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[Various] GTX 780 Reviews - Page 210

post #2091 of 2543
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majin SSJ Eric View Post

But Golden Tiger is getting a 780 ACX so its definitely better, cooler, quieter, and faster in every way than anything else... tongue.gif

The review he posted shows the 780 consistently beating the Titan.

Doesn't that say something? Or maybe I was tired reading an article again.

Also I remember you saying you couldn't wait 3 months for the 780 otherwise you would have gotten them instead of Titan.
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post #2092 of 2543
Quote:
Originally Posted by bencher View Post

The review he posted shows the 780 consistently beating the Titan.

Doesn't that say something? Or maybe I was tired reading an article again.

Also I remember you saying you couldn't wait 3 months for the 780 otherwise you would have gotten them instead of Titan.

There are factory OC 780s that beat stock Titans.

When someone from OCN OC's both the Titan will outperform the 780 unless the guy got a crappy Titan and a golden 780. And even then it's very much debatable.

The biggest problem is that both cards are limited to 265W for overclocking reviews and 250W for stock ones. The 780 draws less and comes closer in reviews and even beats the Titan due to this.

However it doesn't matter for us. The most I've pulled with my Titan is around 330W. So there's zero reason for me to care about a review that doesn't represent my usage scenario.
 
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post #2093 of 2543
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ha-Nocri View Post

Interesting, but not surprising at all, is that 7950 is the better performer than 680 @1440p due to it's wider memory bus.

Memory bandwith is likely one factor, but how you get doesn't mean as much.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bencher View Post

Doesn't that say something?

That the Titan wasn't clocked as high.
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post #2094 of 2543
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blameless View Post

Memory bandwith is likely one factor, but how you get doesn't mean as much.
That the Titan wasn't clocked as high.

780 Gtx 780's price isn't clocked as high either.
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post #2095 of 2543
Quote:
Originally Posted by bencher View Post

780 Gtx 780's price isn't clocked as high either.

What a pun!

Sorry..just got done a long shift at my desk.
     
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post #2096 of 2543
Quote:
Originally Posted by bencher View Post

780 Gtx 780's price isn't clocked as high either.
lol, good to see you back bencher thumb.gif
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post #2097 of 2543
Quote:
Originally Posted by bencher View Post

780 Gtx 780's price isn't clocked as high either.

That's not the argument.

There is utterly no doubt that the 780 offers better price/performance, but 19 times out of 20, a Titan will be faster than a 780 because the Titan can almost always clock similarly and will always be faster at equivalent clocks.
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post #2098 of 2543
Quote:
Originally Posted by bencher View Post

780 Gtx 780's price isn't clocked as high either.

Well the GTX 780 lacks 3 GB of VRAM that is usable by the GK110 (and I mean it can be saturated, not there to suck in noobs to think that VRAM is the god specification to how good a GPU is) and for the scientifically-capable, the FP64 Double Floating Point Precision hardware enabled (again disabled hardware on the 780 "to cut the price tag").

Those two things lacking on the 780 can justify somewhat the $350 price tag reduction (excluding the fact the 780 is two SMX bins down as well).

Realistically, the 780 is the recommended card to get for gamers as obviously its Price to Performance is better than the Titan. However it doesn't mean the Titan is an overpriced, worthless thing. The Titan still takes the kingship of purist OC speeds and it can do more than just gaming, making it a card designed for many graphics needs and just on games.

If you don't like the Titan, that is fine, but say the 780 is superior and the Titan is overpriced rubbish because as of this moment, the 780 is still not better than the Titan as king of single GPU's and Titan's high price tag also gives it features designed more than just gaming. Finally, no one here has said Titan is good value for money (even us owners are not saying it either).

There is a slight chance that non-reference boards of the 780 can beat the Titan after intense OC, but I have a feeling nVidia might not let that happen though (by not providing really good cherry-picked dies for OEM's to put in their non-reference PCB's)...
    
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post #2099 of 2543
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majin SSJ Eric View Post

But Golden Tiger is getting a 780 ACX so its definitely better, cooler, quieter, and faster in every way than anything else... tongue.gif

Do you have anything to talk about other than rude remarks saying I'm conceited?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alatar View Post



There are factory OC 780s that beat stock Titans.

When someone from OCN OC's both the Titan will outperform the 780 unless the guy got a crappy Titan and a golden 780. And even then it's very much debatable.

The biggest problem is that both cards are limited to 265W for overclocking reviews and 250W for stock ones. The 780 draws less and comes closer in reviews and even beats the Titan due to this.

However it doesn't matter for us. The most I've pulled with my Titan is around 330W. So there's zero reason for me to care about a review that doesn't represent my usage scenario.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alatar View Post

*reads unread posts*

TDP limited benches and reviews
Comparing driver tweaked scores to non driver tweaked scores (mrtooshort's 83fps is a non tweaked score, wholeeo's 78 is tweaked)
Claiming I think valley is the end all be all of benches when actually the opposite is true if you read my posts, hell it's only 1080p
"best titan score doesn't count but the best 780 score does!"

I don't even know...

Benches wise this is the same as the 670 - 680 situation. Every now and then you'd see a 670 close to the top among the 680s but getting those cards is rare, they would compare to average 680s. And even then the 680 would always win every bench.

Sigh, yet again you take things out of context and misquote what the reasons behind them being said were...

Overclockers.com wasn't TDP-limited benching and reviewing.
I'm not getting into the giant debate you had in the valley thread, I take the scores at face value.
I mention Valley because you brought it up several times as did others.
"best titan score doesn't count vs. 780 one counting" if you read my posts, I explained that already. There is ONE... literally ONE... Titan with three months of people buying them and posting scores (out of probably hundreds of owners reading that thread), that has gone above 83fps, while it's been a couple of days with probably 10 results or less from 780 cards, and they're already reaching into spitting distance from the best Titans. Thus you can easily conclude the 87fps result is beyond just being a high score but actually an anomaly, not a "golden card" even.

Again, no one said the Titan is slower outright, but the performance difference is just this side of nil. We're talking low single-digit percentages here oc-to-oc (which on this site is what matters to most people), and stock-to-stock the 780 models available do indeed beat the Titan ones available as far as what you can buy out of the box, which is the only scenario I've said the 780 wins at directly.

Re: Golden 780 vs. "bad" Titan... we have seen I think one 780 that someone said here on the forums couldn't go past 1200mhz, while the others all are at 1220-1240 here and in reviews. Most Titans can't go past around 1150-1180, barring the occasional gold one that hits 1202 or 10mhz higher. With the current data the 780 appears to have an oc'ing clockspeed advantage, but as I keep saying, it's too early to say outright that the 780 will generally clock higher, however it does appear that will be the case with several professional reviews hitting 1230-1254 and all but one of the forum mentions I've seen hitting 1200+. So, it's hardly a case of "golden 780" vs. a so-called "bad Titan".
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blameless View Post

That's not the argument.

There is utterly no doubt that the 780 offers better price/performance, but 19 times out of 20, a Titan will be faster than a 780 because the Titan can almost always clock similarly and will always be faster at equivalent clocks.

It is indeed the argument I have been talking about this whole time. However, as I said above regarding performance... you really can't say anything confidently but the obvious (IPC is higher on Titan due to more hardware being enabled). Reviews and user results so far show the 780 clocks higher on average than the Titan, which negates the IPC advantage significantly and as I keep saying, brings it into the low-to-mid single digits in percentage as a difference. Again, though, we just don't have a large sample size yet since the card came out literally days ago over the course of a holiday weekend. We'll know more soon enough.
Edited by GoldenTiger - 5/29/13 at 12:21am
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post #2100 of 2543
-As long as you push the volts to 1212mV most titans will hit 1189-1215MHz.

-Mrtooshort just posted this:


and Eric hasn't posted a tweaked score as far as I know.

-non flashed Titans are always TDP limited with OCs higher than 1075MHz or so

-I brought heaven up as a simple example and added that it's 1080p meaning that you will get higher differences at higher resolutions

-I can beat the best 780 score that was at 1228MHz and on watercooling, by over 5% with a card that's at 1175MHz and stock air cooling. I think that means that it's not low single digits. So yes if you want a 780 that will beat even a mediocre/bad titan (say 1163mhz max which would net you just around 80fps in valley), you would need a ~1250MHz+ 780 to even maybe get even with the Titan.

-most of the reviewers hitting any clocks have said it's "up-to" X MHz. Only when you're able to do full runs at a certain steady frequency does it mean that the cards actually clock that high

I'm sorry but it just isn't as fast. Not until you have 780s normally sometimes beating and sometimes losing to the best Titans around. As I said it's the 670 argument all over again.
Edited by Alatar - 5/29/13 at 12:32am
 
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CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
[i7 5960X @ 4.8GHz] [Rampage V Extreme] [Titan 1400MHz (1500MHz bench)] [Various] 
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[250GB 840EVO +2x SpinpointF3 1TB RAID0] [LD PC-V2 SS Phase Change] [XSPC X2O 750 pump/res] [Monsta 360 full copper + EK XT 360 + XT 240] 
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[Crossover 27Q LED-P 1440p+ASUS 1200p+LG 1080p] [Corsair AX1200] [Dimastech Easy v3.0] [Sennheiser HD558s] 
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Benching
(17 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
[i7 5960X @ 4.8GHz] [Rampage V Extreme] [Titan 1400MHz (1500MHz bench)] [Various] 
Hard DriveCoolingCoolingCooling
[250GB 840EVO +2x SpinpointF3 1TB RAID0] [LD PC-V2 SS Phase Change] [XSPC X2O 750 pump/res] [Monsta 360 full copper + EK XT 360 + XT 240] 
MonitorPowerCaseAudio
[Crossover 27Q LED-P 1440p+ASUS 1200p+LG 1080p] [Corsair AX1200] [Dimastech Easy v3.0] [Sennheiser HD558s] 
CPUCPUMotherboardGraphics
FX 8320, FX 8350, Phenom II x2 555BE i7 3930K, i7 860, i7 4770K, 68x Celeron D CVF, commando, 2x RIVE, Z87X-OC Asus 4870x2, Sapphire 4870 
GraphicsGraphicsGraphicsGraphics
2x 5870, 5850, 5830, 5770 2x 3870x2, 3870 GTX Titan, GTX 480, GTX 590 GTX 285, GTX 260, 4x 9800GT, 8800GTX 
RAMHard DriveCoolingCooling
4x4GB vengeance, 2x4GB predatorX, 2x1GB OCZ DDR2 Intel X25-M 80GB LD PC-V2 SS Phase Change OCN Marksman 
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2x old tek slims (GPU) Various watercooling stuff win7, winxp AX1200 
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test bench / cardboard box 
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