Overclock.net › Forums › Components › Mice › The unspecific Mouse Thread
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

The unspecific Mouse Thread - Page 51

post #501 of 2023
Quote:
Originally Posted by qsxcv View Post


sensitivity 1 means you turn 0.022 (or whatever m_yaw is) degrees for 1 mouse count

Exactly, you aren't adding artificial counts in that way. Try the fov 1 test I mentioned earlier, it's easier to see that way.
my baby
(14 items)
 
   
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
4690k ASUS H97M-e/CSM GTX 970 Mixed Brand 
Hard DriveOSMonitorKeyboard
Samsung 850 EVO Windows 10 ASUS VG248QE Corsair K65 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Corsair CX500 Corsair SPEC-01 Steelseries Kinzu Sudden Attack SteelSeries QcK+ 
AudioAudio
HyperX Cloud II Sennheiser Momentum IEMs 
CPUGraphicsRAMHard Drive
i7-2860QM@2.5GHz AMD Radeon 6770M 1GB Crucial 16GB DDR3L 1333MHz SODIMM For Mac  Samsung 850 EVO  
OSMonitorMouseAudio
MAC OSX El Capitan High-res Upgraded display 1680x1050 15.6" Steelseries Kinzu Sudden Attack RHA MA750 
  hide details  
Reply
my baby
(14 items)
 
   
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
4690k ASUS H97M-e/CSM GTX 970 Mixed Brand 
Hard DriveOSMonitorKeyboard
Samsung 850 EVO Windows 10 ASUS VG248QE Corsair K65 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Corsair CX500 Corsair SPEC-01 Steelseries Kinzu Sudden Attack SteelSeries QcK+ 
AudioAudio
HyperX Cloud II Sennheiser Momentum IEMs 
CPUGraphicsRAMHard Drive
i7-2860QM@2.5GHz AMD Radeon 6770M 1GB Crucial 16GB DDR3L 1333MHz SODIMM For Mac  Samsung 850 EVO  
OSMonitorMouseAudio
MAC OSX El Capitan High-res Upgraded display 1680x1050 15.6" Steelseries Kinzu Sudden Attack RHA MA750 
  hide details  
Reply
post #502 of 2023
there are no artificial counts being added
(the amount of degrees you turn horizontally) = (x counts from mouse) * (sensitivity) * (m_yaw)
(the amount of degrees you turn vertically) = (y counts from mouse) * (sensitivity) * (m_pitch)

it's not
(the amount of pixels your screen shifts by) = (counts) * (sens)

as long as the finest granularity (how many degrees you turn for 1 mouse count) is smaller than the smallest feature you need to aim at in-game, you're fine. that's why haggard mentioned a sens between 1-3 in-game
main
(15 items)
 
old
(14 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
4770k maximus vii impact nvidia gtx 970 crucial ballistix tactical 16gb 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
crucial mx100 noctua nh-c14 windows 7 ultimate sony cpd-g520 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
kbp v80 matias quiet silverstone sx500-lg ncase m1 v3 logitech g100s with mcu replaced by teensy2.0 
Mouse PadAudioAudio
allsop raindrop xl chord mojo hifiman re-600 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 920 evga x58 sli le galaxy gtx 460 crucial something 3x1gb 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
intel 330 180gb scythe kotetsu windows 8.1 pro sony cpd-g520 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
logitech k120 silverstone st75f-gs nxzt h440 evga torq x5 
Mouse PadAudio
allsop raindrop mobo 
  hide details  
Reply
main
(15 items)
 
old
(14 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
4770k maximus vii impact nvidia gtx 970 crucial ballistix tactical 16gb 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
crucial mx100 noctua nh-c14 windows 7 ultimate sony cpd-g520 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
kbp v80 matias quiet silverstone sx500-lg ncase m1 v3 logitech g100s with mcu replaced by teensy2.0 
Mouse PadAudioAudio
allsop raindrop xl chord mojo hifiman re-600 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 920 evga x58 sli le galaxy gtx 460 crucial something 3x1gb 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
intel 330 180gb scythe kotetsu windows 8.1 pro sony cpd-g520 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
logitech k120 silverstone st75f-gs nxzt h440 evga torq x5 
Mouse PadAudio
allsop raindrop mobo 
  hide details  
Reply
post #503 of 2023
Quote:
Originally Posted by qsxcv View Post

there are no artificial counts being added
(the amount of degrees you turn horizontally) = (x counts from mouse) * (sensitivity) * (m_yaw)
(the amount of degrees you turn vertically) = (y counts from mouse) * (sensitivity) * (m_pitch)

it's not
(the amount of pixels your screen shifts by) = (counts) * (sens)

as long as the finest granularity (how many degrees you turn for 1 mouse count) is smaller than the smallest feature you need to aim at in-game, you're fine. that's why haggard mentioned a sens between 1-3 in-game

I realize what you are saying. But in order to get the least "granularity" you should use higher CPI and lower sens as a genral rule of thumb.
my baby
(14 items)
 
   
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
4690k ASUS H97M-e/CSM GTX 970 Mixed Brand 
Hard DriveOSMonitorKeyboard
Samsung 850 EVO Windows 10 ASUS VG248QE Corsair K65 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Corsair CX500 Corsair SPEC-01 Steelseries Kinzu Sudden Attack SteelSeries QcK+ 
AudioAudio
HyperX Cloud II Sennheiser Momentum IEMs 
CPUGraphicsRAMHard Drive
i7-2860QM@2.5GHz AMD Radeon 6770M 1GB Crucial 16GB DDR3L 1333MHz SODIMM For Mac  Samsung 850 EVO  
OSMonitorMouseAudio
MAC OSX El Capitan High-res Upgraded display 1680x1050 15.6" Steelseries Kinzu Sudden Attack RHA MA750 
  hide details  
Reply
my baby
(14 items)
 
   
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
4690k ASUS H97M-e/CSM GTX 970 Mixed Brand 
Hard DriveOSMonitorKeyboard
Samsung 850 EVO Windows 10 ASUS VG248QE Corsair K65 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Corsair CX500 Corsair SPEC-01 Steelseries Kinzu Sudden Attack SteelSeries QcK+ 
AudioAudio
HyperX Cloud II Sennheiser Momentum IEMs 
CPUGraphicsRAMHard Drive
i7-2860QM@2.5GHz AMD Radeon 6770M 1GB Crucial 16GB DDR3L 1333MHz SODIMM For Mac  Samsung 850 EVO  
OSMonitorMouseAudio
MAC OSX El Capitan High-res Upgraded display 1680x1050 15.6" Steelseries Kinzu Sudden Attack RHA MA750 
  hide details  
Reply
post #504 of 2023
That's more like it. But then of course the question only becomes how fine a granularity is enough. I posted this before, but in CS the smallest thing you are going to be aiming for is a player model's head.

This on a distance (dust2 A long; ~1000units) where you can hardly make out the head with your eyes on your screen, i. e. where "aiming by pixels" is hardly a thing anymore, not to mention that rifle inaccuracy on this range makes overly precise aiming futile to begin with. And even here the head is still 2 pixels wide. You can calculate what radial space 2 pixels amount to for a given resolution, and it's 0.2238° here. Which is ~3.4 times the amount of granularity sensitivity 3 (0.2238 / (3 * 0.022)) gives you. Meaning that even at the higher end of common sensitivities you are still rotating by more than fine enough angles to make it essentially a non-factor in terms of your aiming performance.

tl;dr: You CAN go for higher CPI in order to decrease your in-game sensitivity. But whether you SHOULD? Not if you are already in the acceptable range.
post #505 of 2023
Quote:
Originally Posted by HAGGARD View Post

That's more like it. But then of course the question only becomes how fine a granularity is enough. I posted this before, but in CS the smallest thing you are going to be aiming for is a player model's head.
img
This on a distance (dust2 A long; ~1000units) where you can hardly make out the head with your eyes on your screen, i. e. where "aiming by pixels" is hardly a thing anymore, not to mention that rifle inaccuracy on this range makes overly precise aiming futile to begin with. And even here the head is still 2 pixels wide. You can calculate what radial space 2 pixels amount to for a given resolution, and it's 0.2238° here. Which is ~3.4 times the amount of granularity sensitivity 3 (0.2238 / (3 * 0.022)) gives you. Meaning that even at the higher end of common sensitivities you are still rotating by more than fine enough angles to make it essentially a non-factor in terms of your aiming performance.

tl;dr: You CAN go for higher CPI in order to decrease your in-game sensitivity. But whether you SHOULD? Not if you are already in the acceptable range.

So you're saying I should turn down my m_yaw? /s

Hmm seems that you are right 0.022*0.875*1600 would mean I rotate 30.8 degrees per inch. So that is 360/(0.022*0.875*1600) ≈ 11.36 inch per 360 ≈ 30cm/360
Does that mean my screen does not change if my mouse moves just a few counts?
Edited by Calluna - 2/5/16 at 2:34pm
post #506 of 2023
Quote:
Originally Posted by Calluna View Post

Does that mean my screen does not change if my mouse moves just a few counts?
Yes, absolutely. Go in-game and try sensitivity 0 (it will actually be 0.0001; it's the lower limit for some reason). Mouse rowing for days before you see much movement. Since it is 3D projected onto 2D the pixels on the sides begin moving first and stuff and you will probably notice the change more in the changes in aliasing and diagonals before you see any actual rotation.

Decreasing in-game sensitivity still has the benefit of making the rotation smoother though, so going away from 400cpi in order to turn down the sensitivity value is definitely a legitimate thing to do, - just, it's not going to improve your aim. You are just shifting the precision determinant from the game to your hand, while again, 1-3sens is already precise enough anyway as far as the game goes. You can get more precision from turning down sensitivity and keeping your CPI though. The angular granularity may already be sufficient now, but the increased precision there comes from the larger room for error for your hand.
post #507 of 2023
@Haggard thx, I actually changed from 800*1.75 and feel like it is smoother. Don't know if this is the reason though, maybe my mouse likes the cpi better?(logitech g9) or maybe just a placebo.
Thinking about it its strange that we use a 2d input to control a 3d movement.
post #508 of 2023
Quote:
Originally Posted by Calluna View Post

@Haggard thx, I actually changed from 800*1.75 and feel like it is smoother. Don't know if this is the reason though, maybe my mouse likes the cpi better?(logitech g9) or maybe just a placebo.
Thinking about it its strange that we use a 2d input to control a 3d movement.

Go offline, stand at the back of dust 2 (goose) and look into pit. Type cs_fov_debug 1 into console. Move mouse at 1600 @ 0.875 and 800 @ 1.75, at the high dpi/lowsens you will get less pixel skipping.

I will post a vid later tonight
my baby
(14 items)
 
   
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
4690k ASUS H97M-e/CSM GTX 970 Mixed Brand 
Hard DriveOSMonitorKeyboard
Samsung 850 EVO Windows 10 ASUS VG248QE Corsair K65 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Corsair CX500 Corsair SPEC-01 Steelseries Kinzu Sudden Attack SteelSeries QcK+ 
AudioAudio
HyperX Cloud II Sennheiser Momentum IEMs 
CPUGraphicsRAMHard Drive
i7-2860QM@2.5GHz AMD Radeon 6770M 1GB Crucial 16GB DDR3L 1333MHz SODIMM For Mac  Samsung 850 EVO  
OSMonitorMouseAudio
MAC OSX El Capitan High-res Upgraded display 1680x1050 15.6" Steelseries Kinzu Sudden Attack RHA MA750 
  hide details  
Reply
my baby
(14 items)
 
   
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
4690k ASUS H97M-e/CSM GTX 970 Mixed Brand 
Hard DriveOSMonitorKeyboard
Samsung 850 EVO Windows 10 ASUS VG248QE Corsair K65 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Corsair CX500 Corsair SPEC-01 Steelseries Kinzu Sudden Attack SteelSeries QcK+ 
AudioAudio
HyperX Cloud II Sennheiser Momentum IEMs 
CPUGraphicsRAMHard Drive
i7-2860QM@2.5GHz AMD Radeon 6770M 1GB Crucial 16GB DDR3L 1333MHz SODIMM For Mac  Samsung 850 EVO  
OSMonitorMouseAudio
MAC OSX El Capitan High-res Upgraded display 1680x1050 15.6" Steelseries Kinzu Sudden Attack RHA MA750 
  hide details  
Reply
post #509 of 2023
Guys you are only considering the ideal case of very slow movement. Perception of smoothness is dictated also by the regularity of the counts being delivered. If your high CPI setting have lots of jitter it will feel very, very unsmooth ingame.
post #510 of 2023
Obviously the primary determining factor should be at which CPI the mouse performs its best. But that seems to be pretty irrelevant with modern mice. 800cpi is definitely safe territory and already noticeably more smooth (0.5-1.5 instead of 1-3 sensitivity range). I would use it but MLT04 etc.

Funnily enough both sensitivity and m_yaw have their lower limit at 0.0001 in GO. Making 0.00000001° per count the absolute minimum rotation possible. Or 100000000 counts per 1°; 250000 inch per 1° at 400cpi; 90000000 inch per 360°; 228600000cm/360°. Literally 2286km mouse movement for 360°.
Edited by HAGGARD - 2/5/16 at 5:07pm
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Mice
Overclock.net › Forums › Components › Mice › The unspecific Mouse Thread