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Haswell Overclocking Guide [With Statistics] - Page 86

post #851 of 19539
LLC effects VCCIN or CPU input voltage on Haswell and has nothing to do with the Core voltage. So it will help stabilize your OC to an extent but as long as you are around 0.4V above your core voltage you should be good.
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post #852 of 19539
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ali Man View Post

LLC at auto too? What kinda temps are you getting?

Yep LLC is at auto. Literally the only things I've changed in BIOS to this point are the multi, vcore and selected the XMP profile for my ram (2400Mhz).

You think I should play around with LLC or any other voltages to get Prime stable?

Temp in AIDA (FPU Only) maxed at 92C which was the highest I saw from any test. IBT/Prime was around 86-88C Max from what I recall (I'm at work at the moment). With everything checked for the AIDA stability test it was lower than that, maybe 83C but I don't have my notes at the moment so don't quote me on that.
Edited by combatant3219 - 8/18/13 at 8:30pm
post #853 of 19539
VCCIN effects VCCIN, CPU input voltage effects CPU input voltage and LLC effects the Vdroop or Vrise of the CPU VCore. I don't know what you're talking about, but LLC has always remaind a VDroop controller even with Haswell.

Setting it to the max makes you have full control over the specified VCore that you input in the bios or software, if it goes a little over that VCore, then its VRise, as stated before in this thread.
post #854 of 19539
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ali Man View Post

VCCIN effects VCCIN, CPU input voltage effects CPU input voltage and LLC effects the Vdroop or Vrise of the CPU VCore. I don't know what you're talking about, but LLC has always remaind a VDroop controller even with Haswell.

Setting it to the max makes you have full control over the specified VCore that you input in the bios or software, if it goes a little over that VCore, then its VRise, as stated before in this thread.
What he meant is that LLC setting doesn't affect the Vcore directly. But it will drop the Input Voltage if LLC is disabled or too low when the CPU is stressed. But the FIVR will try its best to still keep the Vcore and other voltages stable. But there is so much it can do. It Input Voltage drops below a threshold value, the FIVR won't be able to keep all voltages stable. And that might cause a BSOD.
post #855 of 19539
What's the general consensus on LLC? Auto or Maxed out?
post #856 of 19539
Quote:
Originally Posted by adam2104 View Post

What's the general consensus on LLC? Auto or Maxed out?
Maxing out is alright I guess. People kept it a notch below the max with SB and IB because at stress load, the Vcore rose past the value set in BIOS causing temps to go up. Haswell doesn't have that issue. The temps would slightly go up due to VRIN being higher, but it is not as bad as Vcore going up.
post #857 of 19539
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ali Man View Post

VCCIN effects VCCIN, CPU input voltage effects CPU input voltage and LLC effects the Vdroop or Vrise of the CPU VCore. I don't know what you're talking about, but LLC has always remaind a VDroop controller even with Haswell.

Setting it to the max makes you have full control over the specified VCore that you input in the bios or software, if it goes a little over that VCore, then its VRise, as stated before in this thread.

Nope, change LLC and it will change VCCIN. There is no Vdroop with Haswell and LLC has ZERO effect on your core voltage. Try changing it and see if it changes your core voltage. This is quoted directly from ASUS ROG Article; Introduction to Fully Integrated Voltage Regulator
Quote:
The Key Lesson: VCCIN = +0.4 VCore

Intel defines the VCCIN specification (called the ‘Eventual CPU input voltage’ in the ROG BIOS) in relation to CPU Vcore as follows:

Less than 0.4V – not recommended. Instability is almost guaranteed
0.4V – ideal value
0.4-0.6V – general ‘OK’ range
Above 0.6V – not recommend as long-term damage can occur
Generally speaking, higher VCCIN can cause a higher CPU temperature

As all 5 internal power rails are pulled from the single VCCIN, below 0.4V difference is not recommended as high loading on the;input voltage will cause a voltage drop that can lead to it being lower than the internal voltages. This will cause the system to lock-up. Above the safe range can cause long-term damage due to a larger than necessary potential difference. This is the same reasoning why DDR3 voltage should not exceed 1.5V, as the CPU Uncore can be damaged.

Due to the small voltage difference, the Maximus VI Extreme now has 8 Steps of VCCIN Load-Line Calibration, up from 5 in the previous generation, to more accurately moderate its VCCIN according to detected loading.

Try playing with your settings before calling someone out, although many here would like to think that I don't know what I am talking about I put the time in and get to know my hardware. Granted all boards are different and some settings and names may differ it is all the same basic concept because the CPU is constant.
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post #858 of 19539
So I played around with changing the core voltage in BIOS to see how much the Vcore value changes and it doesn't. It stays at 1.296V from 1.260V-1.285V, so this can't be right. When I was stress testing my system failed at 1.270V, 1.275V, and 1.280V and that is why I eventually ended up with 1.285V for 4.7 GHz. So if the Vcore is the same for all of these settings then why did it fail at the lower values? Also why is the Vcore not staying at a static voltage when it is set to Manual mode. Notice how the VID is behaving like it should. There is no way this reading is accurate on my board, it just doesn't behave the way Vcore should. This is why I have been skeptical all this time...

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If this in indeed CPU core voltage then it breaks the rules of Manual voltage entry, and it would mean that I could set my BIOS voltage at 1.260V and it should be stable at 4.7 GHz.
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post #859 of 19539
I see the exact same behavior in HWMonitor on my Z87-Pro. Certain core voltages read the same in HWMonitor (max load value). However, I get an increased stability if I raise the vcore even if the value reported in HWMonitor doesn't change. The value reported by CPUID always changes however.

I also see the fluctuating vcore during idle as well. I thought manual meant it was set to that at all times. CPUID reflects this. HWMonitor does not. I'm not about the load the Asus AISuite bloatware to compare that though.
post #860 of 19539
Quote:
Originally Posted by adam2104 View Post

I see the exact same behavior in HWMonitor on my Z87-Pro. Certain core voltages read the same in HWMonitor (max load value). However, I get an increased stability if I raise the vcore even if the value reported in HWMonitor doesn't change. The value reported by CPUID always changes however.

I also see the fluctuating vcore during idle as well. I thought manual meant it was set to that at all times. CPUID reflects this. HWMonitor does not. I'm not about the load the Asus AISuite bloatware to compare that though.

I am currently inquiring directly with Asus about this and I plan to try to get Intel to comment too. It might be something specific to Asus boards and HWMonitor and HWInfo are reading incorrectly. It just doesn't make sense and up until not long ago I just ignored that particular value. It doesn't behave as the Core voltage should and on mine it even reads 0.000V at idle most of the time, even with Manual override enabled. Something is amiss...
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