA, which allows plain C++ coding on the GPU, and a shared memory system so no wasteful copying occurs. A properly coded GPU-computation on a 7850-7870 is going to blow even the i7 3930K out of the water in highly multi-threaded performance. Should the CPU be too weak, developers can utilize HSA to offload some of the work onto the GPU.

Another advantage with the octo-core CPU, even if lowly clocked, is that games ported from consoles will have a native 7-8 core support.
Edited by A Bad Day - 5/26/13 at 6:06am
post #175 of 249
LOL who cares who gonna have better harware forza will allways will be better then turizmo and ps4 won't have halo
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post #176 of 249
Quote:
Originally Posted by Junkboy View Post

While agree about gaming favoring AMD eventually as more games are developed multi threaded, saying SR > Haswell is wishful thinking and misinformed. By the time games are well enough threaded for SR to overtake Haswel we will be a couple of gens ahead and be arguing about 10/12 AMD cores vs 4-6 Intel cores. Though I still have high hopes for SR, and still sorta want a 8320.

the PS4 / Xbox One architecture would have been disclosed to developers atleast 2 years back. the first gen PS4 / Xbox One titles will exploit the 8 Jaguar cores. Killzone Shadow fall is a PS4 launch title. Game engines like Frostbite 2 already support 4+ threads. Frostbite 3 powering the upcoming Battlefield 4, UnrealEngine 4, Cryengine 3 will exploit the 8 cores. Another advantage is PS4 / Xbox One having the same 8 Jaguar cores. So makes it easier for developers unlike the last gen where PS3 Cell was completely different from Xbox 360 CPU. As for Steamroller FX vs Haswell core i7 quad core we will know in 6 months time.
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post #177 of 249
Quote:
Originally Posted by raghu78 View Post

your statement is not true for multithreaded performance. in well multithreaded benchmarks like cinebench r11.5 multithreaded the quad core jaguar is as fast (even slightly ahead) of a core i3 at same clocks.

http://hothardware.com/Reviews/AMD-2013-ASeries-Kabini-and-Temash-Mobile-APUs/?page=5
.

1- You are wrong because I'm talking about i3 3217U but in your link you have i3 2377m. Those are two difference processor. i3 2377m is old 17w CPU based on SB and has lower clock

2- i3 3217U beats quad core kabini @1.5Ghz in every multi-threaded benchmark
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/kabini-a4-5000-review,3518.html

The PS4 CPU has higher 1.6GHz clock speed but it won't make much difference over 1.5Ghz model.
Edited by ThePath - 5/26/13 at 7:45am
post #178 of 249
Quote:
Originally Posted by LukaTCE View Post

LOL who cares who gonna have better harware forza will allways will be better then turizmo and ps4 won't have halo

Everyone stopped caring about Halo games after Halo 3, since they're all the same now.


Missing out on Forza will be a little disappointing, but just because one game is the best at something doesn't mean the others are terrible.
And what's to say Forza 5 won't be terrible? It's not like M$ is incapable of screwing that one up too.
post #179 of 249
Quote:
Originally Posted by A Bad Day View Post

That line of thinking would've been valid back in 2005.

This is 2013. There's a concept called, "GPU-computation".

Intel's HD IGPs would've been way too weak for their usage, even if they tripled the die size. There are many benchmarks that show AMD's APUs beating similarly priced Intel's equivalents in gaming, especially if paired with fast RAM. They would've also demanded a high price, like what they did with the iPhone (Hint: It doesn't uses Intel's CPU).

AMD on the other hand has HSA, which allows plain C++ coding on the GPU, and a shared memory system so no wasteful copying occurs. A properly coded GPU-computation on a 7850-7870 is going to blow even the i7 3930K out of the water in highly multi-threaded performance. Should the CPU be too weak, developers can utilize HSA to offload some of the work onto the GPU.

Another advantage with the octo-core CPU, even if lowly clocked, is that games ported from consoles will have a native 7-8 core support.

GPU computation is great, but it going to take awhile for developers to learn to really utilize it. Just as with previous console generations, there's going to be a learning curve associated with exploiting new features and concepts in order to maximize their use of the available graphical and computational power. If it's anything like the last generation, they'll hit their stride about the same time as the next generation of desktop CPU and GPU's hit the market.

While I have no doubt that consoles will have much better capabilities than the last generation, the fact remains that their static hardware will place them even farther behind the curve within a year or two. By comparison, the PS3 and 360 were more powerful than this generation when compared to existing PC specs.
post #180 of 249
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePath View Post

1- You are wrong because I'm talking about i3 3217U but in your link you have i3 2377m. Those are two difference processor. i3 2377m is old 17w CPU based on SB and has lower clock

2- i3 3217U beats quad core kabini @1.5Ghz in every multi-threaded benchmark
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/kabini-a4-5000-review,3518.html

The PS4 CPU has higher 1.6GHz clock speed but it won't make much difference over 1.5Ghz model.
PS4's apu clock is rumored to be 2GHz on the cpu part
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