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[Independent] German police test the threat posed by 3D-printed guns by printing their own - Page 4  

post #31 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by L D4WG View Post

Single shot is not useless, image a gang printing a gun each time they wanted to hit someone, walk up behind then with gloves on, shoot, leave the gun at the scene...

Im not sure a bow is faster or more accurate than a gun either...

None of these printed guns are going to be capable of hole on hole accuracy at 7 feet. I've got a robin hood from 30 yards and can shoot about an 8 inch bull at 60 with my bow and probably around a 5 inch at 50.

You would be lucky to hit the broadside of the barn at 60 with one of the libs.
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post #32 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phaedrus2129 View Post

The ammunition is kind of irrelevant, since you can't print gunpowder. The single-shot pieces of crap you can make on a 3D printer are about as big a threat as a bow and arrow; less, since you can fire a bow and arrow faster and more accurately.

Actually, polymer rounds exist that actually form a spire as opposed to a blob while heading down range at a target.

I.E. it is possible, to have rounds that are undetectable via security.

Thus, plastic gun + "plastic" rounds = Why reporters got them through airport security in Israel.
post #33 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by Masked View Post

Actually, polymer rounds exist that actually form a spire as opposed to a blob while heading down range at a target.

I.E. it is possible, to have rounds that are undetectable via security.

Thus, plastic gun + "plastic" rounds = Why reporters got them through airport security in Israel.

ignition?
you'd have to completely chemical since if you dont want any plastic at all you need to loose the firing pin and primers.
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post #34 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by t00sl0w View Post

ignition?
you'd have to completely chemical since if you dont want any plastic at all you need to loose the firing pin and primers.

Gunpowder currently is *really* only detectable via dog...

As I've said, a reporter, with a LIVE POLYMER ROUND, in a "plastic firearm" went through LLBG without a single issue...

It's not going to go through class 1 BA but, clothing/skin wouldn't be an issue at all.
post #35 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blameless View Post

I'm inclined to I agree with everything you've said, up until that last paragraph. Many people would rather be paid, because you cannot often eat gratitude.

But by then we could just use polymer feedstock of different levels of quality as denominations. Surely a population who manufactures their own luxuries and has open-sourced the near-ideal designs for goods will realize that materials themselves are the only things with real worth.
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post #36 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by Androiid View Post

How expensive are bullets? Is it easy to produce potassium nitrate and make it yourself? (I've never owned a gun nor been to a gun store redface.gif )

Potassium nitrate is no more used go artillery (guns included). Might still be used for shotgun tho.

Potassium nitrate is easy to get. You can make it yourself but considering the ratio KNO3, sulfur and coal is roughly 75-10-5, it would take you a while to produce enough just to propel a single bullet with black powder.

Oh and, just so you know, black powder is very hard to make. The coal used has to be produced out of a specific wood, it has to be burned in a specific way to keep only the carbon inside of the wood and it has to be gindred in a very very fine and homogeneous powder.

You can't simply mix the three compound or you will end with a slow burning rate explosive only good for fuse. It has to be mixed with water and isopropanol, heated, etc. until you get a fine granular powder extremely explosive.

Even the best black powder merely compete with modern explosive. The real thing is to produce TNT but that's another story and way way way more dangerous. I've never made any, wonder why wink.gif
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post #37 of 410
The ignorance about firearms is astounding.

Printing ammunition will not happen because you cannot print a brass cartridge, or, more to the point, gun powder. It's far easier to just buy ammunition at the store. And you can make black powder, but why bother when you can buy it totally unregulated, or at the very least get it out of fireworks?

The 3D printed guns themselves are worthless garbage. The reasons are twofold: reliability and accuracy. Accuracy with these things is ridiculously low because the plastic deforms under pressure. It bulges outward around the bullet, causing gas to escape around it, slowing the bullet. The barrel as a whole warps, causing your point of aim to shift, so the bullet could go anywhere.

Reliability is obvious. These things are very likely to explode in your hand and kill you, rather than the person you're aiming at.

Finally, when I say they're "one shot", I don't mean like a one-shot shotgun where you fire and reload. I mean one shot as in you fire once, and afterward the gun is a twisted piece of broken plastic. This will happen with any round more powerful than .22LR. One guy made a gun that can fire a dozen or so rounds of .22LR (reloading each time), but it still broken in the end.



And gun companies don't care about this. They do not give a flying copulation. Plastic guns will never be able to compete with actual firearms in a meaningful way, at least not in the next 50 years.
post #38 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phaedrus2129 View Post

The ignorance about firearms is astounding.

Printing ammunition will not happen because you cannot print a brass cartridge, or, more to the point, gun powder. It's far easier to just buy ammunition at the store. And you can make black powder, but why bother when you can buy it totally unregulated, or at the very least get it out of fireworks?

The 3D printed guns themselves are worthless garbage. The reasons are twofold: reliability and accuracy. Accuracy with these things is ridiculously low because the plastic deforms under pressure. It bulges outward around the bullet, causing gas to escape around it, slowing the bullet. The barrel as a whole warps, causing your point of aim to shift, so the bullet could go anywhere.

Reliability is obvious. These things are very likely to explode in your hand and kill you, rather than the person you're aiming at.

Finally, when I say they're "one shot", I don't mean like a one-shot shotgun where you fire and reload. I mean one shot as in you fire once, and afterward the gun is a twisted piece of broken plastic. This will happen with any round more powerful than .22LR. One guy made a gun that can fire a dozen or so rounds of .22LR (reloading each time), but it still broken in the end.



And gun companies don't care about this. They do not give a flying copulation. Plastic guns will never be able to compete with actual firearms in a meaningful way, at least not in the next 50 years.

Polymer rounds exist in the capacity of being 100% plastic, with the exception of the primer/powder.

In fact, police use them now to practice, considering the ammo shortage.

The public cannot buy, the 100% polymer, I do believe it only comes with a lead bullet but, they DO exist and if you know where to look you CAN get them.

Secondly, accuracy doesn't matter when you can walk up to the individual after going through a metal detector, unchallenged...When you're wanded, unchallenged...Then you produce the item and...bam, out comes the 9mm/45acp polymer round...If you placed your shot properly, you now have one dead target.

Earlier this year, a reporter took the plastic "revolver" with the polymer round, through the most secure airport in the entire world, took a cab to his hotel and fired the round...
post #39 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by Masked View Post

Polymer rounds exist in the capacity of being 100% plastic, with the exception of the primer/powder.

In fact, police use them now to practice, considering the ammo shortage.

The public cannot buy, the 100% polymer, I do believe it only comes with a lead bullet but, they DO exist and if you know where to look you CAN get them.

Secondly, accuracy doesn't matter when you can walk up to the individual after going through a metal detector, unchallenged...When you're wanded, unchallenged...Then you produce the item and...bam, out comes the 9mm/45acp polymer round...If you placed your shot properly, you now have one dead target.

Earlier this year, a reporter took the plastic "revolver" with the polymer round, through the most secure airport in the entire world, took a cab to his hotel and fired the round...

Really though. If you've got the will to travel through security to kill someone, wouldn't you be using a less detectable means of doing it than firing a gun?

Honestly guns aren't magic people killers. We really are quite fragile.
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post #40 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phaedrus2129 View Post

The ammunition is kind of irrelevant, since you can't print gunpowder. The single-shot pieces of crap you can make on a 3D printer are about as big a threat as a bow and arrow; less, since you can fire a bow and arrow faster and more accurately.

5 minutes in a garden store and you have gun powder.
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