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[Official] AMD R9 290X / 290 Owners Club - Page 4171

post #41701 of 43971
Quote:
Originally Posted by mfknjadagr8 View Post

that's cool and all but you never explained how there are two different versions of amd drivers in every install (allegedly)yet an installed but not powered (via psu)card doesn't show up in device manager and doesn't change the driver structure or files in any way....you in fact skipped over that little tidbit smile.gif
I did not, that was covered by the other guy, just because the GPU doesn't get power from the pcie cables doesnt mean it aint reading it.

I had that happen long ago however it was a weak card, a gtx 430 that I used for testing boards. I put it in a HTPC without its cables hooked up by accident, it worked it displayed and was read in device manager however when under load it would crash which is what lead me to figure out I forgot the cables. Of course that is a completely different card with way less power reqs the same thing could be happening here.

As I stated previously " there are two different versions of AMD drivers in every install (allegedly)" I dont know that that is just a guess. What I do know is that if you install drivers and try to add a second without reinstalling it does not work. At least it didn't for me or the 100s of people that have threads about the exact same issue, along with the other guy that said something about before I did.

Know could this issue just be a certain set of drivers every now and then ya its possible. Could it work sometimes and not others that is also possible. Did it not for me and many many others, Yes.
Could installing a fresh driver versus installing a driver over another change the way that works yes. Have I tried no, because I dont have a need to I install my drivers with all my GPUs are installed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex132 View Post

Wait, is that one guy still believing that the R9 295X2 is limited to 75'c for lolz and not for a real reason?


Like he said, I never said there was not a reason. There is a reason I am sure, and seeing how the Devil 13 and Ares 3 have the same feature obviously it has nothing to do with pumps. Not that any person familiar with water cooling in the slightest would come to that conclusion, however AMD engineers might not be familiar with water cooling so there is that.

However if you want to keep your crazzy conspiracy theory that the AIO cooler is the cause then so be it, but I promise you that is not the reason.

If it were the reason someone better inform Corsair and everyone else that makes an AIO that get put on CPUs that even with them are way over 75c, Because we are going to have RMAs left and right oh wait we dont.

Funny AIOs have been out for years and years yet this 75c limit to avoid water temps of 50c+ have never been mentioned. Well by golly you guys are going to revolutionize the AIO water cooling market with these findings.

"AMD has clamped down on the R9 295X2’s GPUs, only allowing them to reach 75C before throttling. Upon finding this we asked AMD why they were using such a relatively low temperature limit, and the response we received is that it’s due to a combination of factors including the operational requirements of the CLLC itself, and what AMD considers the best temperature for optimal performance. As we briefly discussed in our 290X review leakage increases with temperature, and while Hawaii is supposed to be a lower leakage part leakage is still going to be occurring. To that end our best guess is that 75C is as warm as Hawaii can get before leakage starts becoming a problem for this card."

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7930/the-amd-radeon-r9-295x2-review/3

However this again does not imply pump problems either, the thing is that pump will withstand more heat than the tubing will. Those hoses will pull off the barbs long before there is any problems with the pump. Seeing how the other cards have the same limit I would think it would be safe to assume that "Leakage" is the problem.

When you put 2 GPUs so close together on 1 card that vastly changes the dynamic of the card. So while a regular 290x chip with space to spread out has a thermal limit of 95 it is not unreasonable for a dual version to have a different limit.

I would go on to mention this is why I pointed out the 7990 vs 7970 having different throttle limits. As a matter of fact I would venture a guess to say that if we looked at all the different Dual GPU cards we would see a pattern emerge of lower temp limits for Dual GPUs vs there single GPU counterpart.

Back on to the pump convo though, DDCs can and do hit way over 70c due to there AIr cooling friendly design, an AIOs pump is watercooled like a d5 all heat from the pump is dumped into the loop. the temp of the AIOs pump will be slightly higher than that of the water. Now we couple that with the fact that DDCs and D5s can both handle way more than 70C (ddcs board cannot however it can).

Now we are suggesting that a r9 295x2 can heat the water beyond 70c when its cores are past 75c, that would insane and the tubes would come off long before that.

But hey like I said you are welcome to think water you want.
Edited by Cyber Locc - 2/6/16 at 1:24pm
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post #41702 of 43971
Quote:
Originally Posted by mus1mus View Post

This is the 2nd time I've seen "laments terms" in this thread. So I'll chime in.


Put it in laymen's term coz by your logic, Washington APPLES are the same as Fuji APPLES. Nope, they are just apples. But not the same. tongue.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by mfknjadagr8 View Post

Sorry I needed it to be a little more light hearted

How yall know I wasnt saying that in Grief??? Hmmmmm I could have been saying that with sadness in my voice to get across my outlook on the statement, and used Laments to express my grief feeling as you cannot hear my voice? Ahhh assumptions and ad hominems, always fun.




JK I meant Laymens smile.gif.
Edited by Cyber Locc - 2/6/16 at 1:33pm
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post #41703 of 43971
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyber Locc View Post

Like he said, I never said there was not a reason. There is a reason I am sure, and seeing how the Devil 13 and Ares 3 have the same feature obviously it has nothing to do with pumps. Not that any person familiar with water cooling in the slightest would come to that conclusion, however AMD engineers might not be familiar with water cooling so there is that.

However if you want to keep your crazzy conspiracy theory that the AIO cooler is the cause then so be it, but I promise you that is not the reason.

If it were the reason someone better inform Corsair and everyone else that makes an AIO that get put on CPUs that even with them are way over 75c, Because we are going to have RMAs left and right oh wait we dont.

Funny AIOs have been out for years and years yet this 75c limit to avoid water temps of 50c+ have never been mentioned. Well by golly you guys are going to revolutionize the AIO water cooling market with these findings.

"AMD has clamped down on the R9 295X2’s GPUs, only allowing them to reach 75C before throttling. Upon finding this we asked AMD why they were using such a relatively low temperature limit, and the response we received is that it’s due to a combination of factors including the operational requirements of the CLLC itself, and what AMD considers the best temperature for optimal performance. As we briefly discussed in our 290X review leakage increases with temperature, and while Hawaii is supposed to be a lower leakage part leakage is still going to be occurring. To that end our best guess is that 75C is as warm as Hawaii can get before leakage starts becoming a problem for this card."

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7930/the-amd-radeon-r9-295x2-review/3

However this again does not imply pump problems either, the thing is that pump will withstand more heat than the tubing will. Those hoses will pull off the barbs long before there is any problems with the pump. Seeing how the other cards have the same limit I would think it would be safe to assume that "Leakage" is the problem.

When you put 2 GPUs so close together on 1 card that vastly changes the dynamic of the card. So while a regular 290x chip with space to spread out has a thermal limit of 95 it is not unreasonable for a dual version to have a different limit.

I would go on to mention this is why I pointed out the 7990 vs 7970 having different throttle limits. As a matter of fact I would venture a guess to say that if we looked at all the different Dual GPU cards we would see a pattern emerge of lower temp limits for Dual GPUs vs there single GPU counterpart.

Back on to the pump convo though, DDCs can and do hit way over 70c due to there AIr cooling friendly design, an AIOs pump is watercooled like a d5 all heat from the pump is dumped into the loop. the temp of the AIOs pump will be slightly higher than that of the water. Now we couple that with the fact that DDCs and D5s can both handle way more than 70C (ddcs board cannot however it can).

Now we are suggesting that a r9 295x2 can heat the water beyond 70c when its cores are past 75c, that would insane and the tubes would come off long before that.

But hey like I said you are welcome to think water you want.

Lets compare it to the other dual-pump OEM AIO graphics cards!
Oh. Wait. There are none.


Yeah AMD clearly put the 75'c limit on there for lolz. You gotta raise the limit to 900'c and stick it to the man! You show AMD.
Also nice sources on pump temperature limits. Oh. Wait. There are none.
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post #41704 of 43971
Also pretty sure the thermal limits for dual GPU cards have been the same as their single-GPU counterparts - except for 295x2.

I know this is a fact for the 4870X2, 5970, 590, 690, 7990 and Titan-Z.
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post #41705 of 43971
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex132 View Post

Lets compare it to the other dual-pump OEM AIO graphics cards!
Oh. Wait. There are none.


Yeah AMD clearly put the 75'c limit on there for lolz. You gotta raise the limit to 900'c and stick it to the man! You show AMD.
Also nice sources on pump temperature limits. Oh. Wait. There are none.

We dont need to compare it to other dual pump graphics cards lol.

Pump Temps,

https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-d5-vario-laing-d5-vario
EK d5 - Maximum liquid temperature: 60°C

https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-ddc-3-2-pwm-laing-ddc-3-2-pwm
EK DDC - Maximum liquid temperature: 60 °C

http://koolance.com/pmp-500-pump-g-1-4-bsp -

Koolance PMP 500 - 60°C (140°F)

http://www.laing.cz/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1&Itemid=2
Laings pump temps, Medium temperature norylových pumps 0 to +60C

Pay special attention to this next one as it is the same type of pump implored by the AIO,
http://www.alphacool.com/product_info.php/info/p1055_Alphacool-DC-LT-Keramik-12-Volt-Pumpe---bulk.html?language=en&XTCsid=2f6v9a5a1kaemlbvct8mr53qj2
Alphacool DC-LT Keramik
Maximum system temperature: 65°C

So you are right I was off by 10c its 60c, again those plastic barbs would begin to melt at 50c and hoses would pop, acrylic reservoirs would crack all sorts of madness.

If you cannot understand the difference between water and heat source temp well than I cannot help you, and a 75c temp on the core will not put water anywhere near 65c, it wont even be 50c it will be less than 40c lol.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex132 View Post

Also pretty sure the thermal limits for dual GPU cards have been the same as their single-GPU counterparts - except for 295x2.

I know this is a fact for the 4870X2, 5970, 590, 690, 7990 and Titan-Z.

also I am pretty sure no, 7990s was 85c vs 95c but by all means keep throwing conspiracy theory's. Sgt Biko said this had something to do with VRMs, I do not know personally.

Also check the facts again Anandtech says you are wrong, I said you are wrong, Pump makers tell you you are wrong, Science tells you that you ARE WRONG. So please stop spreading misinformation.

Edit: got the results for a Titan Z vs a Titan Black, this is a bad example as Titan Zs are not as strong as its single part SLI counter part.

Throttle temps
Titan Z 83c
Titan Black 95c

Well would you look at there seems that they do have varying max temps. Granted not as large of a variances as a 295x2 but varying temps still.

"Yeah AMD clearly put the 75'c limit on there for lolz. You gotta raise the limit to 900'c and stick it to the man! You show AMD."
Ya let that troll flag fly ..... Did you even read the convo?

As I am fairly sure you did not, no one is trying to raise the max temp. Someone said that the thermal limitation was solely because of the pump this is not true this is 100% false and ridiculous.

Things that could be a reason,

They didn't feel the rad on the clc could cool higher temps with the already fast fans they added.
the Leakage like Anandtech pointed out
The closeness of the components on the dual GPU card mainly the VRMs and Memory chips relative position to the core.
or any number of other situations, most likely it was a combination of all 3 as that is what AMD implied to Anandtech when asked.
Edited by Cyber Locc - 2/6/16 at 4:20pm
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post #41706 of 43971
I know I'm just a little late by now, but is it too late to join the club? tongue.gif
1)http://www.techpowerup.com/gpuz/details.php?id=w254n
2) XFX R9 290X 8GB
3) Stock

Hopefully it's okay to ask here (if not please point me in the right direction if you don't mind) but what are some good aftermarket coolers for the R9 290X?
Right now I have a stock cooler and while it does it's job, things do get a little toasty and I'd like a little more overclocking headroom.
Preferably I'm looking for a self-contained unit that doesn't require me to have my own custom loop (because I don't have one yet)
post #41707 of 43971
Quote:
Originally Posted by Butthurt Beluga View Post

I know I'm just a little late by now, but is it too late to join the club? tongue.gif
1)http://www.techpowerup.com/gpuz/details.php?id=w254n
2) XFX R9 290X 8GB
3) Stock

Hopefully it's okay to ask here (if not please point me in the right direction if you don't mind) but what are some good aftermarket coolers for the R9 290X?
Right now I have a stock cooler and while it does it's job, things do get a little toasty and I'd like a little more overclocking headroom.
Preferably I'm looking for a self-contained unit that doesn't require me to have my own custom loop (because I don't have one yet)

1. Pictures?

2. Yes, it is OK to check here, that's what this thread is all about...

Are you looking to water cool, or air cool?
Edited by JourneymanMike - 2/6/16 at 5:51pm
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post #41708 of 43971
Quote:
Originally Posted by JourneymanMike View Post

Are you looking to water cool, or air cool?
Either or really, but if it is water it'd need to could only have a 160mm~ radiator as it'd have to fit onto the back of my case (there's no room elsewhere)
post #41709 of 43971
Quote:
Originally Posted by Butthurt Beluga View Post

I know I'm just a little late by now, but is it too late to join the club? tongue.gif
1)http://www.techpowerup.com/gpuz/details.php?id=w254n
2) XFX R9 290X 8GB
3) Stock

Hopefully it's okay to ask here (if not please point me in the right direction if you don't mind) but what are some good aftermarket coolers for the R9 290X?
Right now I have a stock cooler and while it does it's job, things do get a little toasty and I'd like a little more overclocking headroom.
Preferably I'm looking for a self-contained unit that doesn't require me to have my own custom loop (because I don't have one yet)

 

Welcome to the 290X thread!

 

If you're going to make a change then at the least you should attach a AIO watercooler to your card.  Lots of good info here but scroll down to the bottom of the post for alternate cooling means: http://www.overclock.net/t/1436497/official-amd-r9-290x-290-owners-club/21880_20#post_22208781

 

One that I haven't added into the list is Corsair HG10.  Unfortunately it requires the use of a reference blower fan to cool the VRM's so you'd have to buy one of those: http://www.corsair.com/en-us/hydro-series-hg10-a1-gpu-liquid-cooling-bracket

 

Be sure to check https://www.ekwb.com/configurator/ to see if a full cover block will fit your card if you eventually plan to fully water cool it.

 

If you don't want to make an entire loop for CPU and GPU you could construct a small loop for just the GPU.  I did this in my HTPC and got fair results:

 

http://www.overclock.net/t/1561372/hawaii-bios-editing-290-290x-295x2-390-390x/800_20#post_24762217

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post #41710 of 43971
Quote:
Originally Posted by JourneymanMike View Post

1. Pictures?

]
hopefully that's good enough, unfortunately I don't have the original packaging
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roboyto View Post

Welcome to the 290X thread!

If you're going to make a change then at the least you should attach a AIO watercooler to your card. Lots of good info here but scroll down to the bottom of the post for alternate cooling means: http://www.overclock.net/t/1436497/official-amd-r9-290x-290-owners-club/21880_20#post_22208781

One that I haven't added into the list is Corsair HG10. Unfortunately it requires the use of a reference blower fan to cool the VRM's so you'd have to buy one of those: http://www.corsair.com/en-us/hydro-series-hg10-a1-gpu-liquid-cooling-bracket

Be sure to check https://www.ekwb.com/configurator/ to see if a full cover block will fit your card if you eventually plan to fully water cool it.

If you don't want to make an entire loop for CPU and GPU you could construct a small loop for just the GPU. I did this in my HTPC and got fair results:

http://www.overclock.net/t/1561372/hawaii-bios-editing-290-290x-295x2-390-390x/800_20#post_24762217

Thank you! The first thing I should have done was read through at least the first page of the thread, I got a little excited wheee.gif
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