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Haswell Overclocking Guide [With Statistics] - Page 761

post #7601 of 19539
what is degradation? srry i'm a noob at overclocking lol but almost got 2hrs stress testing done but cant seem to find out whats the max vcore both these programs telling me different!
is it okay to use the - offset and when I boot into Windows it shows 3.XXX w/e V. when I use + offset it shows 1.XXX V. idk how it jumps that high when using negative mode

post #7602 of 19539
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by NightHawk06 View Post

what is degradation? srry i'm a noob at overclocking lol but almost got 2hrs stress testing done but cant seem to find out whats the max vcore both these programs telling me different!
is it okay to use the - offset and when I boot into Windows it shows 3.XXX w/e V. when I use + offset it shows 1.XXX V. idk how it jumps that high when using negative mode

I just use Hwinfo man.

Degradation happens when you run too high a voltage on a CPU. There are two dangers to overclocking, temps and degradation. Temps are easy to detect. Degredation is mostly independent of temps. Over the long term, you will eventually find that the CPU requires more voltage to stay stable under the same frequency and it will get worse and worse. By long term, I'm talking months down the road, and there is not much we can do to see whether one voltage will degrade or not. We are going by rough estimates and guessing in some parts.

 

In my opinion, degradation is a possibility once you go above 1.4. 1.45, 1.5, and higher. That said, one can make the argument that by the time it degrades, you probably already upgraded your CPU because it's been so long. I am running 1.42v for the record.

No, to date there are no documented incidents of degradation because those cases by itself are few and far in between, and they take a loooong time to surface typically. 

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post #7603 of 19539
Quote:
Originally Posted by soulbytes View Post

@eliteghost have you tried run hyperpi 32mb ? And run an hour or two xtu stress test cpu and memory see if its stable. Cheers

Just finished running xtu for 2 hours did an hour on cpu and an hour on memory, passed both. Also ran hyper pi and passed. So I guess raising my cache ratio voltage to 1.140 made it stable? I would like to go higher but since I need 1.140 to get 4ghz stable is pretty bad.
post #7604 of 19539
XTU is rubbish. Go run OCCT Large or x264 IMO
post #7605 of 19539
Quote:
Originally Posted by error-id10t View Post

I don't think you're reading my posts? Either way I'm happy for you to OC any way you want but let me ask you a question; is VCCIN value more important under idle or load? If you say under load which I'm going to assume you will, then your advise doesn't make any sense.

No I am reading it, but Eng is not my native language so I might have some trouble with communication..


Ok I'll try one more time,
I don't want to use max LLC because at max it will heat more then by LLC5-6, also higher cpu current will heat more as well, especially if I raise both at the same time.

And all DIGI+ values at auto can be unstable at higher OC, cpu current probably to low at auto value..

So the perfect balance so far was LLC6 & current 120% or LLC5 & 130%, at higher 4.6Ghz+ OC, at least in my case.


About SVID aka VCCIN,. All it needs is to have certain amount and that's it, small VCCIN vdrop wont magically make it unstable, cpu current to low will make it sooner. Yes higher LLC will prevent it from dropping to much (LLC5 makes 0.003v -0.004v drop, LLC6 no drop or very minimal 0.001-0.002v), while cpuv is fixed and doesnt drop even with LLC1.

Now I don't mind running VCCIN with higher LLC or to have "higher VCCIN idle" then at load., But I mind it if I can use lower LLC and have lower cpu temp this way (at full load)..

*there is also a initial VCCIN in my case ~ 1.95 -1.98v, but i have no control of that.


Look all at stock , DIGI+ at auto and it still has small VCCIN drop.. Its the same by LLC5 or LLC6,


Also LLC isn't connected only to VCCIN, it also affects VCCSA, VTT, to high will put other voltages higher and thus heat up more..


^
So this is my only reason why I brought DIGI + section in the first place >> to use lower temps at same cpuv and for stability reasons. Sometimes auto is not the best.

If you dont like tweaking DIGI+ section and believe ASUS perfected it, then ok. But I dont agree with that, it can be ok up to ~ 1.20v, but anything higher needs extra tweaking for sure smile.gif
Edited by TheHunter - 12/30/13 at 7:48pm
post #7606 of 19539
I'm all for new ideas and posting about them, otherwise this thread would just keep going in circles (no offense to anyone). I'm just trying to understand what you're seeing and why I don't see it.

So that said and comparing our relatively similar systems (Pro vs. your Delux), I don't see any changes in VTT or VCCSA values when I change LLC. For me they are as below regardless if I use LLC7 or go down to LLC5:

VCCSA = 0.840v idle/load
VTT = 1.104v idle / 1.120v load

I'm going to assume the different values we see for these 2 specifically is due to our RAM speed and volt differences (me; 2400MHz @ 1.65v). If someone knows better, they can chime in.

So the only thing that changes for me is VCCIN. For me when I move down from LLC7 to LLC5, the drop in VCCIN under load is 0.03v (compared to what you say 0.003v), so in my case 1.85v goes down to 1.82v. LLC7 keeps it steady idle/load.

Also note that if you do enable SVID, you don't have control of VCCIN anymore. I assume this is why you noted your "initial VCCIN which you have no control over"? From memory when I enabled SVID, VCCIN is shown as 1.82v.

Regarding what I have in DIGI+, the only item I leave on auto is frequency as I've yet to see any proof that setting this to a manual value improves anything.

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post #7607 of 19539
Quote:
Originally Posted by jayfresh1271 View Post

Thats a good chip i am new to intel overclocking. But my chip so far need these setting to get to 4.3Ghz
CPU Model:i5 4670K
Core Multiplier: X43
CPU VID: 1.20v
Vcore: 1.30v
Uncore Multiplier: x35
Input Voltage 1.91
I ran prime95 small FFT for 3:30 hours n so far no problems intelburn test on high for 10 loops
1.3V to get to 4.3ghz is on the high side. It doesn’t leave much headroom for a higher multiplier. I will try to take my chip to 5ghz once I get my Phobya 200 xtreme and throw that in my loop. I think I may be able to get it with 1.35v but there is no way to tell without actually trying it….May even have to delid depending on temps once I get there.
post #7608 of 19539
Thread Starter 

And Jayfresh, a 0.1v voltage variance between loads? Are you sure you're not stressing on adaptive? That is a huge variance.

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post #7609 of 19539
Quote:
Originally Posted by EliteGhost View Post

Just finished running xtu for 2 hours did an hour on cpu and an hour on memory, passed both. Also ran hyper pi and passed. So I guess raising my cache ratio voltage to 1.140 made it stable? I would like to go higher but since I need 1.140 to get 4ghz stable is pretty bad.

Hummm i think you already have a quite stable CPU i dont think you need extra voltage on that. You can try btw smile.gif .. maybe is not enough for BF4 .. i read somewhere in this thread .. when you have your system stable but not working properly in BF4 then blame the game. Btw try to uninstall you Video driver and install the new one. What Vide card do you use right now ?

To make sure your stability run x264 lets see if its ok.

cheers.
Edited by soulbytes - 12/30/13 at 11:20pm
post #7610 of 19539
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by soulbytes View Post


Hummm i think you already have a quit stable CPU i dont think you need extra voltage on that. You can try btw smile.gif .. maybe is not enough for BF4 .. i read somewhere in this thread .. when you have your system stable but not working properly in BF4 then blame the game. Btw try to uninstall you Vide driver and install the new one. Btw what Videcard do you use right now ?

To make sure your stability run x264 lets see if its ok.

cheers.

BF4 is notoriously glitchy, especially at release day. It's getting better I think, but it's not perfect.

Were you the guy that I talked to about Vring? If so, try not to break 1.3v on it. 

 

If not, have a beer on me. :drink:

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CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
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CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
XPSC Raystorm Pro Watercool Heatkiller 1080ti Full Cover Waterblock EK XTOP Revo Dual D5 (Serial, PWM, v4) EK ZMT (1/2 - 3/4 ID OD) 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
14xEK ACF (Compression Fittings) EK x4 250 (v2) Distilled Water + PT Nuke (Copper Sulphate) 24x140mm Silent Wings 3 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Windows 10 Pro 64bit Catleap 27 Inch 2560x1440 IPS 60hz Display Coolermaster Storm Trigger (Brown Switches) EVGA P2 1000w 
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Corsair Air 540 Logitech G Pro Tek Syndicate "Raze the World" Desk Mat O2 + Odac by Mayflower Electronics (Rev A) 
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Aquaero 6 LT + Aluminum Heatsink 
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i5 6600k Delid @ 4.848/4.848 Asus z170 Hero MSI GTX 980ti @ 1499/4082 1.25v/134% Power 2 x 8gb Gskills Ripjaws V 3131 16-16-16-32 
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