Overclock.net › Forums › Industry News › Technology and Science News › [phys.org] 3-D printing: Making your own saves energy, scientist says
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

[phys.org] 3-D printing: Making your own saves energy, scientist says - Page 5

post #41 of 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by serp777 View Post

I know that 3d printers will need some workers, but im thinking it will logarithmically scale. Also why does a 3d laser printer need pitch and yaw? A metallic 3d printer builds two dimensional layers from a digital database, which eventually come together to make a 3d object. it has no need to print at angles.

Plus most mass productions systems have thousands of moving parts, so a 1% difference for 3d printers isn't that substantial anyways.

There will need to be some maintenance like any factory, but it will be less than a traditional factory by a factor of 1000.

You're right that 3D printers will probably always take more time, but i'm thinking more like 100% as a realistic estimate, not a 10000% increase. Also time is only an issue if there is a lot of demand, otherwise, as long as supply meets demand, it doesn't really matter.

of course there are going to be better places to use a mass production line, and others where it would be better to use a 3d printing facility.

Thing is if everyone has their own home 3d printer why would you need to print 10,000 toy soldiers if you only want 10, 20, 50 or even 100 soldiers tops for your kids? You cannot compare these directly to modern mass production machines because that is not what they are designed for.
So supply meets demand on a more personal scale. of course if you look at even 10% uptake on home 3d printers (with the caveat that they are in use properly) then that would effect large manufacturers of commonly produced goods.
There is still a long way to go with this technology before its "mature" but I think its got a strong future when it gets to the point that someone has a home 3d printer and with no 3d modelling experience can just load a file design and click start.

For small business this could be a even greater thing if it starts to incorporate 3d printing of electronics as for the company I work for we have to plan prototypes based on when our Chinese manufacterer can turn around prototype designs to us and get feed back before churning out the finished product (not mentioning the shipping times or problems of not having fast prototyping.
post #42 of 47
The question is then; is the 3d printed object close enough to the molded one to provide the appropriate feed back? If I was going order a run of 10,000 parts I think I'd want feedback on the product coming out of the molds.
 
DD Portable
(12 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i5 5675C Gigabyte GA-Z97X Gaming 5 XFX RX 480 GTR 32GB Corsair Vengeance 1600 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveCooling
Samsung 840 Evo Western Digital Black RE4 2TB Western Digital Green 2TB bequiet! Silent Wings 2 140mm PWM 
CoolingCoolingCoolingOS
bequiet! Silent Wings 2 140mm PWM bequiet! Shadow Wings SW1 120mm PWM bequiet! Dark Rock Pro 3 Arch X64 / Gnome and OSX 10.11 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
Dell U2414H KBC Poker II be quiet! Straight Power 10 400W bequiet! Silent Base 800 
MouseAudioAudio
Speedlink Omni VI  Sound Blaster Z  Bose Companion 2  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i5 3427U The Googs HD4000 4GB DDR3 
Hard DriveOSMonitorKeyboard
32GB Flash / 128GB SanDisk Extreme SD card ChromeOS / Ubuntu 14.04 12" 2560x1700 bad 
PowerCaseMouseAudio
not much  Aluminium  Trackpad it makes noise I think  
  hide details  
Reply
 
DD Portable
(12 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i5 5675C Gigabyte GA-Z97X Gaming 5 XFX RX 480 GTR 32GB Corsair Vengeance 1600 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveCooling
Samsung 840 Evo Western Digital Black RE4 2TB Western Digital Green 2TB bequiet! Silent Wings 2 140mm PWM 
CoolingCoolingCoolingOS
bequiet! Silent Wings 2 140mm PWM bequiet! Shadow Wings SW1 120mm PWM bequiet! Dark Rock Pro 3 Arch X64 / Gnome and OSX 10.11 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
Dell U2414H KBC Poker II be quiet! Straight Power 10 400W bequiet! Silent Base 800 
MouseAudioAudio
Speedlink Omni VI  Sound Blaster Z  Bose Companion 2  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i5 3427U The Googs HD4000 4GB DDR3 
Hard DriveOSMonitorKeyboard
32GB Flash / 128GB SanDisk Extreme SD card ChromeOS / Ubuntu 14.04 12" 2560x1700 bad 
PowerCaseMouseAudio
not much  Aluminium  Trackpad it makes noise I think  
  hide details  
Reply
post #43 of 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by GermanyChris View Post

The question is then; is the 3d printed object close enough to the molded one to provide the appropriate feed back? If I was going order a run of 10,000 parts I think I'd want feedback on the product coming out of the molds.

The devices I use have an accuracy of X-Y: 11 Microns [0.0004 IN] Z: 2.5 Microns [0.0001 IN] so I would say that it is better in some ways than moulding as you don't have to calculate the shrinkage effect or drafting angles.
Thanos
(12 items)
 
Benchy
(15 items)
 
Aspire 5755g
(12 items)
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
I5 6600k @ 4.6 Asus Z170 deluxe MSI 980ti twin frozr 6G 8gb Corsair Vengeance DDR4 @ 3000 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
256gb Samsung 850 pro Be Quiet dark rock pro 3 Windows 10 64bit 23 inch Samsung SA3000 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Qpad Mk 85 Corsair HX750 Fractal Arc Midi R2 Corsair M65 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 2600k @ 4.5Ghz HT on 24/7 GA-Z68X-UD5-B3 MSI 7970 [2PMD3GD5] @ 1270/1900 4x 4gb Corsair XMS3 1600 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingOS
3x WD GREEN 500GB 128gb OCZ agility 3 Noctua NH-D14 Windows 7 Ultimate x64 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
Samsung S22A350H Qpad mk-85 (Cherry Red switches) Corsair HX750 Handmade Test Bench 
MouseAudio
X7 (I didn't buy it) Plantronics Gamecom 780's 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 2670QM Bios unlocked NVIDIA GT540M (OC GT55M Speed) 8gb 1333MHz 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
WD 750gb Samsung 840 pro SSD Removed for SSD! what cooling? burning 
OSMonitorKeyboardMouse
Windows 7 x64 home premium 15.6" HD LED clinky stylee touchpad 
  hide details  
Reply
Thanos
(12 items)
 
Benchy
(15 items)
 
Aspire 5755g
(12 items)
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
I5 6600k @ 4.6 Asus Z170 deluxe MSI 980ti twin frozr 6G 8gb Corsair Vengeance DDR4 @ 3000 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
256gb Samsung 850 pro Be Quiet dark rock pro 3 Windows 10 64bit 23 inch Samsung SA3000 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Qpad Mk 85 Corsair HX750 Fractal Arc Midi R2 Corsair M65 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 2600k @ 4.5Ghz HT on 24/7 GA-Z68X-UD5-B3 MSI 7970 [2PMD3GD5] @ 1270/1900 4x 4gb Corsair XMS3 1600 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingOS
3x WD GREEN 500GB 128gb OCZ agility 3 Noctua NH-D14 Windows 7 Ultimate x64 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
Samsung S22A350H Qpad mk-85 (Cherry Red switches) Corsair HX750 Handmade Test Bench 
MouseAudio
X7 (I didn't buy it) Plantronics Gamecom 780's 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 2670QM Bios unlocked NVIDIA GT540M (OC GT55M Speed) 8gb 1333MHz 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
WD 750gb Samsung 840 pro SSD Removed for SSD! what cooling? burning 
OSMonitorKeyboardMouse
Windows 7 x64 home premium 15.6" HD LED clinky stylee touchpad 
  hide details  
Reply
post #44 of 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by darkstar585 View Post

The devices I use have an accuracy of X-Y: 11 Microns [0.0004 IN] Z: 2.5 Microns [0.0001 IN] so I would say that it is better in some ways than moulding as you don't have to calculate the shrinkage effect or drafting angles.

Instead you have to worry about thermal strain, porosity, internal defects, and surface finish issues. Don't get me wrong, I love 3D printing but it has a long way to go.
Lenovo Y470
(13 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Core i5-2410m Lenovo Baseboard HM65 Nvidia Geforce GT550m Samsung 4gb DDR3 1333mhz 
Hard DriveOSMonitor
500gb Windows 7 Home Premium 14in laptop@1366x768 + AOC 2236vw@1920x1080 
  hide details  
Reply
Lenovo Y470
(13 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Core i5-2410m Lenovo Baseboard HM65 Nvidia Geforce GT550m Samsung 4gb DDR3 1333mhz 
Hard DriveOSMonitor
500gb Windows 7 Home Premium 14in laptop@1366x768 + AOC 2236vw@1920x1080 
  hide details  
Reply
post #45 of 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by serp777 View Post

You're right that 3D printers will probably always take more time, but i'm thinking more like 100% as a realistic estimate, not a 10000% increase. Also time is only an issue if there is a lot of demand, otherwise, as long as supply meets demand, it doesn't really matter.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uD-kCf8amHk The smaller it is, the faster the 3D printer can do it, but even with that example, I highly doubt it could do it in 2x that speed. In addition, the higher the detain on the printer, the longer it will take.

The demand will always be more than what you can do. Because not only do you need to manufacture X, once your done with that, then you run Y. Time is money. If it takes 2x as long, then you wont be able to run Y and you miss out of that profit. That's an economical cost.
Edited by Mrzev - 10/13/13 at 2:44am
Zev's Comp
(15 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i5-2500K Sandy Bridge 3.3GHz GIGABYTE GA-Z68X-UD3H-B3 LGA 1155 Intel Z68 HDM... GeForce GTX 750 Ti G.SKILL Ripjaws X Series 8GB 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DrivePower
1TB HDD 64GB SSD (Used for SRT) 500 GB. Antec BP550 Plus 550W Continuous Power ATX12V V... 
Case
COOLER MASTER ELITE 335 RC-335-KKN1-GP Black S... 
  hide details  
Reply
Zev's Comp
(15 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i5-2500K Sandy Bridge 3.3GHz GIGABYTE GA-Z68X-UD3H-B3 LGA 1155 Intel Z68 HDM... GeForce GTX 750 Ti G.SKILL Ripjaws X Series 8GB 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DrivePower
1TB HDD 64GB SSD (Used for SRT) 500 GB. Antec BP550 Plus 550W Continuous Power ATX12V V... 
Case
COOLER MASTER ELITE 335 RC-335-KKN1-GP Black S... 
  hide details  
Reply
post #46 of 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by the last man View Post

Control systems is what is preventing mass adoption. When 3d printing metal, you have to make a molten pool of metal. Across this pool are temperature gradients that leave thermal stresses and strain once the metal has cooled. Also tolerances are a big problem. The printers can be accurate but are not accurate enough for use in aerospace industries without post processing the part with heat treatments and conventional machining. There are currently no systems that I know of that measure and control temperature gradients and geometry of the 3d printed parts while it is being made.

Lol, weren't we talking about 3D printed plastic parts?

Also, for your everyday phone holder, toothbrush pot, or keys tray... Molten metal temperature uniformity is not even close to being a concern. Starting with the fact that you manufacture a plastic part using a molten string. Not even using metal tongue.gif

Strength issues really depend on how good you've calibrated the printer, and what density are you using. For most uses of our cheap plastic stuff, it's more than enough.
Edited by Artikbot - 10/13/13 at 2:58am
   
AGP bencher
(14 items)
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Phenom X6 1055T ASUS M4A89GTD Pro/USB3 Sapphire HD 6950 2GiB GSKill Ares 2x4GiB 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveCooling
Crucial MX100 Seagate 7200.14 Samsung SpinPoint F3 EK Supreme HF 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
EK CoolStream XT360 Alphacool Coolplex Pro 10LT Phobya DC12-400 XSPC Rasa GPU 
OSMonitorMonitorKeyboard
W10 Pro LG IPS235V LG E2250V KUL ES-87 
PowerCaseMouseAudio
NOX Sonar 780W (Kingwin 750W 80+) Lian Li PC-A05NB Logitech G9 ASUS Xonar DX 
AudioAudioAudioOther
Sennheiser HD555 SMSL SA S3 Desktop Amplifier Kenwood KFC S1394 + Custom 10L Bass Reflex cabi... Logitech G25 
CPUMotherboardRAMHard Drive
AMD A10-5700 Gigabyte F2A75M-HD2 G.SKILL Ares 2133 CL9 Hitachi 5K750 
CoolingOSMonitorPower
Noctua NH-L9a Citrix XenServer AUO B156HW01  PicoPSU-80-WI-25V 
CaseOther
AIO Aluminium Handmade Alfa Networks N-150 500mW 
CPUCPUCPUMotherboard
Core2Duo E6400 Core2Quad Q6600 Pentium Dual Core E5200 AsRock 4COREDUAL-SATA2 R2.0 
GraphicsRAMHard DriveOptical Drive
A dumpload of ancient AGP cards Kingston Value DDR2-667 CL4 2T @CL3 1T Seagate 160GB 7200.10 LG IDE DVD-ROM 
CoolingCoolingOSMonitor
Ghettomade CPU waterblock 49cc 2stroke engine copper radiator WinXP SP2 32bit ProView 17" 
PowerCase
Tacens Radix V 550W Ghetto aluminium bench 
  hide details  
Reply
   
AGP bencher
(14 items)
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Phenom X6 1055T ASUS M4A89GTD Pro/USB3 Sapphire HD 6950 2GiB GSKill Ares 2x4GiB 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveCooling
Crucial MX100 Seagate 7200.14 Samsung SpinPoint F3 EK Supreme HF 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
EK CoolStream XT360 Alphacool Coolplex Pro 10LT Phobya DC12-400 XSPC Rasa GPU 
OSMonitorMonitorKeyboard
W10 Pro LG IPS235V LG E2250V KUL ES-87 
PowerCaseMouseAudio
NOX Sonar 780W (Kingwin 750W 80+) Lian Li PC-A05NB Logitech G9 ASUS Xonar DX 
AudioAudioAudioOther
Sennheiser HD555 SMSL SA S3 Desktop Amplifier Kenwood KFC S1394 + Custom 10L Bass Reflex cabi... Logitech G25 
CPUMotherboardRAMHard Drive
AMD A10-5700 Gigabyte F2A75M-HD2 G.SKILL Ares 2133 CL9 Hitachi 5K750 
CoolingOSMonitorPower
Noctua NH-L9a Citrix XenServer AUO B156HW01  PicoPSU-80-WI-25V 
CaseOther
AIO Aluminium Handmade Alfa Networks N-150 500mW 
CPUCPUCPUMotherboard
Core2Duo E6400 Core2Quad Q6600 Pentium Dual Core E5200 AsRock 4COREDUAL-SATA2 R2.0 
GraphicsRAMHard DriveOptical Drive
A dumpload of ancient AGP cards Kingston Value DDR2-667 CL4 2T @CL3 1T Seagate 160GB 7200.10 LG IDE DVD-ROM 
CoolingCoolingOSMonitor
Ghettomade CPU waterblock 49cc 2stroke engine copper radiator WinXP SP2 32bit ProView 17" 
PowerCase
Tacens Radix V 550W Ghetto aluminium bench 
  hide details  
Reply
post #47 of 47
strength is also a lot about part design and how the layers are oriented relative to the load, also shrinkage has to be considered somewhat
SolusIgnis
(21 items)
 
2 Watts
(6 items)
 
Huh?!
(13 items)
 
CPUCPUCPUMotherboard
i7-3820 Xeon Phi 31S1P Copressor (WIP) Xeon Phi 31S1P Copressor (WIP) ASRock X79 Extreme6 
GraphicsRAMHard DriveCooling
XFX Reference 6950 Samsung Magic RAM Crucial M4 Cosair H80 
OSMonitorMonitorMonitor
Windows 8.1 Pro HannSpree HF205 1600x900 ASUS VH239H 1920x1080 ASUS VH239H 1920x1080 
KeyboardCaseMouseMouse Pad
CMStorm Quick Fire Pro, Cherry MX Blue Thermaltake Oversoar RX-I MadCatz RAT 9 Saitek Cyborg V.5 
OtherOtherOther
Thrustmaster HOTAS Warthog TrackIR 5 Saitek Pro Combat Pedals 
CPUMotherboardRAMHard Drive
Marvell PXA510 D2Plug DDR3 
Optical DriveCooling
Pssh! Who needs optical drives Passive 
CPUOS
i386 MS-DOS 
  hide details  
Reply
SolusIgnis
(21 items)
 
2 Watts
(6 items)
 
Huh?!
(13 items)
 
CPUCPUCPUMotherboard
i7-3820 Xeon Phi 31S1P Copressor (WIP) Xeon Phi 31S1P Copressor (WIP) ASRock X79 Extreme6 
GraphicsRAMHard DriveCooling
XFX Reference 6950 Samsung Magic RAM Crucial M4 Cosair H80 
OSMonitorMonitorMonitor
Windows 8.1 Pro HannSpree HF205 1600x900 ASUS VH239H 1920x1080 ASUS VH239H 1920x1080 
KeyboardCaseMouseMouse Pad
CMStorm Quick Fire Pro, Cherry MX Blue Thermaltake Oversoar RX-I MadCatz RAT 9 Saitek Cyborg V.5 
OtherOtherOther
Thrustmaster HOTAS Warthog TrackIR 5 Saitek Pro Combat Pedals 
CPUMotherboardRAMHard Drive
Marvell PXA510 D2Plug DDR3 
Optical DriveCooling
Pssh! Who needs optical drives Passive 
CPUOS
i386 MS-DOS 
  hide details  
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Technology and Science News
Overclock.net › Forums › Industry News › Technology and Science News › [phys.org] 3-D printing: Making your own saves energy, scientist says