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Haswell Overclocking Guide [With Statistics] - Page 94

post #931 of 19539
When I tried the auto oc setting with easy tune the gigabyte tool, it said 4.7gh was stable however it gave a 1.31 v and the max temps where going over 90c so I turned it back to 4gh. Green to go up in clock or down in volts??
post #932 of 19539
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Quote:
Originally Posted by combatant3219 View Post


Thanks. I think I'll just aim for 42x uncore then. AAfterall clockspeed is king and I thing the performance gain over 42x is probably negligible.

From my testing, a 100mhz increase in core clock is a performance increase similar to an increase of 1400mhz in uncore. In other words, very small. It's quite hard to overclock ring bus by 1.4ghz anyways. smil3dbd4e4c2e742.gif

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by darkelixa View Post

When I tried the auto oc setting with easy tune the gigabyte tool, it said 4.7gh was stable however it gave a 1.31 v and the max temps where going over 90c so I turned it back to 4gh. Green to go up in clock or down in volts??
Congrats on hitting 4.7, you have a good chip.
You have to define what 'max temps' are, in other words, max temps doing what? Stressing? If 4.7ghz @ 1.31v leads to 90C and you really don't feel 90C is ok during stressing, then lowering that to 4.6ghz will easily let you get into a good temperature.
 
I'm at 1.4v atm testing my CPU for 4.6ghz. If I had done Linpack stressing I think I would literally go above 110C and implode my CPU. But I don't build a machine to do that, and doing my own daily activities, worst case I get 80C so I'm fine.

Edited by Darkwizzie - 8/20/13 at 5:03am
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post #933 of 19539
I did a prime 95 blend test and the temps went 90, 91,92, turned off prime straight away. It was a stress test yes. Is it safe to have the cpu running at those frequencies every day for gaming, benchmarking, video editing etc and what is a safe core volt. From what I read on the intel website, 72.5 is the max temp for an i5 4670k
post #934 of 19539
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darkelixa View Post

I did a prime 95 blend test and the temps went 90, 91,92, turned off prime straight away. It was a stress test yes. Is it safe to have the cpu running at those frequencies every day for gaming, benchmarking, video editing etc and what is a safe core volt. From what I read on the intel website, 72.5 is the max temp for an i5 4670k

The frequencies won't kill your chip, your voltage or temps would. I see, you got 92C before you finished the test. Now you have a choice to make.

 

Also, screw Intel website, they said 10% extra voltage and I ran around with 1.4v or higher on air. They want to be conservative with their values. Anything under 80C is A-ok. 85C is getting hot, 90C is pretty hot and should be minimized, typically should only be observed under stress tests. 95C+ is getting really bad. 100C is downright dangerous. And silly me, long story short (it's 5am and I never slept), I hit 99C on accident and I'm still standing. Not saying hitting 99C is recommended, but the 72.5C figure is complete BS.

 

Now about your choice: You can either decide for your overclock that you must pass Prime or some synthetic stress test, or you can try to go for broke. By that I mean, gun for 4.7 or even 4.8ghz by upping the voltage (along with lowering uncore to stock for overclocking core, ram to non-xmp, vccin to 2.0v, etc) but ditching synthetic benchmarks alltogether. You can still stress, but only with real world workloads. Encoding a video with only CPU hits 100% load on all cores. Doing a deep chess analysis achieves a similar result. And as long as you hit good temps and you are stable doing those things, you should be stable gaming and doing any normal load that hits 100% all cores.

 

Or, you can require passing Prime, but then you have to lower you overclock most likely. Now, you did say those voltages were from auto-overclock. You may be able to wrestle a lower voltage but stay at the same core multiplier. Have you tried that?

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post #935 of 19539
Thank you for the explaining post:)

Yes in the Bios the uncore stays on the auto 3.4 and the auto tuning basically just changes the vcore and changes the core clock to 40,42,47, etc, The stress testing was only merely done to see if the system was stable becuase when I was running the system at stock clock speeds I would get a random Bios screen almost every time saying that my cpu's clock speed or ram speed where wrong and If i wanted to change the settings or boot into windows. I believe this was from most likely a corrupt Bios as I have not seen that error for a while. However with that said, If i turn the xmp setting on my ram, its only a matter of time before I get a blue screen.

Would I have to change the core voltage for 4.7gh or is the 1.214v high enough?

Sorry its my first time overclocking
post #936 of 19539
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darkelixa View Post

Thank you for the explaining post:)

Yes in the Bios the uncore stays on the auto 3.4 and the auto tuning basically just changes the vcore and changes the core clock to 40,42,47, etc, The stress testing was only merely done to see if the system was stable becuase when I was running the system at stock clock speeds I would get a random Bios screen almost every time saying that my cpu's clock speed or ram speed where wrong and If i wanted to change the settings or boot into windows. I believe this was from most likely a corrupt Bios as I have not seen that error for a while. However with that said, If i turn the xmp setting on my ram, its only a matter of time before I get a blue screen.

Would I have to change the core voltage for 4.7gh or is the 1.214v high enough?

Sorry its my first time overclocking

No problem, we're here to help if we can.

 

Is 1.214v high enough for 4.7ghz? Haswells vary A LOT in the amount of voltage required for an overclock, unfortunately. One guy might require 1.2, another might require 1.5+, and I'm actually not exaggerating. So I don't know how good your CPU is. We have general ideas, whether this much voltage for a clock makes your CPU relatively good or bad, but not hardcore figures.

 

In other words, and unfortunately, I don't know for sure. Now if I had to guess based upon the voltages most people need to get to 4.7 (unless you happen to be the luckier one), 1.214 is probably too low. You can test for stability via CPU encoding or Chess. A CPU intensive game that stresses all cores like BF3 or Crysis 3 will also work but they are a notch lower in temperature/stressing. I'd start by going at 1.214v, start playing your favorite game (or whatever CPU intensive thing you do that makes you want this fast CPU in the first place, or you can encode without GPU or chess), and if you crash, it might very well be a Bsod with 124 code, meaning not enough core voltage. Then ramp up the voltage a bit. Just don't exceed 80, 85C while gaming or encoding. Or of course, you can say, Prime or fail, in which case you're limited to what you can do and you have to work around the thermals.

 

Typically what I do to overclock though, I ditch auto-overclock as they are generally unreliable sources of information. Plus, if you're gunning for 4.7ghz, you don't know how much voltage is required for 4.6ghz. And if everything works against you when you go for 4.7, you're almost there but you can never get stability just right, you can settle for 4.6ghz which would then be guarenteed stability.

 

If you've got time to burn and you want to see how many people overclock their CPUs, feel free to go to the first post in this thread with my guide. It lays out a good framework on how to overclock step by step.

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post #937 of 19539
Couple of questions for the pros. First, how do I get my vcore to stop rising so high above core? What setting is that? My core maxes at 1.27 but vcore shoots up to 1.3 during prime and it's just to hot pushing me up to 92C. It seems to scale with how much core I set.

Second, I locked down 4.4 just fine with my 4770k and gigabyte z87 force board but 4.5 seems impossible. I only need 1.225 for 4.4 with vcore hitting 1.25 but from 1.25 up to 1.27 prime will fail within 30min on 4.5. Really doesn't make a difference in time before bsod with any voltage between those mentioned.

I've read the gigabyte guide on here, tried all the voltage tricks and settings with ring, uncore, vrin etc. The only thing I can think of is to add more core but I can't without vcore going sky high. Dropping my ram speed from 2133 to 1866 seems to add time before bsod but won't prevent it. I can't think of what else to do.

Last, if I'm stuck at 4.4 is that decent on air or should I play the lotto again? Thanks!
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post #938 of 19539
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by batman900 View Post

Couple of questions for the pros. First, how do I get my vcore to stop rising so high above core? What setting is that? My core maxes at 1.27 but vcore shoots up to 1.3 during prime and it's just to hot pushing me up to 92C. It seems to scale with how much core I set.

Second, I locked down 4.4 just fine with my 4770k and gigabyte z87 force board but 4.5 seems impossible. I only need 1.225 for 4.4 with vcore hitting 1.25 but from 1.25 up to 1.27 prime will fail within 30min on 4.5. Really doesn't make a difference in time before bsod with any voltage between those mentioned.

I've read the gigabyte guide on here, tried all the voltage tricks and settings with ring, uncore, vrin etc. The only thing I can think of is to add more core but I can't without vcore going sky high. Dropping my ram speed from 2133 to 1866 seems to add time before bsod but won't prevent it. I can't think of what else to do.

Last, if I'm stuck at 4.4 is that decent on air or should I play the lotto again? Thanks!

I'm not going to label myself as a 'pro' but I'll tell you what I observed after patrolling my own thread.

 

Vcore does seem to elevate above what you set into BIOS when under high load. No, there isn't a way to mitigate that as far as I have seen. And yes, your observation is correct, it does seem the higher the vcore set, the higher the jump. There is a little bit of controversy as to whether the CPU is indeed drawing more voltage or the sensors are just being stupid. My opinion is yes, the CPU is drawing higher power. The latest news it seems, is some people saying the reason why Crysis 3 also seems to bump the voltage is because it uses AVX (as does the latest version of Prime),. but I also feel any load that hits 100% all cores will bring about that higher voltage.

 

Is 4.4 decent on air? Well, for one metric, you can compare yourself to others. You do this by going to the first page of my thread (this thread) and looking at other people's overclocking results, while checking their cooling solution and stress test. As you might know Linpack is the real hottie of the bunch, Prime not as much but still sizzling. I think your CPU is below average and it's further aggrevated by the heat given off by your stress test. You seem set on using Prime as your metric of whether your OC is acceptable or not, and in that case you may very well be thermally limited. Is it HORRBLE of a CPU? Nah, but it is below average. Should you play the lotto again? I feel you have greater than 50/50 chance of getting a CPU as good if not better than your current CPU but is it worth the hassle? Uhm... Personally for me, no. But how performance crazy are you? That varies of course.

 

I consider the average person to be able to hit say, 4.5, 4.6ghz using a synthetic stress test, with a slight lean torwards 4.6.

I had to squeeze in a high voltage and ditch synthetics alltogether to shoehorn in 4.6ghz, but in the end I got it through and it serves my usage scenario. You too may have to choose to stay with prime, be thermally limited, or go out on a limb and ditch synthetics to bypass the incredible heat given off by (only) synthetic stress tests.

 

Hope I helped.


Edited by Darkwizzie - 8/20/13 at 5:56am
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post #939 of 19539
Well i read the asus oc guide for my mobo and understand a bit more now. So im having a bit more fun i guess too.

prime ran fine on different tests for a 4300MHz:
43x / 1.25
With uncore at -3x
With eventual cpu voltage at +0.45 from cpu voltage
With Memory locked at 1600 / 1.5v

Ive now applied same reasoning to 44x / 1.3 and will see how tests go. Temps are a bit high at 78degC im worried higher clocks wont be easy. If this stays stable i might start reducing the voltage before increasing clocks. Then get to memory last.

Is that roughly an ok strategy? (Im new)
post #940 of 19539
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomxlr8 View Post

Well i read the asus oc guide for my mobo and understand a bit more now. So im having a bit more fun i guess too.

prime ran fine on different tests for a 4300MHz:
43x / 1.25
With uncore at -3x
With eventual cpu voltage at +0.45 from cpu voltage
With Memory locked at 1600 / 1.5v

Ive now applied same reasoning to 44x / 1.3 and will see how tests go. Temps are a bit high at 78degC im worried higher clocks wont be easy. If this stays stable i might start reducing the voltage before increasing clocks. Then get to memory last.

Is that roughly an ok strategy? (Im new)

Bro, we're all new. Haswell is new. cheers.gif

 

Let me clarify here. It's 6am now and I still have not slept, and I think I forgot your specific overclocking issues. Did you say you crashed with stock uncore but PASSED with x40 uncore? That's very odd. My tests and what I've seen, setting uncore to the stock manually is the surefire way of taking uncore crashes out of the equation. If you overclock uncore and core at the same time, you have four variables changing at one time: Vcore, Vring, core multiplier, uncore multiplier. Things get foggy when you crash. If your uncore is only 300mhz behind your core overclock, you might run into issues due to uncore if you get a higher core clock. For example, setting x46 core clock for me, x41 required a 1.27v for Vring. I'm not even sure I'm able to get in 4.3ghz uncore without using an unsafe voltage.

 

I really feel the best practice is to set the uncore to stock. Not only does it eliminate issues with high uncore decreasing core overclockability, and an easier time figuring out what is causing the crash, but you don't lose anything by changing one variable at a time. The uncore can wait until you're done with core.

 

If you're stressing with synthetics, stay south of 95C, watch the temps closely when you're going above 89C. Keep in mind day to day usage will never hit anywhere close to your synthetic stressing temps. And if you are hardcore enough to go further you will be thermally limited most likely and you either have to delid, get H100i, or ditch synthetics.

 

And yes, I do recommend not overclocking ram at the start. It's good practice in science and in figuring things out to change one thing at a time. You run in with overclocks on core, uncore, ram, you will Bsod like there is no tomorrow and be confused as to what is causing the crash. So do the core first with uncore at stock. Then do the uncore, then do the ram. If you are at uncore and you crash you know it's uncore multiplier or voltage issue as you're already done with core overclocking and testing, etc, etc.

 

Hopefully this is coherent, I've past vegetable state a few hours ago.

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XPSC Raystorm Pro Watercool Heatkiller 1080ti Full Cover Waterblock EK XTOP Revo Dual D5 (Serial, PWM, v4) EK ZMT (1/2 - 3/4 ID OD) 
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14xEK ACF (Compression Fittings) EK x4 250 (v2) Distilled Water + PT Nuke (Copper Sulphate) 24x140mm Silent Wings 3 
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