Overclock.net › Forums › Graphics Cards › Graphics Cards - General › Can you guys explain core clocks and other gpu stuffs to me?
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Can you guys explain core clocks and other gpu stuffs to me?

post #1 of 3
Thread Starter 
Hey guys! So i know alot about gpus and i consider myself pretty gpu knowledgeable ;p but then again there's always more you can learn. I have an EVGA 660ti which i love <3 and atm i have it overclocked to a 1175-1188 core clock. The stock core on this card is 915 with a 980 boost as this is a totally vanilla model. So i know the core clock is the speed the gpu is running at, but obviously much more than just that number matters when calculating these values into performance and even those numbers differ in different gpu uses ie gaming vs competitive ocing/bencmarking or even cuda powered rendering or calculating/foldinig. From what i have heard in gaming even a difference from 1200 core to 1333 doesnt equate to much while gaming (maybe a couple fps difference) but in benching that can really give you the extra kick you need to pass your buddies. Memory does make a difference with gaming but i feel that these overclocks seem more crucial from a benching or calculating standpoint. Please correct me if im wrong but from what i have read this is kind of how the different gpu specs rate applied to gaming which is mainly what i get out of my rig because my rendering is done with my cpu because of the format i render in. FROM A GAMING STANDPOINT: How many cuda cores>Core clock speed> Memory clock.

Because i daily browse gpu news and gpu specs this is how i developed my viewpoint. also i apologize as i am more of a nvidia guy so most of the time i will be refering to nvidia lingo and gpus. It seems that the majority of nvidia gpus (and im talking vanilla gpus without any other specs ie lightning models, oc/superclocked, volt edit. etc etc the stock core is 915ish and the boost is 980 for alot buy with gpu boost 2.0 and the higher end cards like 680, 690, titan the boost can go higher like 1075 or so. I recently overclocked my 660ti and most of the time it runs 1175 or 1188 but with the pesky kepler architecture it likes to jump around depending on the game or even map im playing. im completely stable at that and can get to 1201 but after 10 mins heaven crashes. thats an ok from an overclock standpoint but when compared to stock speeds of much more expensive cards it gets someone who may not be as gpu or pc literate thinking. Why even buy a card hundreds of dollars more than that when you can blow past its core speed with a simple FREE overclock. Besides the fact that if you had say a 680, which is the most common flagship card in a budget range, can blow past that max 1188 core speed when overclocked, even if you benchmarked a stock 680 with an overclocked 660ti or 670, the 680 would win, not by much as alot of people can get there cores very close to a 680s speeds, it would still wins. its obvious for someone to question this. For me atleast, and by no means am i saying this is right ;p, but the amount of cores plays a big difference. (these specs are vanilla EVGA gpus) The 660ti has a total of 1334 cuda cores compared to the 1536 of the 680. That's a pretty considerable difference in values. As far as memory goes they both have 6008 effective memory clock though it should be noted that the 660ti has an 192 bit mem interface versus the 256 bit of the 680 which also makes a difference.

When you take a look at these specs just use deductive reasoning. For the sake of this argument lets compare my overclock results of my 660ti, and compare to the stock of a 680. Also as a side note the reason i picked these two cards for this test is this. The 660ti IMO is the lowest end of the enthusiast/budget gpu. The 650ti and the sorta new 650ti BOOST is a great competitor, but for a serious gamer the step from the 650 to the 660 is fairly large. I went with the 660ti as i dont have job, and i am a full time student. The 680 is definately an enthusiast card, and very popular with serious gamers, and gpu renders as it is very powerful, but still has a good price. The 690 and titan, though are both incredible, i did not include in this because there pricing really makes them in a new league being 1k USD gpus. I also left the normal non 'ti' 660 because the jump from 660 to 660ti is large in my honest opinion. Again refering to the core clock, the core speeds are the same, and the mem interface and clock is the same, though the amount of cores is a large step up from 1033 to the 'ti's 1344. Again this also shows that amount of cores does make a big difference. Now the real argument is why i did not mention the 670. IMO nvidia screwed up with this card. Literally, it is a 660ti. The only spec difference is the 256 bit mem interface which could be argued as a major advantage, but in my opinion it comes no where close to justifying the about 60 dollar price difference. Also i forgot to mention there is no difference in the amount of cuda cores from the 660ti to the 670. IMO literally no reason to ever purchase a 670 though i give no fault to people that have. There is probably some other technical things that people could argue make the 670 worth it but im speaking from a face value gamer standpoint specifically in the budget scene. If you are a real enthusiast where 60 bucks to burn on a gpu isnt an issue i get it, but if you really have that money almost no reason to not bump to a 680 and add onto those cuda cores if you really want that step up in performance. So when you come down to it, a 660ti with an overclock can get you to a stock 670 with no problem, and the fact that the mem clock and core values are the same, i see no reason to go 670. The biggest reason to me to go with a higher end card is the amount of cores which obviously can not be overclocked because they are physical.

So adding onto that last paragraph, using reasoning the obvious culprit of this step up in performance is the cuda cores. When a simple OC can blow past the core and mem of a 670, and the core amount is the same, technically what's the reasoning to buy a 670? So really what this giant wall of text is saying/asking what really equates to better gaming performance? Is it that heavily relies on the amount of cores? or does core clock rule the world even though facts show otherwise. Thanks for replying/reading and im sorry for such a long post as i tend to write wayyy more than i expect. Also realize these are all my opinions and i appreciate if you argue with me nicely, and without rudenss, bigotry. Thanks to all my gpu aficianado buddies!
 
Gateway Lappy
(8 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i5-3570@4.0ghz ASUS P8Z77-V LK  EVGA Geforce GTX 660ti2gb[bios mod]1202/1750 1.... Corsair Vengeance 8gb @ 21331.65v 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveCooling
Western Digital VelociRaptor150gb(boot drive) Seagate Momentus XT Hybrid 7200RPM 750GB(games/... Western Digital Caviar Black HDD 7200 RPM 1TB(r... Corsair H60 as intake at back in push configura... 
CoolingOSMonitorMonitor
x4 120mm Case Fans Windows 7 Professional Dell 24" LED HD (secondary screen) HP 2711x 27" HD (gaming screen) 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
SteelSeries 6GV2 Red Switch Edition Corsair HX Series HX750 750W INWIN Mana 137 w/ Modded Window  SteelSeries Sensei Raw Rubberized 
Mouse PadAudioAudioOther
Steelseries Qck Ultrasone Pro 550 S-Logic Asus Xonar DG Blue Snowflake USB Microphone 
Other
Logitech C615 1080p Webcam 
CPUGraphicsRAMHard Drive
AMD A6-5200 Quad-core AMD Radeon HD 8400 6gb DDR3L SDRAM 500GB HDD 
Optical DriveOSMonitorPower
DVD-Writer Windows 8.1 17.3" Active Matrix TFT Color LCD 6-cell Lithium Ion Battery 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 3770K Quad-Core CPU Asus Sabertooth Z77 ATX Motherboard EVGA GeForce GTX 770 Dual Classified w/ ACX Cooler Corsair Vengeance 16 gig 1866mhz (Black) 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Samsung 840 Pro Series SSD 250GB SSD WD Caviar Black 2TB 7200RPM 64MB cache Asus DRW writer Corsair SP120 Performance Dual-Pack 120mm Fan 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
XSPC Raystorm Acetal CPU Water Block EK-Multioption RES X2 - 150 Basic EK-CSQ Black Compression Fittings (x10) Primochill Elegant White Tubing (6meters) 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
EK-FC770 GPU Block Corsair SP120 Performance 120mm Fan Corsair AF140 Quiet-Series 140mm Fan Alphacool NexXxos UT60 Copper 360mm Radiator 
CoolingPowerCaseOther
Swiftech MCP655-B Pump Corsair AX860i 860 Watt Modular PSU Corsair 760T Corsair Invidividually Sleeved 24-Pin (White) 
  hide details  
Reply
 
Gateway Lappy
(8 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i5-3570@4.0ghz ASUS P8Z77-V LK  EVGA Geforce GTX 660ti2gb[bios mod]1202/1750 1.... Corsair Vengeance 8gb @ 21331.65v 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveCooling
Western Digital VelociRaptor150gb(boot drive) Seagate Momentus XT Hybrid 7200RPM 750GB(games/... Western Digital Caviar Black HDD 7200 RPM 1TB(r... Corsair H60 as intake at back in push configura... 
CoolingOSMonitorMonitor
x4 120mm Case Fans Windows 7 Professional Dell 24" LED HD (secondary screen) HP 2711x 27" HD (gaming screen) 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
SteelSeries 6GV2 Red Switch Edition Corsair HX Series HX750 750W INWIN Mana 137 w/ Modded Window  SteelSeries Sensei Raw Rubberized 
Mouse PadAudioAudioOther
Steelseries Qck Ultrasone Pro 550 S-Logic Asus Xonar DG Blue Snowflake USB Microphone 
Other
Logitech C615 1080p Webcam 
CPUGraphicsRAMHard Drive
AMD A6-5200 Quad-core AMD Radeon HD 8400 6gb DDR3L SDRAM 500GB HDD 
Optical DriveOSMonitorPower
DVD-Writer Windows 8.1 17.3" Active Matrix TFT Color LCD 6-cell Lithium Ion Battery 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 3770K Quad-Core CPU Asus Sabertooth Z77 ATX Motherboard EVGA GeForce GTX 770 Dual Classified w/ ACX Cooler Corsair Vengeance 16 gig 1866mhz (Black) 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Samsung 840 Pro Series SSD 250GB SSD WD Caviar Black 2TB 7200RPM 64MB cache Asus DRW writer Corsair SP120 Performance Dual-Pack 120mm Fan 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
XSPC Raystorm Acetal CPU Water Block EK-Multioption RES X2 - 150 Basic EK-CSQ Black Compression Fittings (x10) Primochill Elegant White Tubing (6meters) 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
EK-FC770 GPU Block Corsair SP120 Performance 120mm Fan Corsair AF140 Quiet-Series 140mm Fan Alphacool NexXxos UT60 Copper 360mm Radiator 
CoolingPowerCaseOther
Swiftech MCP655-B Pump Corsair AX860i 860 Watt Modular PSU Corsair 760T Corsair Invidividually Sleeved 24-Pin (White) 
  hide details  
Reply
post #2 of 3
GTX 660 Ti will perform quite well when its cuda cores alone are stressed. so with shader based AA methods like FXAA, it will get close to GTX 670. but once you bring in MSAA 4X or MSAA 8x or SSAA (super sampling anti aliasing) which is the most demanding AA , the GTX 660 Ti has no chance against a GTX 670. the main reason is the missing 8 ROPs and 64 bit memory controller. for MSAA / SSAA both bandwidth and pixel fill rate are important. Pixel fill rate = Number of ROPs x GPU core frequency

core clock is important but not above other attributes like core count, ROP and memory bandwidth. GTX 670 and GTX 680 have same ROP count , memory bandwidth . but GTX 670 has 1 SMX or 192 cuda coes less. so it takes roughly 100 mhz higher clocks for GTX 670 to provide GTX 680 performance. also when overclocking the GTX 680's extra SMX helps slightly widen the gap.

I would say there is no such thing as most important attribute. its all about balance. GTX 660 Ti is crippled and its performance scaling with OC can greatly depend on game and how demanding the AA is in a particular game.

HD 7950 OC vs GTX 670 OC vs GTX 660 Ti OC
http://www.hardocp.com/article/2012/08/23/galaxy_gtx_660_ti_gc_oc_vs_670_hd_7950/3#.Ug85aX_3x8E

HD 7950 OC vs GTX 660 TI OC vs GTX 760 OC
http://www.hardocp.com/article/2013/07/02/msi_n760_tf_2gd5oc_gtx_760_overclocking_review/5

you can see that in Tombraider (TR) GTX 660 ti OC edges ahead of GTX 760 OC because of the extra cores .also in TR they are using FXAA . in Crysis 3 and Farcry 3 the GTX 760 OC moves ahead especially at 4X SMAA and 4X MSAA. so even though GTX 760 is having 1 SMX or 192 cuda cores lesser, in most cases it ends up faster than GTX 660 Ti.

so there you have it - its all about not being bottlenecked and having a good balance of resources. the GTX 780 (2304 cc) in most cases requires 150 mhz higher clocks to match the Titan (2688 cc). But the most important thing is GTX 780 scales extremely well because of a full 48 ROPs and 384 bit memory system. thumb.gif
Edited by raghu78 - 8/17/13 at 10:58am
Fragbox
(14 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
Intel Core i5 2400 DH67BL AMD Radeon HD 6900 Series XFX HD 6950 2GB 
RAMRAMHard DriveOptical Drive
Corsair Corsair DDR3 1333 Mhz 2 GB Corsair DDR3 1333 Mhz 2 GB Western Digital Caviar Green SONY DVD-RW AD-7260S 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Windows 7 Professional 32 bit BENQ G2420HD Logitech K200 Seasonic VX550 psu 
CaseMouse
ANTEC 200 V2 Logitech mouse 
  hide details  
Reply
Fragbox
(14 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
Intel Core i5 2400 DH67BL AMD Radeon HD 6900 Series XFX HD 6950 2GB 
RAMRAMHard DriveOptical Drive
Corsair Corsair DDR3 1333 Mhz 2 GB Corsair DDR3 1333 Mhz 2 GB Western Digital Caviar Green SONY DVD-RW AD-7260S 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Windows 7 Professional 32 bit BENQ G2420HD Logitech K200 Seasonic VX550 psu 
CaseMouse
ANTEC 200 V2 Logitech mouse 
  hide details  
Reply
post #3 of 3
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by raghu78 View Post

GTX 660 Ti will perform quite well when its cuda cores alone are stressed. so with shader based AA methods like FXAA, it will get close to GTX 670. but once you bring in MSAA 4X or MSAA 8x or SSAA (super sampling anti aliasing) which is the most demanding AA , the GTX 660 Ti has no chance against a GTX 670. the main reason is the missing 8 ROPs and 64 bit memory controller. for MSAA / SSAA both bandwidth and pixel fill rate are important. Pixel fill rate = Number of ROPs

core clock is important but not above other attributes like core count, ROP and memory bandwidth. GTX 670 and GTX 680 have same ROP count , memory bandwidth . but GTX 670 has 1 SMX or 192 cuda coes less. so it takes roughly 100 mhz higher clocks for GTX 670 to provide GTX 680 performance. also when overclocking the GTX 680's extra SMX helps slightly widen the gap.

I would say there is no such thing as most important attribute. its all about balance. GTX 660 Ti is crippled and its performance scaling with OC can greatly depend on game and how demanding the AA is in a particular game.

HD 7950 OC vs GTX 670 OC vs GTX 660 Ti OC
http://www.hardocp.com/article/2012/08/23/galaxy_gtx_660_ti_gc_oc_vs_670_hd_7950/3#.Ug85aX_3x8E

HD 7950 OC vs GTX 660 TI OC vs GTX 760 OC
http://www.hardocp.com/article/2013/07/02/msi_n760_tf_2gd5oc_gtx_760_overclocking_review/5

you can see that in Tombraider (TR) GTX 660 ti OC edges ahead of GTX 760 OC because of the extra cores .also in TR they are using FXAA . in Crysis 3 and Farcry 3 the GTX 760 OC moves ahead especially at 4X SMAA and 4X MSAA. so even though GTX 760 is having 1 SMX or 192 cuda cores lesser, in most cases it ends up faster than GTX 660 Ti.

so there you have it - its all about not being bottlenecked and having a good balance of resources. the GTX 780 (2304 cc) in most cases requires 150 mhz higher clocks to match the Titan (2688 cc). But the most important thing is GTX 780 scales extremely well because of a full 48 ROPs and 384 bit memory system. thumb.gif

Thanks! that does make sense, and i knew that the higher mem bandwith on the 670 would help, but wasnt really sure why and in what scenarious. Why would you say the 660ti is crippled? By its lower mem bandwith? I also rarely run AA or any type of edge smoothing stuff in games. Really only when im stress testing after a real stress test in a game like bf3 or minecraft ;p XD. TBH i wouldnt buy a titan unless i won one ;p. Even in my dream rig i currently have sli 780s simply because they are very close in face value game performance, and i have no need for the 6 gigs of ram since i have absolutely no interest in running more than one main gaming monitor or 1440+ res gaming. plus the price difference is pretty considerable. I feel that from a gamer standpoint the titan doesnt have THAT many benefits to prove its price unless... Your pushing higher res multi monitor gaming, do gpu folding or calculating, or do alot of gpu rendering, or possibly if you're doing single rig livestreaming and use a custom x.264 preset to offset some encoding load from your cpu to your gpu where i guess the added ram and overall slight performance increase could prove important.
 
Gateway Lappy
(8 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i5-3570@4.0ghz ASUS P8Z77-V LK  EVGA Geforce GTX 660ti2gb[bios mod]1202/1750 1.... Corsair Vengeance 8gb @ 21331.65v 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveCooling
Western Digital VelociRaptor150gb(boot drive) Seagate Momentus XT Hybrid 7200RPM 750GB(games/... Western Digital Caviar Black HDD 7200 RPM 1TB(r... Corsair H60 as intake at back in push configura... 
CoolingOSMonitorMonitor
x4 120mm Case Fans Windows 7 Professional Dell 24" LED HD (secondary screen) HP 2711x 27" HD (gaming screen) 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
SteelSeries 6GV2 Red Switch Edition Corsair HX Series HX750 750W INWIN Mana 137 w/ Modded Window  SteelSeries Sensei Raw Rubberized 
Mouse PadAudioAudioOther
Steelseries Qck Ultrasone Pro 550 S-Logic Asus Xonar DG Blue Snowflake USB Microphone 
Other
Logitech C615 1080p Webcam 
CPUGraphicsRAMHard Drive
AMD A6-5200 Quad-core AMD Radeon HD 8400 6gb DDR3L SDRAM 500GB HDD 
Optical DriveOSMonitorPower
DVD-Writer Windows 8.1 17.3" Active Matrix TFT Color LCD 6-cell Lithium Ion Battery 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 3770K Quad-Core CPU Asus Sabertooth Z77 ATX Motherboard EVGA GeForce GTX 770 Dual Classified w/ ACX Cooler Corsair Vengeance 16 gig 1866mhz (Black) 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Samsung 840 Pro Series SSD 250GB SSD WD Caviar Black 2TB 7200RPM 64MB cache Asus DRW writer Corsair SP120 Performance Dual-Pack 120mm Fan 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
XSPC Raystorm Acetal CPU Water Block EK-Multioption RES X2 - 150 Basic EK-CSQ Black Compression Fittings (x10) Primochill Elegant White Tubing (6meters) 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
EK-FC770 GPU Block Corsair SP120 Performance 120mm Fan Corsair AF140 Quiet-Series 140mm Fan Alphacool NexXxos UT60 Copper 360mm Radiator 
CoolingPowerCaseOther
Swiftech MCP655-B Pump Corsair AX860i 860 Watt Modular PSU Corsair 760T Corsair Invidividually Sleeved 24-Pin (White) 
  hide details  
Reply
 
Gateway Lappy
(8 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i5-3570@4.0ghz ASUS P8Z77-V LK  EVGA Geforce GTX 660ti2gb[bios mod]1202/1750 1.... Corsair Vengeance 8gb @ 21331.65v 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveCooling
Western Digital VelociRaptor150gb(boot drive) Seagate Momentus XT Hybrid 7200RPM 750GB(games/... Western Digital Caviar Black HDD 7200 RPM 1TB(r... Corsair H60 as intake at back in push configura... 
CoolingOSMonitorMonitor
x4 120mm Case Fans Windows 7 Professional Dell 24" LED HD (secondary screen) HP 2711x 27" HD (gaming screen) 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
SteelSeries 6GV2 Red Switch Edition Corsair HX Series HX750 750W INWIN Mana 137 w/ Modded Window  SteelSeries Sensei Raw Rubberized 
Mouse PadAudioAudioOther
Steelseries Qck Ultrasone Pro 550 S-Logic Asus Xonar DG Blue Snowflake USB Microphone 
Other
Logitech C615 1080p Webcam 
CPUGraphicsRAMHard Drive
AMD A6-5200 Quad-core AMD Radeon HD 8400 6gb DDR3L SDRAM 500GB HDD 
Optical DriveOSMonitorPower
DVD-Writer Windows 8.1 17.3" Active Matrix TFT Color LCD 6-cell Lithium Ion Battery 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 3770K Quad-Core CPU Asus Sabertooth Z77 ATX Motherboard EVGA GeForce GTX 770 Dual Classified w/ ACX Cooler Corsair Vengeance 16 gig 1866mhz (Black) 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Samsung 840 Pro Series SSD 250GB SSD WD Caviar Black 2TB 7200RPM 64MB cache Asus DRW writer Corsair SP120 Performance Dual-Pack 120mm Fan 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
XSPC Raystorm Acetal CPU Water Block EK-Multioption RES X2 - 150 Basic EK-CSQ Black Compression Fittings (x10) Primochill Elegant White Tubing (6meters) 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
EK-FC770 GPU Block Corsair SP120 Performance 120mm Fan Corsair AF140 Quiet-Series 140mm Fan Alphacool NexXxos UT60 Copper 360mm Radiator 
CoolingPowerCaseOther
Swiftech MCP655-B Pump Corsair AX860i 860 Watt Modular PSU Corsair 760T Corsair Invidividually Sleeved 24-Pin (White) 
  hide details  
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Graphics Cards - General
Overclock.net › Forums › Graphics Cards › Graphics Cards - General › Can you guys explain core clocks and other gpu stuffs to me?