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[VC] AMD Radeon R9 290X with Hawaii GPU pictured, has 512-bit 4GB Memory - Page 103

post #1021 of 1055
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moragg View Post

I think it's just about being able to code a process to be more efficient. I remember seeing a Haskell program to code sorting a list. It was very short and neat, but computationally much more expensive than the same function written in (i think) C++ . The latter program was much more complicated and longer and would require much more knowledge to write, but it was much more computationally efficient.

So (I think) Mantle gives devs access to the absolute basic commands (or very close to this) so they can "arrange" them in the most efficient way for rendering. Unlike DX9, where very abstract ideas (draw a line) are interpreted into GCN language - like all translations this will not be as good as if someone wrote it in GCN language originally, and it requires CPU resources.

It has to be close to the hardware to have a point. APIs like OpenGL, the Shading Language, OpenCL, can be quite low level and basic if you are pedantic but they can never be hardware specific. Hence for this to have a point it has to have things like "use this part of the die" or "take those 4 cores and do something" or similar, I obviously don't know the specifics.
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post #1022 of 1055
Quote:
Originally Posted by fateswarm View Post

It has to be close to the hardware to have a point. APIs like OpenGL, the Shading Language, OpenCL, can be quite low level and basic if you are pedantic but they can never be hardware specific. Hence for this to have a point it has to have things like "use this part of the die" or "take those 4 cores and do something" or similar, I obviously don't know the specifics.

Doubt it. Maybe maybe for consoles, but in PCs there's far too much variation, even within GCN, to do that.

Since it's locked to the GCN architecture it's probably closer to what I said - eliminate CPU overheads as no "translation" is required. The programmer needs to do something, so works out the most computationally efficient way of doing it, and tells the GPU that in it's own language. The GPU can allocate it's resources to carrying out the task, it's probably the driver's job (or the hardware itself) which does that.
post #1023 of 1055
post #1024 of 1055
Quote:
Originally Posted by maarten12100 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by looniam View Post

maybe i am reading you wrong but, since the PCI-2.0 x8 is already saturated and adding enough data to fill the other 2.0 x8 (= PCI-E 2.0 x16) i don't think there is any room for any overhead and would need a PCI-E 3.0 x16 connection.


btw, thanks for the very informative post -thumb.gif
Wait how do you get x8 = x16?!
If both are on a 2.0 x8 bus they won't cause any problems I figure most will be running either 2.0 x16 or 3.0 x8 which effectively are the same.

the figure from crossfire using ~ pci 2.0 x8 bandwidth and needing cpi-e 2.0 x8 bandwidth before you start seeing a bit of performance difference:


if pci-e2.0x8 wasn't saturated then i would believe it would be 100%, no? HOWEVER, keep in mind that benchmark is with a single card - i would suspect a multi card set up would be more of a difference since more data is being transfered.
http://www.hardocp.com/article/2012/07/18/pci_express_20_vs_30_gpu_gaming_performance_review/1
Edited by looniam - 9/29/13 at 5:04pm
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post #1025 of 1055
Quote:
Originally Posted by looniam View Post

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
the figure from crossfire using ~ pci 2.0 x8 bandwidth and needing cpi-e 2.0 x8 bandwidth before you start seeing a bit of performance difference:
if pci-e2.0x8 wasn't saturated then i would believe it would be 100%, no? HOWEVER, keep in mind that benchmark is with a single card - i would suspect a multi card set up would be more of a difference since more data is being transfered.
nope actually the reason why a 3930K gives better fps is because it removes cpu cycle waiting time.
So yes with a higher bus width you have less latency for a certain amount of data to get trough but it won't be considered a bottleneck as that lays with the lowest denominator in other words the GPU.
post #1026 of 1055
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post #1027 of 1055
Quote:
Originally Posted by maarten12100 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by looniam View Post

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
the figure from crossfire using ~ pci 2.0 x8 bandwidth and needing cpi-e 2.0 x8 bandwidth before you start seeing a bit of performance difference:
if pci-e2.0x8 wasn't saturated then i would believe it would be 100%, no? HOWEVER, keep in mind that benchmark is with a single card - i would suspect a multi card set up would be more of a difference since more data is being transfered.
nope actually the reason why a 3930K gives better fps is because it removes cpu cycle waiting time.
So yes with a higher bus width you have less latency for a certain amount of data to get trough but it won't be considered a bottleneck as that lays with the lowest denominator in other words the GPU.

ok. i get that . .sorta tbh. since one of the upper classmen at that fine educational institution you are enrolled in gave you a stunning reference (lol, buttering you up here).am i misunderstanding that the 290X crossfire needs pci-e 3.0?

(realtime edit in progress)

look what i just found on linus' board:
R9 290x can be crossfired with PCI-e 2.0 motherboards!
Quote:
Previously, NVIDIA and AMD made a move to bridged connections to reduce the bandwdith issues faced on the first generation PCI-e slots but the PCI-e 3.0 bus available today has enough bandwidth to once again enable the use of sideport.
PCI-e 2.0 can be use as well, but there will be little performance lose, i personally love this idea, because crossfire bridges look awesome. Vitalius made me to understand that. smile.gif

ok, its coming together for me . . . so this "it needs pci-e 3.0" is just not confirmed. tongue.gif


thanks for replying.
Edited by looniam - 9/29/13 at 5:24pm
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post #1028 of 1055
While you guys were having your little off topic benchmark fight, final8ty posted something rather interesting that ya'll missed:

Looks like the NDA is up on Oct 15 so circle your calendars...
post #1029 of 1055
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majin SSJ Eric View Post

While you guys were having your little off topic benchmark fight, final8ty posted something rather interesting that ya'll missed:
Looks like the NDA is up on Oct 15 so circle your calendars...

yeah as was earlier expected Oct 15th will be the retail launch date and the day when reviews are up. AMD should not have had pre-order for BF4 Battlefield edition on Oct 3rd. they should have released the SKU on Oct 15th along with reviews and then users would decide.
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post #1030 of 1055
Nice!!! RIVE BE, 290x, Aquaero 6. October's gonna be a great month!!!

I DO wish they coulda squeezed that 2nd DVI port onto the first slot for us watercoolers though.....
Edited by kpoeticg - 9/29/13 at 8:34pm
    
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