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post #41 of 488
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rickcooperjr View Post

OP only thing i can say is this watch these videos these were done on nearly identical setups minus one is Intel I5 3570k other is AMD FX 8350 he tried them overclocked and on win7 64bit and win8 64bit he gets down to the nitty gritty with the info price differences / costs of the power in long run / performance overall and so on and also this is done by Linus from Linus tech tips a notorious Intel fanboy ( also sponsored by Intel by the way ) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ICVeN6WEGgg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uD6UcsVG56g http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YHnsfIJtZ2o these videos are actualy very well tested with nearly all variables taken out so they are a good basis to make your choices off on modern games at modern resolutions with modern high end settings in otherwards not the BS synthetic testing and testing in general at 800x600 crap non relavent res the tests are done on modern games with actual gameplay with modern res / high end settings.

I would also like to point out the AMD FX 8350 overclocks like a mad man
http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2779392 5.0ghz x8 100% percent stable i dont use ti for 24/7 because i dont like where voltage goes underload 1.56v range
http://valid.canardpc.com/2813140 4.8ghz x8 my 24/7 overclock set at idel 1.428v underload it hits 1.448v which is well under safe recommended and is my 24/7 overclock period all eco features off.
with proper tweaking can get alot more performance with more than just cpu overclocking like tightening ram timings running 1866mhz ram@1t and also a slight NB bump ( sweet spot for me is 2400mhz some get 2600mhz ) on the AMD FX 8350 make it jump and run like a scolded dog that just got shot in @#$ with rocksalt.

this is the AMD FX 8150 vs Intel I5 2500k remember this is the older AMD bulldozer but it should still be relavent http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1kd4dvLJQP4


Op understand there are alot of Intel fanboys on this site ( I am sure you are noticing this) they pray to the all mighty Intel gods so PLZ take alot of theyre comments and such with a grain of salt facts are in modern games with modern resolutions and proper core utilization the AMD FX 8350 performs perfectly well and stays in good playable for cheaper and has the multithreaded horsepower for work / rendering and such for cheaper the future is multithreaded this is just facts with next gen consoles being 8core AMD's to get games to function properly multithreading will have to be opptimized period and considering 90% of games are first made for console then ported to PC do you not see this as an advantage for the AMD in multithreaded situations which is where it shines.

http://www.expertreviews.co.uk/games/1296739/xbox-one-specs-release-date-features-news xbox one formerly called xbox 720 AMD jaquar 8core 1.6ghz x8
http://www.expertreviews.co.uk/games/1298257/ps4-price-release-date-controller-specs-news PS4 AMD jaquar 8core 2.0ghz x8
you can search further on specs and such also these consoles will have AMD APU graphics in DX11 range of around ATI HD 7760-7870


also OP the latest testing of the haswell cpu's have only shown a 7% perfomance increase over previous gen Intel CPU's and at best case 10% the main performance increase is to the onchip graphics built into the haswell which any high end gamer wont use lol they will go a descrete GPU route. http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/core-i7-4770k-haswell-performance,3461.html http://www.techpowerup.com/181582/intel-core-i7-4770k-haswell-tested-not-a-leap-ahead-of-i7-3770k-but-consistent.html http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/cpu/display/20130509193636_New_Benchmark_Results_of_Intel_Core_i_Haswell_Hit_the_Web.html http://wccftech.com/intel-haswell-core-i5-sample-pictured-benchmarked/ these are just a few.

OP i put this extra info and such in to make sure you have good info to make your decision from and are not spoon fed biased Intel fanboy BS facts are the AMD FX 8350 is a perfectly viable gaming CPU and is cheaper OP you started this thread to get good info and have pointed out you are on a tight budget so i have laid it out as best i can hope you understand this and for the Intel fanboys stop being so biased it makes you look like idiots rather than inteligent as another poster said lay out the pros and cons which i have.
I have seen Linus videos about that before and it looks like the 8350 loses by like 10 frames on average in most of the games.

You guys are saying that the fx 8350 will get less frames than the 3570k but it will feel identical sense it's over 60, but what about when games start to become more demanding and since the i5 3570k gets like 15fps more in a lot of games I could be getting 60 on Intel and like 45 on the fx 8350 I can tell a difference there. Its so hard to chose a cpu. I would get Haswell if I could afford it but since it going to be more than a Ivy bridge setup I'd have to get that. But I wouldn't want the ivy bridge because 1155 is at the end of its life...
post #42 of 488
OP also remember the AMD steamroller will drop right into the socket the AMD FX 8350 / 8320 fits in also. I also want to point out the frame difference is because present game design is formed around heavily single thread performance next gen consoles will force market to go multithreaded so that 10fps difference will disapear in future and likely the 8350 will outperform the I5 3570k in all situations and more compete with the I7 3770k once multithreading becomes more used and optimized for the AMD archetecture which next gen consoles will force into the game designing even Linus adresses this and quotes im looking at you game developers.

remember when quad core processors realy benefited you no extra noticeable FPS gains over dual cores then next thing you know the same quads ran circles around the duals that is what next gen consoles will force to happen again.
Edited by rickcooperjr - 5/25/13 at 10:05am
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post #43 of 488
When you watch a movie it appears "smooth" right? That is only 24 FPS.
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post #44 of 488
Haswell is crap for a new arch for us desktop users it brings nothing, unless you care more for 10W power consumption than your time.
The FX 8350 isn't a bad processor by any means but not what you'd want with bad optimized games.
Edited by maarten12100 - 5/25/13 at 10:39am
post #45 of 488
Thread Starter 
So I'm leaning towards the 8350 now.
post #46 of 488
Quote:
Originally Posted by rickcooperjr View Post

OP also remember the AMD steamroller will drop right into the socket the AMD FX 8350 / 8320 fits in also. I also want to point out the frame difference is because present game design is formed around heavily single thread performance next gen consoles will force market to go multithreaded so that 10fps difference will disapear in future and likely the 8350 will outperform the I5 3570k in all situations and more compete with the I7 3770k once multithreading becomes more used and optimized for the AMD archetecture which next gen consoles will force into the game designing.

By that time, all three CPUs will be lackluster and who are you to project what the future will be like? IPC has been and always will be what matters most. Until AMD improves this area it won't matter how many cores and how high of clock their chips boast. They can release a 10 core Piledriver and it would still get beat by a 4 core Sandy/Ivy Bridge and most definitely Haswell CPU.

Also, Broadwell will drop right into LGA 1150 and Steamroller will be equivalent to Sandy Bridge at best.
post #47 of 488
Haswell isn't worth it if you're not concerned with power consumption and iGPU performance IMO.
If you're planning on buying a discrete GPU, I'd just go with a i5 3570k or the FX8350.

But I would lean on the FX8350 because it trade blows with the 3770k in some cases.
Or you can shave off a couple of dollars and get the FX8320. It's pretty much the same with lower clocks, and they overclock the same.

Since you're on a tight-ish budget, I think it's ideal. It may allow you to buy a better GPU, which will benefit you the most in games.

Just my opinion.
Edited by vinton13 - 5/25/13 at 10:36am
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post #48 of 488
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruennis View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by rickcooperjr View Post

OP also remember the AMD steamroller will drop right into the socket the AMD FX 8350 / 8320 fits in also. I also want to point out the frame difference is because present game design is formed around heavily single thread performance next gen consoles will force market to go multithreaded so that 10fps difference will disapear in future and likely the 8350 will outperform the I5 3570k in all situations and more compete with the I7 3770k once multithreading becomes more used and optimized for the AMD archetecture which next gen consoles will force into the game designing.

By that time, all three CPUs will be lackluster and who are you to project what the future will be like? IPC has been and always will be what matters most. Until AMD improves this area it won't matter how many cores and how high of clock their chips boast. They can release a 10 core Piledriver and it would still get beat by a 4 core Sandy/Ivy Bridge and most definitely Haswell CPU.

Also, Broadwell will drop right into LGA 1150 and Steamroller will be equivalent to Sandy Bridge at best.

well facts are AMD has been working on the IPC alot and that is one of theyre goals with the steamroller and add to it also better all around performance of around 15% or more they are optimizing theyre new architecture just as Intel has had a chance to do for many years on same architecture yet now Intel is now in a scramble because they know with current architecture they dont have much left to optimize / refine other than mild revisions and minor improvements including die shrinks which Intel is currently near limit of benefit performance wise hince why the past few gens have been so mild of a performance increase and apparently haswell is exactly same minor improvement by less than %10 with AMD averaging 10%-15% every revision or more it wont be long till AMD could be side by side with Intel or pass Intel period that is just facts and next gen consoles being AMD gives AMD the funds and optimizations game programing / coding wise to do just that.

remember AMD CPU's will get top priority from day one programing wise this is required since consoles will be AMD 8core jaquar cores which is alot like the bobcat cores which is the laptop version of the AMD FX line so basicaly this meens the AMD CPU's will be top priority on design of the games which again 90% of games are made for console then ported over to PC this meens alot of Intels advantage will be romoved programing wise aka the issue with the dirty Intel compiler / CPU dispatcher this meens games will more than likely perform more evenly less biased than previously a little info on this is http://www.agner.org/optimize/blog/read.php?i=49 scroll down till you see green and read then this goes all the way to 5/2012 Intel compiler / CPU dispatcher so it is very relavent till this day given 90% of gaming industry still use this in game design which will have to be changed to build next gen games for next gen consoles inheriting that optimization flowwing over into PC side of games.


http://ftc.gov/opa/2010/08/intel.shtm this is where the FTC or US federal goverment stepped in and charged Intel with just this issue that i pointed out previously about the Intel compiler / CPU dispatcher issue read specifically part where it says ( In addition, the FTC settlement order will require Intel to: ) this mentions exactly what previously i talked about and add to it Intel is still releasing theyre compilers this way because the FTC order didnt specifically tell them to fix it but advised them to offer funding for secondary companies ( game developers like EA / Bethesda / Actavision and so on ) to fix it for them and who in theyre right mind as a game developer would want to do so and go head to head with Intel titan so they just kept on using the biased compiler and waited for others to step up and not many have still till this day because of fear of retaliation from Intel.
Edited by rickcooperjr - 5/25/13 at 11:34am
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post #49 of 488
Some of you amd guys crack me up. Yeah lets not spend the money on a 4670K that just adds more performance to the already amd butt kicking 3570K.

OP lets delve into the "Games are going to need more cores" excuse given by the Amd fans. Below me have Civ 5 that can use up to 8 cores



Pay close attention to the 8150 and 2500K. The 8150 has 8 cores and the 2500K has 4 but if "Moar Cores" mean everything why is the 2500K ahead of the 8150 by 30%? If you listen to the amd fans reasoning that games will use more cores then why is an 8 core losing to a 4 core? The reason is because amd uses 8 weak cores while intel uses 4 strong cores.

Here's an early 4670K review from asia

http://diy.pconline.com.cn/330/3308491_3.html

Do you play Starcraft 2? Then you definitely want Intel



Resident evil 5? Again Intel



Onto Crysis 3 which uses more then 4 cores



Well look at that. 4 cores beat 8 cores in multithreaded games.

Z87 will support Haswell and Broadwell processors. Broadwell is the unknown. If amd can add 10-15% IPC with steamroller expect to see an Intel 6 core with broadwell for 3xx dollars
Edited by Stay Puft - 5/25/13 at 11:45am
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post #50 of 488
AMD are not the strongest CPU, but i am glad to see them at least trying to push out innovative stuff, intel has been the same since P4 near enough.

I hope Steamroller at least catches to a 2600k thumb.gif
Edited by amd655 - 5/25/13 at 12:17pm
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