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[Official] Case PHANTEKS Case Club for lovers & owners - Page 1759

post #17581 of 17847
Quote:
Originally Posted by nycgtr View Post

The front panel extended by 3mm is the same as no cover on. I stressed it with and without a cover it's the same. As for the top? Really dude? You are the first one that has said that. I personally saw a dramatic drop after i took the top off and then after i cut it.

The extended front panel is a good improvement, as I said I noticed a temp decrease removing the front panel (on the ATX case), but that may be partially related to the weak static pressure Phantek fans I have in there. Top cover, yeah no difference on or off, multiple hours stress testing done to confirm as I was curious myself. It really must be down to system configuration.
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post #17582 of 17847
When it comes to new cases, I suppose we'll have to wait and see if they reveal anything at Computex next month.
post #17583 of 17847
Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by pez View Post

Yeah, I agree the uses are different. The 120MPs are in a more restricted position than my 140SP in exhaust is, but even in a more open situation, I expected the 140 to be a bit quieter or have a better noise profile.

Let me be clear: both are great and have the most ideal noise profiles I've heard other than maybe a Noctua fan. I think I would definitely invest in the 140MPs down the line just to test out if I like the noise better.
I agree, both are great depending on applications. I used both in 140mm as case fans and found littler to no differences. If I was buying new I would probably get MPs because of PWM control, but if I had variable voltage fan control I would probalby use SPs.

2 words for you : Gently Typhoon


now if nidec ever made a 140mm GT .... i would use them....
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post #17584 of 17847
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by PureBlackFire View Post

nobody should have to mod a case for basic airflow and fitment. espacially when it isn't even the first iteration and the company has gotten years of feedback on certain issues.
Nobody 'has to mod' their Evolv cases. The fact is very few of the Evolv case owners 'have modded' their cases to get 'basic airflow'. Most of us have built within the design perimeters of the Evolv and had no real issues with airflow.

As for your 'first iteration' and 'years of feedback' .. every case has it's own group of potential problems .. solving one often creates another. Heck, even an open bench test station can end up with mods. tongue.gif

Cases and custom built systems are like cars and custom builders .. there are always things that can be done a better way depending on who you talk to. Even the most sophisticated race cars are evolving from season to season.
post #17585 of 17847
Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

Nobody 'has to mod' their Evolv cases. The fact is very few of the Evolv case owners 'have modded' their cases to get 'basic airflow'. Most of us have built within the design perimeters of the Evolv and had no real issues with airflow.

As for your 'first iteration' and 'years of feedback' .. every case has it's own group of potential problems .. solving one often creates another. Heck, even an open bench test station can end up with mods. tongue.gif

Cases and custom built systems are like cars and custom builders .. there are always things that can be done a better way depending on who you talk to. Even the most sophisticated race cars are evolving from season to season.

Yes, no one "needs to" modify their cases but if one notices a significant drop in temps when he removes the top panel compared to when it is setup following your recommendations and given that he has proper airflow and all that, won't it be valid to co clude that there is really something wrong with the top ventilation?
post #17586 of 17847
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mega Man View Post

2 words for you : Gently Typhoon


now if nidec ever made a 140mm GT .... i would use them....
The Gentle Typhoon are definitely very good .. and were the very best of the very best until a few years ago. But in the last few years we have many new fans competing with them, and some are better than GTs. The data shows the PH-F120MP to be 30-50% better at similar rpms. The lower rpm of MP's is it's only limiting factor .. and I assume it's blade design loose it's performance edge at higher rpm.

Here is some Cooling Techniques testing data I organized to show GTs compared to PH-F120MP. Hope it shows what I'm trying to explain .. that the MP is better .. and their blade design is better the lower their speed is .. even at 1600rpm they are move more air with higher pressure differential at lower noise levels than GTs.


post #17587 of 17847
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

The Gentle Typhoon are definitely very good .. and were the very best of the very best until a few years ago. But in the last few years we have many new fans competing with them, and some are better than GTs. The data shows the PH-F120MP to be 30-50% better at similar rpms. The lower rpm of MP's is it's only limiting factor .. and I assume it's blade design loose it's performance edge at higher rpm.

Here is some Cooling Techniques testing data I organized to show GTs compared to PH-F120MP. Hope it shows what I'm trying to explain .. that the MP is better .. and their blade design is better the lower their speed is .. even at 1600rpm they are move more air with higher pressure differential at lower noise levels than GTs.



Nice data sheet but did you test them in real world performance like on a heat sink or radiator?
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post #17588 of 17847
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kevindd992002 View Post

Yes, no one "needs to" modify their cases but if one notices a significant drop in temps when he removes the top panel compared to when it is setup following your recommendations and given that he has proper airflow and all that, won't it be valid to co clude that there is really something wrong with the top ventilation?
This 'significant drop in temps' is a direct result of people using components in a case that is not designed for their use .. or user is pushing the limits of design .. which is what modding is all about. thumb.gif Be push our equipment to the limits and then modify it to get even more. The Evolv design is to to not have conventional venting holes in front, top and sides .. and I have not yet seen a vent modification to the Evolv that did not change the this no vent design concept.

What I am seeing is more and more people wanting 'custom case' concepts and performance in production cases. Again I'll automotive design and production as a comparison. While many people buy and use new cars as they come off the showroom floor, many are modifying them before they get off the dealer's lot. tongue.gif We do the same thing with our computers. thumb.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by hurricane28 View Post

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

Nice data sheet but did you test them in real world performance like on a heat sink or radiator?
I posted the data so you could see what the actual difference is .. and yes, I have used / tested them on air coolers, radiators and case fans. The bottom line is regardless of how much better something is today, in a year or three there will be others just as good or better. It's call evolution. wink.gif

GTs were king for many many years .. and they are still very good. But they are no longer king. tongue.gif
post #17589 of 17847
Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

This 'significant drop in temps' is a direct result of people using components in a case that is not designed for their use .. or user is pushing the limits of design .. which is what modding is all about. thumb.gif Be push our equipment to the limits and then modify it to get even more. The Evolv design is to to not have conventional venting holes in front, top and sides .. and I have not yet seen a vent modification to the Evolv that did not change the this no vent design concept.

What I am seeing is more and more people wanting 'custom case' concepts and performance in production cases. Again I'll automotive design and production as a comparison. While many people buy and use new cars as they come off the showroom floor, many are modifying them before they get off the dealer's lot. tongue.gif We do the same thing with our computers. thumb.gif
I posted the data so you could see what the actual difference is .. and yes, I have used / tested them on air coolers, radiators and case fans. The bottom line is regardless of how much better something is today, in a year or three there will be others just as good or better. It's call evolution. wink.gif

GTs were king for many many years .. and they are still very good. But they are no longer king. tongue.gif

Doyll I followed the thread for this case on multiple forums. I used optimal rads, optimal fans and sealed up, extended, rested panels etc. All of that was done to prior to me modding the lid. I don't watercool to see 61c on my gpus using 2 360s. When I can feel thru the glass the heat build up on my top radiator i know something needs to be addressed. Now some people might feel content with 2 OCed cards in sli hitting 61c underload, I am not. With the modification to the lids my sli gpu temps dropped by up to 9c depending on ambient. I also can run my fans a little slower and my overall system temps have went down a few minor deg. This to me is a huge improvement and worth the modification.
post #17590 of 17847
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by nycgtr View Post

Doyll I followed the thread for this case on multiple forums. I used optimal rads, optimal fans and sealed up, extended, rested panels etc. All of that was done to prior to me modding the lid. I don't watercool to see 61c on my gpus using 2 360s. When I can feel thru the glass the heat build up on my top radiator i know something needs to be addressed. Now some people might feel content with 2 OCed cards in sli hitting 61c underload, I am not. With the modification to the lids my sli gpu temps dropped by up to 9c depending on ambient. I also can run my fans a little slower and my overall system temps have went down a few minor deg. This to me is a huge improvement and worth the modification.
Key word is 'modifications'. I think you are expecting more from the case than it is designed to give, so you needed to modify it to give you the airflow you feel you need. Most people do not think a GPU at 61c is extreme, but you do. I can understand that. I keep my own below 70c and CPU even cooler .. and that is in air cooled systems.

You want more than stock case supplies. Nothing wrong with that. But it is not because there is a fault in the case. The case was intentionally designed without massive venting in the front, top or sides. The front flow air very well. the top does not flow as well. You chose to push the limits and need more airflow / venting than stock gives, so you modify the case to do what you want.

Being able to improve performance and case airflow with modifications is why many of us are on these forums .. we 'modify by overclocking .. end up with cooling problems, and 'modify' with bigger coolers, more venting, more airflow. But that does not mean the case is not well designed and great looking.

We both know there are literally 100's of these cases out there working very well without the stock top being modified.

But I raised mine for better airflow with 280 top radiator. It lowered temps about 4c with lower fan noise levels.

I guess the difference is I accept the fact I want more then stock performance .. and also accept the fact that Evolv ATX is a great case even with no modifications .. even if I do modify it some anyway. I just don't think Phanteks needs to change the design by adding top vents in the Evolv cases. I like the look of the solid top.

You have every right to want and have a vented top. I just don't think you should be acting like it's a defective design by Phanteks. After all your system did keep 2x SLI GPUs at 61c or lower .. and that is not bad in my book.
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