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post #11981 of 12060
Quote:
Originally Posted by schuck6566 View Post

Can I just say this is 1 of the most complete and well organized listings of the more commonly used xeons for modding? It should help alot if only to show that they have good and bad voltage demands for OC'ing depending on the individual cpu.It's certainly end some arguments about if a cpu should be able to run @ 4.0 GHz only above 1.3v or if it can manage 1.2 or below. The answer being "It depends" wink.gif Thank-You for the time AND money involved in this(lol,I know U are going for records,but STILL..) I for 1 appreciate U keeping a record of the cpu's and their performance AND your sharing it. smile.gif

Well the batch number (I should have kept the last 3 digits, I know...., but even within the exact same batch number I could see large differences) will indicate those with possibly low Vid, and those who consistently give the best results (3845A roxxx, 3843B is very good), those with a lot of variability (3834A, 3842B, but with awesome chips sometimes, etc). I focused mostly on E5440 and X5460, then on E5450/X5450, and with E5430/L5420, L5408 got lucky with the first one with super low Vids...

Cpus of different series can go across the same batch numbers, which gives some indication which is favored for low Vid, which binned for a X series has a good potential for going up, or wodn if you like downvolting (many X5460 can make 3.8 Ghz below their Vid, and X5460 @ stock can often handle it at 1.10 V biggrin.gif), etc.

Currenlty, I am missing a Golden X5470, no great E5420 and have no L5430. Time will come biggrin.gif
Edited by bolc - 4/28/17 at 6:26am
post #11982 of 12060
Quote:
Originally Posted by Piskeante View Post

NICE!!!

My X5460 is doing linx stable for 20 pass at 1,41v 4,3ghz and it's my 24/7 rig now. (now testing stability issues at 458x9,5 1,4250v 4.350mhz). By now, rock solid gaming , browsing , watching films and so on. i managed to pass a big amount of synthetic benchmarks at 4,6ghz 1,48v ish like Cinebench R15 getting 513 points. If i want to post just windows, less voltage , obviously. Just for bench purposes, not 24/7. Vid 1,25v. Tried 4,7 ghz, i can post into windows, but i will not pass Cinebench, which is a very used program to test stability very fast. i think i can post my Xeon at 4.8ghz and enter windows, but that's as far as i can go, almost sure. 4,7ghz with my X5460 is definetely possible and i can probe it.
Considering the max "safe" voltage for this harpertown xeons is 1,45v, going over 4,4ghz will need just to much vcore. an X5470 can be surely viable at 4,6ghz 1,45v ish (also depends on silicon lottery)

so in that screenshot, where it says E5450 it's actually an X5450 right?? 1,2375v Vid is also nice.

Those X5460 in the excel batch are 30-60 minutes in Prime95 at that Vcore??well, almost all of them are better than mine if that's correct. i need almost 1,41v to do 4,3ghz in linx, and i will not pass prime95 blend under any circumstance because one of the cores fails randomly. seems not a cpu related issue. i really don't know why. Any tip about this???

if you could show us more info, like screenshots of mobo, ram speed, and HWmonitor would be really usefull.

All cpu screens of X5450 say E5450 in the title but X5450 in the text smile.gif
The Vid is 1.2375, not bad, and this one did almost as good as 2x E5450 with Vid 1.1125 and 1.125 V at 459 fsb = 4.13 Ghz, with 1.2625 V for the X vs 1.25 V for the E.


The voltage in the Excel file are those required to pass 30-60' prim95 using a P5Q Pro turbo (same results on any P5Q: tried P5Q, P5QC, P5QD Turbo, P5Q turbo, except the P5Q Deluxe, P5Q-E and P5Q Premium which have a different design ; tried a P5Q3 Deluxe lately, and was fine at 450, just needed some love biggrin.gif).
This is the voltage entered in the bios. On Asus board P45series with LLC option, the load voltage is almost equal to the Vbios. On Gigabyte, that differes a bit, typicaly you get 20-30 mV drop and need to compensate accordingly.

I must say that any X5460 requiring above 1.4 V to get 4.275 Ghz, I considered as suxxor.... Golden are below 1.3 V, roxxor below 1.325, good between 1.325-1.35, then the rest biggrin.gif

Tests were almost all done with an AIO 240 from LEPA, with 2x120 push 2x120 pull, in open air, Arctic MX-2 paste. 2x2Go ram. I rarely exceeded 55-60C on the cores, except for those requiring > 1.4 V.



What is your mb model? Heatsink? Ram ?
Edited by bolc - 4/28/17 at 6:31am
post #11983 of 12060
Quote:
Originally Posted by bolc View Post

All cpu screens of X5450 say E5450 in the title but X5450 in the text smile.gif
The Vid is 1.2375, not bad, and this one did almost as good as 2x E5450 with Vid 1.1125 and 1.125 V at 459 fsb = 4.13 Ghz, with 1.2625 V for the X vs 1.25 V for the E.


The voltage in the Excel file are those required to pass 30-60' prim95 using a P5Q Pro turbo (same results on any P5Q: tried P5Q, P5QC, P5QD Turbo, P5Q turbo, except the P5Q Deluxe, P5Q-E and P5Q Premium which have a different design ; tried a P5Q3 Deluxe lately, and was fine at 450, just needed some love biggrin.gif).
This is the voltage entered in the bios. On Asus board P45series with LLC option, the load voltage is almost equal to the Vbios. On Gigabyte, that differes a bit, typicaly you get 20-30 mV drop and need to compensate accordingly.

I must say that any X5460 requiring above 1.4 V to get 4.275 Ghz, I considered as suxxor.... Golden are below 1.3 V, roxxor below 1.325, good between 1.325-1.35, then the rest biggrin.gif


What is your mb model?

P5QC with DDR3. Mine will not pass Prime95 at 4,3ghz, no matter which voltage i pull into it (already tried), There is always a core failing in prime95. I haven't tested with ddr2 though. but it's no point since i bought this mobo for ddr3 compatibility. According to what you are saying, my xeon is rubish, xDDD.

i've researched a lot on voltages in X5460 and i must say mine is not good, but it was not too far from others. But considering your numbers, they seem brutally low. all of them. i've seen a lot of 4ghz X5460 at around 1,32v. Mine needs 1,31875v to do 432x9,5 4,1ghz prime95 and IBT stable. which is really not bad. But beyond that, you have to go very high on the vcore to reach stable speed.
Almost any X5460 you have is better than mine according to what you are saying. I'm surprised. I thought that that xeon excell was only using successful post into windows and a bit of activity. Never thought it was 30-60 min prime95 blend.

I never thought my xeon was a good one, but an average. Now that you've said that........well......
post #11984 of 12060
Quote:
Originally Posted by Piskeante View Post

P5QC with DDR3. Mine will not pass Prime95 at 4,3ghz, no matter which voltage i pull into it (already tried), There is always a core failing in prime95. I haven't tested with ddr2 though. but it's no point since i bought this mobo for ddr3 compatibility. According to what you are saying, my xeon is rubish, xDDD.

i've researched a lot on voltages in X5460 and i must say mine is not good, but it was not too far from others. But considering your numbers, they seem brutally low. all of them. i've seen a lot of 4ghz X5460 at around 1,32v. Mine needs 1,31875v to do 432x9,5 4,1ghz prime95 and IBT stable. which is really not bad. But beyond that, you have to go very high on the vcore to reach stable speed.
Almost any X5460 you have is better than mine according to what you are saying. I'm surprised. I thought that that xeon excell was only using successful post into windows and a bit of activity. Never thought it was 30-60 min prime95 blend.

I never thought my xeon was a good one, but an average. Now that you've said that........well......

I could have filled the list with some extra e5440 and x5460 not withstanding 3.9 and 4.275 Ghz at 1.25 and 1.4 V (hence the > 1.25 and > 1.4 V in the list, or I simply omitted them).

all my chips are E0 steppings. Do you have E0 or C0 ?


your P5QC is fine, no reason it can't cope with 453 Mhz fsb. on mine and others P5Q, you are generally fine with that NB freq for 1.2-1.24 V. for fsb term somewhere between 1.20-1.26 V is enough for E0 stepping (I systematically used 1.20 Nb and 1.22 for fsb at 450 Mhz fsb ; even less with E5440)

first things first, which capacity / frequencty/ timings do you run your ram?

when going to ddr3 board (I had ep45t-ud3r and p5q3 dlx), you need need to be cautious when going above 1333 Mhz ram frequency. it may result in instability if you do not deactivate certain memory features of the bios (dram trainning read, write, mem oc charger, etc, you need to test one by one).
plus, if you go above 1333 mhz, you will need to increase the ram voltage even though your ram is certified 1600 cas9 1.5 V, on those boards, it needs higher voltage cause the memory reference voltages coupling with the mch need to be higher (in my case 1.5 V was enough at 1333, at 1600 I needed 1.64 V). (on asus, you can t adjust ram ref voltages, but you can on that gigabyte)

also, I needed to fix all primary (9-9-9-24) and secondary timings to be fine. below 1333, 5-10-108 are fine secondary timings but above 1333, you need to use 6-12-128 (the numbers are not in order, but the bios shows the default value, when you see a 5 input a 6, instead of 78 trfc, put 108 ot 128). run aida and get the full list of timings for the 1333 profile and 1600 profile. use those numbers.

anyways, make 100% sure your ram is without error at that fsb and ramfrequency you want, by running memtest86+. multiplier x3.33 was not very stable, and x4 was too high, x3.2 waqs a good one in my case. that would make 1450 mhz ram for you, and with 1.60 V ram you should be fine. otherwise make x3 with ~1360 fine at 1.52 V or so.

then, f the ram memtests fine, you also need to adjust manually the perf level (aka transaction booster or whatnot). 10 may be too low, try 14 and see if prim95 crashes. to test that, decrease the cpu multiplier to x6 and bench the sytstem. Vcore can be decreased to Vid = 1.25 V, fsb term at 1.20 V. make a 1.24 V NB and see how that goes.

then increase the multiplier to x9.5, and accomodate with a higher Vcore, and possibly a little bit of fsb term
Edited by bolc - 4/28/17 at 7:23am
post #11985 of 12060
Quote:
Originally Posted by bolc View Post

I could have filled the list with some extra e5440 and x5460 not withstanding 3.9 and 4.275 Ghz at 1.25 and 1.4 V (hence the > 1.25 and > 1.4 V in the list, or I simply omitted them).

all my chips are E0 steppings. Do you have E0 or C0 ?


your P5QC is fine, no reason it can't cope with 453 Mhz fsb. on mine and others P5Q, you are generally fine with that NB freq for 1.2-1.24 V. for fsb term somewhere between 1.20-1.26 V is enough for E0 stepping (I systematically used 1.20 Nb and 1.22 for fsb at 450 Mhz fsb ; even less with E5440)

first things first, which capacity / frequencty/ timings do you run your ram?

when going to ddr3 board (I had ep45t-ud3r and p5q3 dlx), you need need to be cautious when going above 1333 Mhz ram frequency. it may result in instability if you do not deactivate certain memory features of the bios (dram trainning read, write, mem oc charger, etc, you need to test one by one).
plus, if you go above 1333 mhz, you will need to increase the ram voltage even though your ram is certified 1600 cas9 1.5 V, on those boards, it needs higher voltage cause the memory reference voltages coupling with the mch need to be higher (in my case 1.5 V was enough at 1333, at 1600 I needed 1.64 V). also, I needed to fix all primary (9-9-9-24) and econdary timings to be fine. below 1333, 5-10-108 are fine timings but above 1333, you need to use 6-12-128 (the numbers are not in order, but the bios shows the default value, when you see a 5 input a 6, instead of 78 trfc, put 108 ot 128).
(on asus, you can t adjust ram ref voltages, but you can on that gigabyte)

anyways, make 100% sure your ram is without error at that fsb you want, by running memtest86+

if the ram memtests fine, then you also need to adjust manually the perf level (aka transaction booster or whatnot). 10 may be too low, try 14 and see if prim95 crashes. tyo test that, decrease the cpu multiplier to x6 and bench the sytstem. Vcore can be decrwase to Vid = 1.25 V, fsb term at 1.20 V. make a 1.24 V NB and see how that goes.

then increase the multiplier to x9.5, and accomodate with a higher Vcore, and possibly a little bit of fsb term

Nice imput

E0 stepping.
it's not an fsb issue. I tried 510 fsb x 6 multi and it passed prime95 without issues.only 15min but almost enough i think, since normaly, at least for me, one core fails before 5 min of workload.

i have a pair of KHX1600C9D3B1K2/8GX at 1600 will need 9.9.9.27 an 1,65v and currently running at 610x2 = 1220mhz doing 7.7.7.20.78.2T (auto settings and auto vram). No problem with memtest. The ram divider is weird, since if i go strap 400 1374mhz divider, i´ll get a real speed of 1,500mnhz ish. something over 1374mhz in strap ram divider will give stability issues. i will try setting manual settings in primary and secundary timings, just to see if i can run prime95 blend.

I also disable ram training. OC mem is On. transaction booster is auto (never understood that setting). vfsb is 1,3v . NB voltage auto. i tried 1,3 and 1,4v on NB and even 1,8v on the ram in the past for stability issues in prime95 blend, but there was simply no option. i know for a fact my pair of kingston can do 2133mhz at 10.11.11.30.2T in my P9x79 deluxe mobo. i even tried those settings (very relaxed timings for 1200mhz ddr3, but failed aswell.

Fact is that i tested Prime95 small FFT's for vcore adjustment (which test's almost no ram), and anything below 1,41v at 4,3ghz it crashes so i guess that's my minimum. I´ll definetily give a try to your settings, but considering the tests i've done to achieve an stable vcore adapted to speed, i can say with some certainty, that my issue is vcore, not ram, at least, according to my testing. Maybe that changes with your settings and i manage to pass blend at 4,3ghz. as for the vcore.....that seems a no go for me.

i really appreciate your input mate.
post #11986 of 12060
AI Transaction Booster is Performance Level, or in English :
How much performance you want to have on NB (it's internal workings setting).
Lower = Higher Perf. but less stability.
I use AI Trans. Level of "7" for 1500MHz and CL7, and tRFC of "86" (but I got X48 chipset tho, so don't mind me) smile.gif

I would also try lower Strap (like 266MHz or 333MHz), and see what it does.

EDIT : Piskeante, you have Single Sided 4GB modules frown.gif
Here's spce sheet : LINK
I think that's the problem, LGA 775 IMCs don't like 512MB/chip design.
Edited by agentx007 - 4/28/17 at 9:24am
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post #11987 of 12060
Quote:
Originally Posted by agentx007 View Post

AI Transaction Booster is Performance Level, or in English :
How much performance you want to have on NB (it's internal workings setting).
Lower = Higher Perf. but less stability.
I use AI Trans. Level of "7" for 1500MHz and CL7, and tRFC of "86" (but I got X48 chipset tho, so don't mind me) smile.gif

I would also try lower Strap (like 266MHz or 333MHz), and see what it does.

EDIT : Piskeante, you have Single Sided 4GB modules frown.gif
Here's spce sheet : LINK
I think that's the problem, LGA 775 IMCs don't like 512MB/chip design.

yes, i was aware of this issue. But when i bought this pair, like 5 years ago, or more i was not thinking of anything like overclocking. The problem is that researching for compatible low density ram is a pain in the as-s. it's very difficult to know, because almost no manufacturer says it (kingston is one of those who actually tell you), but you cannot get a listing of low density ddr3 at the moment. Well, i didn't manage to get it, but it can exist somewhere.

if someone knows a model of low density ddr3 , i can try to buy one from ebay if it's cheap.
post #11988 of 12060
Quote:
Originally Posted by agentx007 View Post

AI Transaction Booster is Performance Level, or in English :
How much performance you want to have on NB (it's internal workings setting).
Lower = Higher Perf. but less stability.
I use AI Trans. Level of "7" for 1500MHz and CL7, and tRFC of "86" (but I got X48 chipset tho, so don't mind me) smile.gif

I would also try lower Strap (like 266MHz or 333MHz), and see what it does.

EDIT : Piskeante, you have Single Sided 4GB modules frown.gif
Here's spce sheet : LINK
I think that's the problem, LGA 775 IMCs don't like 512MB/chip design.

you are right, with ddr2 fsb strap higher is better but with ddr3 that s the other way around if I remember well

chipset x3/48 p35/45, etc, can t support single sided so he must have double sided, the pc would not boot otherwise wink.gif

if Vcore issue, try playing with Vcore, fsb term and gtl ref values. upping one step the gtl ref, upping fsb term to 1.30 V if lower, upping Vcore a bit

perhaps easier if you post your voltage settings?
post #11989 of 12060
Quote:
Originally Posted by bolc View Post

you are right, with ddr2 fsb strap higher is better but with ddr3 that s the other way around if I remember well

chipset x3/48 p35/45, etc, can t support single sided so he must have double sided, the pc would not boot otherwise wink.gif

if Vcore issue, try playing with Vcore, fsb term and gtl ref values. upping one step the gtl ref, upping fsb term to 1.30 V if lower, upping Vcore a bit

perhaps easier if you post your voltage settings?

GTL 0,65x
fsb term 1,3v
vcore 4,3 1,41250v

Yesterday i managed to pass blend test tweaking ram settings, but i don't know why i cannot now.


as you can see, i only used 458x6. and it passed. But with the same exact settings, changed multi for 9,5 and failed.

i will try today another time to see what the actual F-uck happened.
Edited by Piskeante - 4/29/17 at 1:28am
post #11990 of 12060
Quote:
Originally Posted by Piskeante View Post

GTL 0,65x
fsb term 1,3v
vcore 4,3 1,41250v

Yesterday i managed to pass blend test tweaking ram settings, but i don't know why i cannot now.


as you can see, i only used 458x6. and it passed. But with the same exact settings, changed multi for 9,5 and failed.

i will try today another time to see what the actual F-uck happened.

Cpu enhance or whatever, last of the list, is on compatible ?

push Vcore to 1.4375 v, no change as to when the prrim95 failing happens

typically, if Vcore moves the time at which the error coccurs, then it may be more Vcore related.

if the error happens all the time at the same time, it is more likely the chipset or fsb term, assuming ram is fine

what is your NB chipset voltage?

Ps: at 460 fsb, gtl ref on auto is fine too but that's often x0.63 by default I think, I least on my ep45 which allows to tweak directly the voltage value
Edited by bolc - 4/29/17 at 3:48am
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