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post #15251 of 43911
Quote:
Originally Posted by mojobear View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by mojobear View Post

Yah I understand that the Kraken's cooler is not taken into account but it cant be 44 W LOL! That would be a monsterous cooler.

Yes you are benching different and we cant compare and yes 100% load on games vs furmark are different, but my results I am pretty damn confident about smile.gif I don't like to spread misinformation but the numbers add up IF you believe that a better cooler for the VRMs and GPU reduces GPU draw. Also my numbers I think are more typical for an average user, not someone throwing 1.4V into three cards which would of course draw tremendous power.

wait a second i think im stupido...hahaha. Its total system draw the legit review was measuring which of course would include the Kraken G10 somewhere in there..unless they ran it off a separate outlet or something (extremely unlikely)....sooo the - 44W system draw would actually be the difference between Stock temp GPU/VRM vs G10 GPU/VRM....unless of course the G10 cooler is 44W more power efficient than the stock cooler tongue.gif


That's why I wrote their numbers are whacky. The kraken's pump and fan cost power to run, a lot more power than just the gpu's cooling fan. Their numbers don't add up you see. Then if you look at their "calculated" consumption numbers, miraculously that wattage or whatever is lost somewhere... but where? The overall consumption drops too, but again how?

Fact, if the core is working more due to not being throttled, it is consuming MORE power to do so. If you say the core working 100% vs 80% whilst being throttled, and at 100% usage it is consuming less power. That is magic right there.


**Btw I could give two cents about some kraken review, I'm only this topic because you think that running cooler consumes less power. You should also realize AMD differs on this viewpoint. I've never found that better cooling = lowered consumption because the lower cooling always has a price. In my setups, the price is really freaking high, but that's ok because I'm willing to pay it.
Edited by tsm106 - 1/28/14 at 12:40pm
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post #15252 of 43911
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsm106 View Post

That's why I wrote their numbers are whacky. The kraken's pump and fan cost power to run, a lot more power than just the gpu's cooling fan. Their numbers don't add up you see. Then if you look at their "calculated" consumption numbers, miraculously that wattage or whatever is lost somewhere... but where? The overall consumption drops too, but again how?

Fact, if the core is working more due to not being throttled, it is consuming MORE power to do so. If you say the core working 100% vs 80% whilst being throttled, and at 100% usage it is consuming less power. That is magic right there.


**Btw I could give two cents about some kraken review, I'm only this topic because you think that running cooler consumes less power. You should also realize AMD differs on this viewpoint. I've never found that better cooling = lowered consumption because the lower cooling always has a price. In my setups, the price is really freaking high, but that's ok because I'm willing to pay it.

Meh, we all have our theories. I at least have some sort of proof to back up my theory. I use the G10 kraken as an example for my theory that significant drops in temp decrease power draw from gpu...really its hard to come up with some other explanation of why the G10 installation resulted in 44W less system draw. Stock and G10 both had same frequencies for GPU, same test bench....only difference was the cooling solution. So unless you can give me some confounders that can result in a 44W drop, you can imply causation between the G10 installation and -44W at load smile.gif

Stating its a flawed review without giving good explanations of confounders is not justification of it being a bad review. I at least have given you some proof to back up my idea. Can you prove that lowering temps to 50 C for the GPU has no effect on power draw?
Edited by mojobear - 1/28/14 at 1:26pm
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post #15253 of 43911
Couldnt find it on the NZXT site but xbitlabs says the Kraken X40 uses 7.5W http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/coolers/display/nzxt-kraken-x40_3.html

Again with the 92mm fan thats about ~10W, not that much.

If i had a Kilawat it would be easy enough for me to test - i have 2 120mm fans that i can easily turn one off, increasing temps from ~60C to ~80C. It seems counter intuitive that it would actually require less power, but maybe its possible.
post #15254 of 43911
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsm106 View Post

That's why I wrote their numbers are whacky. The kraken's pump and fan cost power to run, a lot more power than just the gpu's cooling fan. Their numbers don't add up you see. Then if you look at their "calculated" consumption numbers, miraculously that wattage or whatever is lost somewhere... but where? The overall consumption drops too, but again how?

Fact, if the core is working more due to not being throttled, it is consuming MORE power to do so. If you say the core working 100% vs 80% whilst being throttled, and at 100% usage it is consuming less power. That is magic right there.


**Btw I could give two cents about some kraken review, I'm only this topic because you think that running cooler consumes less power. You should also realize AMD differs on this viewpoint. I've never found that better cooling = lowered consumption because the lower cooling always has a price. In my setups, the price is really freaking high, but that's ok because I'm willing to pay it.

It is well established that lower temps equals less power consumption, both because of reduced electrical resistance and increased efficiency. The VRMs in particular are much more efficient at lower temps. There have been numerous charts that show this posted around (the VRM one has been posted in this thread) - I'm on my phone or I'd find them and link them. Anand has posted a few for CPUs is the past, including one for Haswell. I have no trouble believing that putting a AIO cooler on the GPU would reduce power consumption, above and beyond what is needed for the pump/fan.

Edit: Here's an extensive look at it for CPUs

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2281195
Edited by Forceman - 1/28/14 at 1:47pm
post #15255 of 43911
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsm106 View Post

^^It's a not a bad idea to just jump right to 1500w ish hehe. biggrin.gif




**The cost difference from 1300w to 1500w is like 80 bucks, but the cost from buying a 1300w and then realizing you need 1500w... it's a lot more expensive than 80 bucks and it bruises your woulda shoulda coulda 20/20 hindsight...

Not much stock available to me in the US. It seems like this is the best I can get that's in stock, fits in my Air 540, and is listed in this PSU thread:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817153154&ignorebbr=1

Thoughts on reliability with up to 3 x R9 290's down the road?

(I really don't want to go with Newegg, but Amazon is bone dry on high output PSU's, and everything else for that matter)
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post #15256 of 43911
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redvineal View Post

Not much stock available to me in the US. It seems like this is the best I can get that's in stock, fits in my Air 540, and is listed in this PSU thread:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817153154&ignorebbr=1

Thoughts on reliability with up to 3 x R9 290's down the road?

(I really don't want to go with Newegg, but Amazon is bone dry on high output PSU's, and everything else for that matter)

EVGA SuperNova G2 1300 atts is a much better PSU

That one you picked is a bit meh and its really overpriced for what you get

That does not mean its bad
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post #15257 of 43911
Quote:
Originally Posted by shilka View Post

EVGA SuperNova G2 1300 atts is a much better PSU

That one you picked is a bit meh and its really overpriced for what you get

That does not mean its bad

The problem is I'm limited to what's in stock. And it seem like most high output PSU's are out of stock!

I think I might just run two R9 290's at stock clocks with my AX860 until I can get a hold of a beast PSU. I probably have a decent amount of headroom to support a second card right now.

Thanks for the info. While we're on the topic of brand, would you say EVGA PSU's are your favorite? Who's the most highly revered in the 1300-1500 range considering price is no issue?
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post #15258 of 43911
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redvineal View Post

The problem is I'm limited to what's in stock. And it seem like most high output PSU's are out of stock!

I think I might just run two R9 290's at stock clocks with my AX860 until I can get a hold of a beast PSU. I probably have a decent amount of headroom to support a second card right now.

Thanks for the info. While we're on the topic of brand, would you say EVGA PSU's are your favorite? Who's the most highly revered in the 1300-1500 range considering price is no issue?

EVGA does not make the PSU´s they sell

In fact every EVGA PSU besides the G2 and P2 models suck in one way or another

Also there are not really any PSU´s above 1300 watts that does not have one flaw or another
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post #15259 of 43911
Quote:
Originally Posted by shilka View Post

EVGA does not make the PSU´s they sell

In fact every EVGA PSU besides the G2 and P2 models suck in one way or another

Also there are not really any PSU´s above 1300 watts that does not have one flaw or another

I have the nova 1300 watts. Please point out its flaws to me??
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post #15260 of 43911
Quote:
Originally Posted by kdawgmaster View Post

I have the nova 1300 watts. Please point out its flaws to me??

I said above 1300 watts

Only thing i can complain about with the G2 1300 watts is nitpicking

Like the Capxon caps on the modular board does not really matter in any way but it still dont like Capxon

And the manual could have been much better but thats not even nitpicking the PSU
Edited by shilka - 1/28/14 at 4:11pm
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