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Krow's TEC Controller - Build Log - Page 6

post #51 of 116
Thread Starter 
Well, I finally had some good etching happen tonight for the driver board.

I feel really bad for how long this is taking, but etching has been such a pain and I've finally got my life on track.



So here's the first etch to actually work. Seriously, if this design works, I'm just going to send it off for manufacturing because it's not worth the time and effort involved. If all went well I would get 1 a day done.

I will be back tomorrow night with the finished drilling and soldering. Depending on how quick it goes, I might get a TEC hooked up to it.

Again, sorry that it's taking this long and I hope it hits the fast track with this milestone.
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post #52 of 116
Good to hear you're finally having some luck smile.gif

Should be awesome when it's done!
post #53 of 116
What thickness copper clad are you using? I have trouble tracking down anything larger than 4oz / ft^2
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post #54 of 116
How come it takes so much Krow?

What procedure are you using?

If it serves any help, this is what I do, and a board is done under half an hour.

1) Print the layout straight out of Eagle (of course hiding all the layers that don't contain pads/tracks/vias/text I want to etch). I use, behold, tracing paper. Works wonders biggrin.gif

2) Expose to a regular 6400K 23W CCFL for 7 minutes.

3) Toss into a 4g/100mL solution of sodium hydroxide until revealed - shouldn't take longer than 2-3 minutes, if you get a bit overboard I've even managed to reveal boards in 30 seconds with no apparent loss of accuracy.

4) Toss into a 2 part water 2 part 33% HCl 1 part hydrogen peroxide solution (<-- IMPORTANT! Don't use regular wound treating one. Get the 100-120 volume stuff). Should start making fine bubbles right away,

A couple minutes after you've got a fully etched board. If you follow those steps, etching 10mil tracks shouldn't be any issue whatsoever. I do recommend 12 mil tracks with 16mil minimum spacing to avoid making any afterwork to ensure no bridging, though.

And no nasty chemicals. You can toss all that stuff down the drain. It's so weak it probably won't even itch if you happen to touch it.
Edited by Artikbot - 3/26/14 at 4:07pm
   
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post #55 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artikbot View Post

How come it takes so much Krow?

What procedure are you using?

If it serves any help, this is what I do, and a board is done under half an hour.

1) Print the layout straight out of Eagle (of course hiding all the layers that don't contain pads/tracks/vias/text I want to etch). I use, behold, tracing paper. Works wonders biggrin.gif

2) Expose to a regular 6400K 23W CCFL for 7 minutes.

3) Toss into a 4g/100mL solution of sodium hydroxide until revealed - shouldn't take longer than 2-3 minutes, if you get a bit overboard I've even managed to reveal boards in 30 seconds with no apparent loss of accuracy.

4) Toss into a 2 part water 2 part 33% HCl 1 part hydrogen peroxide solution (<-- IMPORTANT! Don't use regular wound treating one. Get the 100-120 volume stuff). Should start making fine bubbles right away,

A couple minutes after you've got a fully etched board. If you follow those steps, etching 10mil tracks shouldn't be any issue whatsoever. I do recommend 12 mil tracks with 16mil minimum spacing to avoid making any afterwork to ensure no bridging, though.

And no nasty chemicals. You can toss all that stuff down the drain. It's so weak it probably won't even itch if you happen to touch it.

I think the problem he's running into is the mosfet source/drain part of the circuit, pumping a couple dozen amps through PCB makes for difficult etching.
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post #56 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZytheEKS View Post

I think the problem he's running into is the mosfet source/drain part of the circuit, pumping a couple dozen amps through PCB makes for difficult etching.

I solve that using a copper rod across the legs with high power.

Doesn't look too pretty, but gets the job done safe and sound.

Another option is a 2oz+ dual layer PCB and adding vias all over the place. But it's quite a lot more expensive and tedious.
   
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post #57 of 116
Thread Starter 
Here we go! Prototype is entirely complete aside from attaching a header to connect the controller to the driver board. But it's finally complete.

Coolest thing in the world... Liquid Tin. It's like magic or alchemy lol



I will be back to answer ALL questions that were raised over the last week. Just gotta go for a food run.
Whitey!
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post #58 of 116
cant wait to see
post #59 of 116
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artikbot 
How come it takes so much Krow?

What procedure are you using?

I am using the Toner Transfer method using Photo Paper. It works, but the problems I have are that it loves to really hold on to the toner once it's transferred it. Peeling it off is a pain in the ass. When I started using this paper it turned out to be waterproof, which royally sucked the big one when trying to peel it because it was like separating plastic layers. I solved that by ironing on a regular piece of paper so the back plastic layer glued itself to that and was easier to separate.

This was my first attempt at all of this so I wanted to take some time and make sure I knew what I was doing. Slowest part was getting all the materials together.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZytheEKS 
What thickness copper clad are you using?

I am using what was advertised as 6oz Copper Clad, however it seems like 1 or 2oz board. I got it off eBay from the typical Chinese manufacturer so I'm very doubtful it is what it should be.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artikbot 
I solve that using a copper rod across the legs with high power.

I will most likely do that if it isn't enough. This current version of the prototype is over engineered, I doubled up on the MOSFETs just to see if the proof of concept will work for this board. It should but I don't want to burn anything up.
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post #60 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by Krow View Post

Here we go! Prototype is entirely complete aside from attaching a header to connect the controller to the driver board. But it's finally complete.

Coolest thing in the world... Liquid Tin. It's like magic or alchemy lol



I will be back to answer ALL questions that were raised over the last week. Just gotta go for a food run.

Order some gallium, it's a metal that will melt right around body temperature, so if you hold it in your hand it melts, if you pour it out of your hand it will solidify. It's pretty awesome stuff.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Krow View Post

I am using the Toner Transfer method using Photo Paper. It works, but the problems I have are that it loves to really hold on to the toner once it's transferred it. Peeling it off is a pain in the ass. When I started using this paper it turned out to be waterproof, which royally sucked the big one when trying to peel it because it was like separating plastic layers. I solved that by ironing on a regular piece of paper so the back plastic layer glued itself to that and was easier to separate.

This was my first attempt at all of this so I wanted to take some time and make sure I knew what I was doing. Slowest part was getting all the materials together.
I am using what was advertised as 6oz Copper Clad, however it seems like 1 or 2oz board. I got it off eBay from the typical Chinese manufacturer so I'm very doubtful it is what it should be.
I will most likely do that if it isn't enough. This current version of the prototype is over engineered, I doubled up on the MOSFETs just to see if the proof of concept will work for this board. It should but I don't want to burn anything up.

High gloss printer paper works well too, irons on like photo paper and soaks in water pretty easily so it's easy to peel off. It worked well for me at least, problem I had was my buddy told me he had all the stuff to etch it and when I got there he had muriatic acid (40% hydrochloric, 60% water) and medical grade hydrogen peroxide (3% hydrogen peroxide, 97% water) so it took like an hour for the mixture to actually burn off the copper as I had to mix it 1:4.9 ratio which diluted the mixture WAY too much. lol
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