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[TS]AMD unveils revolutionary 'Mantle' API to optimize GPU performance - Page 25

post #241 of 249
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghoxt View Post

ALL game companies use all sorts of middleware tools. Many play nice with DX and OpenGL as they are known for a long time and quite stable. The favorite Indie engine Unity3D users have just picked up on this Mantle reveal and we've started asking Unity Technologies are they going to support it, are they under NDA etc...as Unity publishes to all consoles, PC and MAC.

So far crickets...I'm sure every Middleware company is in the same boat saying, what does this mean to us strategically, meaning now vs later.

Anyone thinking that this is a quick support addition is naive as it relates to gaming middleware vendors. There's a reason DICE with a hundred+ programmers were "selected" to demo this. Because they can. Smaller shops will need a longer time to learn the ins and outs, and likely won't have an onsite AMD representative team for specialized training. Oops ph34r2.gif I better shutup.

Just kidding about that. I don't know if AMD techs had moved into DICE, but it made for an interesting post biggrin.gif
Actually I think AMD will be very hands on support with this. I still think this is why they went for consoles. Maybe Nvidia didn't want it bad enough or AMD really wanted it, a lot, more than you think, a lot... Amd has had their back against a wall in the CPU market for far longer than they or us wanted. ICC is widespread at AMD's current standing and therefore not able to facilitate the change necessary to utilize their hardware to its potential. But with the consoles they have the opportunity to facilitate that change. The ability to showcase HSA and its benefits to the general software devs. So for now I think AMD has no choice but to give all they have to help any software devs that wish to incorporate Mantle or HSA if they wish to succeed and be able to walk just a bit further into the room.
post #242 of 249
Quote:
Originally Posted by bencher View Post

Duckie IMO is the best mod. Very neutral in all arguments.

This may be the first time I agree with you, he really is one of the best mods here. wink.gif
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post #243 of 249
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Originally Posted by fateswarm View Post

No. That's optional. But I know it's hard to accept you are wrong since you are a mod.

So what's your problem if it has optional Source Code ? tongue.gif
For example, see NVAPI.
NVAPI is NVIDIA's core software development kit
NVAPI components includes the header, lib files for each platform - x86 and x64 respectively


Source code is human readable and accessible, it allows use to modify it for a specific application to interact.
What you really should have been talking about is if it allows us to modify the compiler or not. rolleyes.gif
Because those modification in source code will be compiled. And if compiler is hardware/architecture specific only then we can't optimize our codes for other hardware/architecture.

Ultimately this compiler is the thing I'm afraid anyone could use mantle for other architectures except GCN.
Open Source here probably means that anyone can download and modify its source code for use with applications he/she is developing. I don't think they are allowed to access/modify The compiler.
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post #244 of 249
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Originally Posted by lacrossewacker View Post

The best result from this announcement? MS feels a little heat under it's feet and puts more resources into its DX team, benefiting all of us. Nnvidia is chastised for Physx, then all of a sudden AMD pulls this one and it's somehow a benefit to the market? (the minority at that) At least an improvement in DX would benefit 90% of us here -_-
The point is that PhysX and TressFX are just some fancy eye candy, useless.
Mantle, on the other side, is a tangible possibly HUGE performance boost, so it actually does make a difference...
post #245 of 249
Quote:
Originally Posted by kache View Post

The point is that PhysX and TressFX are just some fancy eye candy, useless.
Mantle, on the other side, is a tangible possibly HUGE performance boost, so it actually does make a difference...

How is eye candy useless? The only point in wanting a higher frame rate is so that you can actually turn on the "useless" eye candy and not be watching a slide show. It's no different than wanting to a turn a slider to Ultra instead of settling on High.
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post #246 of 249
Quote:
Originally Posted by kache View Post

The point is that PhysX and TressFX are just some fancy eye candy, useless.
Mantle, on the other side, is a tangible possibly HUGE performance boost, so it actually does make a difference...

Oh please. You talk like you have already used it. You have not, you haven't a clue as to just what it does. Fact is we don't even know if the new video cards will even be pci 3rd gen?

AMD does not have a board compatible with pci 3rd gen. Lets talk about AMD's software, shall we. Its their biggest seller! Seller for Nvidia.
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post #247 of 249
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Originally Posted by DrFPS View Post

Oh please. You talk like you have already used it. You have not, you haven't a clue as to just what it does. Fact is we don't even know if the new video cards will even be pci 3rd gen?

AMD does not have a board compatible with pci 3rd gen. Lets talk about AMD's software, shall we. Its their biggest seller! Seller for Nvidia.
We know what it does. There's slides and even a 15 minute presentation by a DICE dev that explains it.

Also, the 7900s are PCI 3.0 so why wouldn't the new cards be?
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post #248 of 249
Quote:
Originally Posted by sumitlian View Post


So what's your problem if it has optional Source Code ? tongue.gif
For example, see NVAPI.
NVAPI is NVIDIA's core software development kit
NVAPI components includes the header, lib files for each platform - x86 and x64 respectively


Source code is human readable and accessible, it allows use to modify it for a specific application to interact.
What you really should have been talking about is if it allows us to modify the compiler or not. rolleyes.gif
Because those modification in source code will be compiled. And if compiler is hardware/architecture specific only then we can't optimize our codes for other hardware/architecture.

Ultimately this compiler is the thing I'm afraid anyone could use mantle for other architectures except GCN.
Open Source here probably means that anyone can download and modify its source code for use with applications he/she is developing. I don't think they are allowed to access/modify The compiler.

 

 

Do they make custom compilers for this stuff? From what I understand, its an abstraction layer that still needs a driver in between it and the hardware. Nvidia can translate the API calls in code and compile through whatever they use for their drivers just like AMD.


The main difference would be that AMD has a headstart due to being co-creators of the API. It would take time for Nvidia to translate the calls for its hardware and release a driver that supported Mantle.


The only concern is if any of the API relies on a proprietary binary blob that Nvidia can't read. If this truly is an open API, we should see some documentation soon and an implementation announcement from big green.

post #249 of 249
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yvese View Post

We know what it does. There's slides and even a 15 minute presentation by a DICE dev that explains it.

Also, the 7900s are PCI 3.0 so why wouldn't the new cards be?

Yes your 100% correct=pci-e3.0. And the 79xx are on 28nm node already making a but load of bandwidth. Some i looked @ w/ just a small OC was 315GBs = 384 mem bus. 7990

Red is always up to something. 5870 was eye-infinity, 6870 DX10.1, 7970 DX11.1.

I'm ready for a new GPU. We will see.
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