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post #11 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheNegotiator View Post

So you're saying the more expensive, higher grade components and capacitors in more expensive DACs cause things to sound worse?
That is correct. They use bigger and fatter capacitors on the circuit. They generate more noise due to larger current the component requires. This gives worse sound, usually blurry / soft sound, like music covered with a thin blanket. You lose out details too. It's better to go with the lower power draw, with smaller capacitors.
Quote:
I want to see the measurements that prove that.
Measurements are only good within the hardware side. Once the sound waves leaves the speakers you get various results. This is why measurements are useless. You don't seem to know much even though you have some background in live sound and recording.redface.gif
Quote:
If the OP doesn't want any bass or is purchasing a separate sub then a 4" driver is fine, otherwise they need a larger driver. I have a background in live sound and recording, I have used the Focal CMS series, various Genelecs and Dynaudio... I know how they sound.
Just pointing out where this thread is heading. wink.gif
Going beyond 4" driver is fine, but once again that depends on the size of his listening area. I would personally go with the 5" driver. You don't want to go too big because then it starts infesting noise from the speakers themselves.


cheez
post #12 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by CheezCake View Post

That is correct. They use bigger and fatter capacitors on the circuit. They generate more noise due to larger current the component requires. This gives worse sound, usually blurry / soft sound, like music covered with a thin blanket. You lose out details too. It's better to go with the lower power draw, with smaller capacitors.
rolleyes.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by CheezCake View Post

Measurements are only good within the hardware side. Once the sound waves leaves the speakers you get various results. This is why measurements are useless. You don't seem to know much even though you have some background in live sound and recording.redface.gif
False. Besides, I just asked for measurements on the hardware side. These fat capacitors are hardware, are they not? wink.gif

And don't insult my background. I have more than some experience in the live/recording industry. I handled some pretty large projects and worked with several major players in speaker and audio equipment design. You don't know who I am, or who I've worked with. Proper measurements with proper equipment are objective, ears aren't objective.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CheezCake View Post

Going beyond 4" driver is fine, but once again that depends on the size of his listening area. I would personally go with the 5" driver. You don't want to go too big because then it starts infesting noise from the speakers themselves.
If his listening space is a closet then maybe. Infesting noise from the speakers themselves? No.
Edited by TheNegotiator - 10/6/13 at 12:07pm
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post #13 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheNegotiator View Post

False. Besides, I just asked for measurements on the hardware side. These fat capacitors are hardware, are they not? wink.gif
capacitors are hardware. But they are one of the root cause for infesting with more noise in the DAC. This is why they don't sound as good as the cheaper and smaller DAC's.
Quote:
And don't insult my background. I have more than some experience in the live/recording industry. I handled some pretty large projects and worked with several major players in speaker and audio equipment design. You don't know who I am, or who I've worked with. Proper measurements with proper equipment are not objective, ears are objective.
The ears are subjective. I think you got that backwards. tongue.gif Are you asking me for measurements of how much is infested in the system with large power supply and capacitors? This is no rocket science. You don't need measurements for that. It is obvious they carry more noise. This information is coming from the experienced, not those that just go around guessing, like yourself. redface.gif
Quote:
If his listening space is a closet then maybe.
It doesn't need to be a closet. A fairly small room is fine, even bigger for the well designed 4" driver equipped speakers like Focal CMS40.
Quote:
Infesting noise from the speakers themselves? No.
Yes they do due to the amps built in to the speakers. They have current going through you know. redface.gif




cheez
post #14 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by CheezCake View Post

capacitors are hardware. But they are one of the root cause for infesting with more noise in the DAC. This is why they don't sound as good as the cheaper and smaller DAC's.
Yeah, no. I'm not willing to debate this with someone who has already said they don't know anything about audio or electronics in one thread, then goes on to claim they do in another.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CheezCake View Post

The ears are subjective. I think you got that backwards. tongue.gif Are you asking me for measurements of how much is infested in the system with large power supply and capacitors? This is no rocket science. You don't need measurements for that. It is obvious they carry more noise. This information is coming from the experienced, not those that just go around guessing, like yourself. redface.gif
Sorry, typo. I meant the ears are not objective.

It's not obvious. If it is, give me proof. How about you show me some credentials that prove you and this Patrick (who I think is you know what they are talking about. He's been banned everywhere else, why should I take him seriously? I've worked with many well respected individuals in the audio field and what I know comes from them. And I'm not guessing. Unlike you, I listen to individuals who know how to properly test things like this with specialized measurement equipment.

I will not be debating this further until you offer cold, hard proof of what you claim.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CheezCake View Post

Yes they do due to the amps built in to the speakers. They have current going through you know. :O
...Then if we followed you're logic, wouldn't amp size be a problem rather than the driver size?

Until you offer real proof, we're done.
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post #15 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by CheezCake View Post

That's what I used to think till a few years ago. I too never knew about the Creative being so special. Well, it is. It beats out high-end DAC's that cost $30k~ over 100k. EMU-0404 can be had for $150 at Amazon.... I have owned DAC's that cost above $1k. They sound worse than my $85 sound card. They sound blurry and fatty. Some details were there, but the details themselves were blurry too. I get more open sound (larger soundstage) with just as good detail if not more with my $85 sound card. The more expensive and bigger you go the worse it gets. Haven't you heard about the capacitors? wink.gif
That depends on his needs. If it's for a small listening area the 4" drivers are more than plenty. The Focal CMS40 has exceptionally wide stereo imaging with superb mid range and detail.
You are going off topic and trolling, you troll?

wink.gif


cheez

Being I had the Creative EMU 0404 for a while, was a very versatile unit. It can be used as a DAC, headphone amp, and also a USB to Spdif converter. However, it requires custom drivers. The drivers from creative in general has been lacking. It not a bad DAC, but won't beat out most newer DAC's, or audio interfaces. My overall opinion on the EMU 0404 USB is that it is bright sounding, lacks deep bass and the overall sound can be described as "edgy". The sad thing is that those attributes also reveal themselves in the digital output which sound edgy and congested in the top and light in the bass in comparison with the other DAC's I have, or used.

Having listened to many high-end setups. I can tell you that NO TWO SETUPS SOUND ALIKE! This infers two things: 1) that preference to sound is subject to opinion, and 2) that the "accuracy" (if defined by repeatability and standardization) of even the expensive systems is not all that great.

Where I don't believe the audiophools, or you is the overprice expensive cables that cost thousands, or the $200 cable lifters that supposedly improve your sound . Caring about whether people are fooled is called compassion. There are businessmen who can sell cow manure as if it was gold. Some people would praise such a businessman as an innovative and successful entrepreneur, whereas others would call him a conman
Edited by retropcdos - 10/6/13 at 7:58pm
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post #16 of 17
^Well said, +rep.
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post #17 of 17
I heard about these speakers "Pioneer SP-BS22-LR", haven't listen to them myself, very promising reviews and can be had for around 100 bucks. as you wanted small footprint. As far as amp would go Small Class T Amp Integrated Amplifier as they are small and can deliver, not cost to much ether. Just try to find one that has a TDA7492 and use the rest of the money in you budget to get a decent DAC, or Audio interface.

If you can afford to spent a little more. The Yamaha hs80m Active Studio Monitors, has the amp built in and can be bought on Ebay for around $500 for a pair. There is the M audio BX-5 Active Studio Monitors, that others here already recommended for $299. Would also get a Focusrite scarlett 212 audio interface. Best to go to a store that has them setup and have him listen to them.
Edited by retropcdos - 10/6/13 at 9:08pm
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