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Alphacool Monsta / UT60 240 vs 280mm - (How powerful fans is needed ?)

post #1 of 11
Thread Starter 
Hi

Is VERY close to buying a Monstra 280mm, after I didnt won a auction on a UT60 ....

Alphacool NexXxoS Monsta 280mm
http://www.aquatuning.de/product_info.php/info/p15233_Alphacool-NexXxoS-Monsta-280mm.html

Will use Push/pull but how powerful fans do I need to get the air moving, it its 83mm thick .... Can I use:

4x Noiseblocker NB-BlackSilentPRO PK1
http://www.aquatuning.de/product_info.php/info/p7928_Noiseblocker-NB-BlackSilentPRO-PK1---140x140x25mm--.html

Or something more powerfull like this ?

4x Noiseblocker NB-BlackSilentPRO PK2
http://www.aquatuning.de/product_info.php/info/p7928_Noiseblocker-NB-BlackSilentPRO-PK1---140x140x25mm--.html

Is really trying to keep the system low noise, but know that I need some static pressure to keep the air moving throught the big rad ...

Someone was taking about that Noiseblocker NB-eLoop will come in 140mm, but cant find anything about them.

Do you think some good high static fans ~1000 rpm will do the job ?

Regards Fonne

Has changed the name of the thread a bit, look at post #7:
Quote:
Alphacool NexXxoS UT60 Full Copper 240mm
http://www.aquatuning.de/product_info.php/info/p12346_Alphacool-NexXxoS-UT60-Full-Copper-240mm.html

+ 4x Scythe Gentle Typhoon Fan 800 rpm (Push/Pull) (Maybe a bit faster fans)
http://www.aquatuning.de/product_info.php/info/p6618_Scythe-Gentle-Typhoon-Fan-800-rpm---120x120x25mm--.html

Something like this really looks like a NICE setup when looking at performance / noise ... But the 280mm RAD got ~1/3 more front area, can it really be right that the better 120mm fans is worth the downsize in rad ?

Has been looking at my case, and really think that the Monstra will take to much space + dont perform better at low rpm, so it will be the UT60 - Just need to deside between 240 or 280mm.

Edited by Fonne - 11/12/13 at 9:21am
post #2 of 11
Have a look at Martin's Liquid Lab.
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post #3 of 11
You'd be better off to get the PK3 Noiseblockers than the PK1 0r PK2 and use them with a fan controller so you can fine tune the noise/cooling to your tastes. Aquatuning that you have linked has a monsta 280 combo that comes with 2 of the PK3s.

The Phanteks PH-F140SP is a new 140mm fan that was created with static pressure in mind that you also might want to consider.

http://www.phanteks.com/PH-F140SP.html

If you're not going to use a fan controller then the NB PK2s would probably put you in about the right range, as the mosta rads don't do as well at low rpms (<1000 rpm) as say, a UT60 would, but starting about 1200rpms the monsta kicks everything else's butt.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1309645/bundymania-user-review-triple-radiator-360-roundup-with-22-rads/0_20

That's why it's nice to have a fan that's capable of getting well up into the monsta's +1200 rpm territory but with a fan controller so you can dial it down to where you find that sweet spot of balance between noise and performance that best suits your tastes. And a good fan controller can set it to do more. For example with a Lamptron CW611 you can set it to automatic mode with low and high rpm targets so when the temps hit whatever threshold temp you set it to it will automatically begin ramping up fan speeds up to your set max until the temps come back down.

Anywho, that's just my too sense. tongue.gif

EDIT:
OR, instead of a fan controller like the Lamptron you could use some PWM fans like the NB-BlackSilentPro PK-PS and do pretty much the same thing with a PWM splitter cable like the GeLid PWM 1-to-4 plugged into your CPU_FAN mobo header using speedfan.
Edited by Unicr0nhunter - 11/12/13 at 2:08am
post #4 of 11
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unicr0nhunter View Post

You'd be better off to get the PK3 Noiseblockers than the PK1 0r PK2 and use them with a fan controller so you can fine tune the noise/cooling to your tastes. Aquatuning that you have linked has a monsta 280 combo that comes with 2 of the PK3s.

The Phanteks PH-F140SP is a new 140mm fan that was created with static pressure in mind that you also might want to consider.

http://www.phanteks.com/PH-F140SP.html Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
If you're not going to use a fan controller then the NB PK2s would probably put you in about the right range, as the mosta rads don't do as well at low rpms (<1000 rpm) as say, a UT60 would, but starting about 1200rpms the monsta kicks everything else's butt.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1309645/bundymania-user-review-triple-radiator-360-roundup-with-22-rads/0_20

That's why it's nice to have a fan that's capable of getting well up into the monsta's +1200 rpm territory but with a fan controller so you can dial it down to where you find that sweet spot of balance between noise and performance that best suits your tastes. And a good fan controller can set it to do more. For example with a Lamptron CW611 you can set it to automatic mode with low and high rpm targets so when the temps hit whatever threshold temp you set it to it will automatically begin ramping up fan speeds up to your set max until the temps come back down.

Anywho, that's just my too sense. tongue.gif
EDIT:
OR, instead of a fan controller like the Lamptron you could use some PWM fans like the NB-BlackSilentPro PK-PS and do pretty much the same thing with a PWM splitter cable like the GeLid PWM 1-to-4 plugged into your CPU_FAN mobo header using speedfan.

Thanks, great reply thumb.gif

Will take a closer look on the Bundy review later tonight smile.gif

The Phanteks PH-F140SP look really nice, but cant find any EU prices or shops, but will ask Aquatuning if they will get them.

My plan was to use max ~1200 rpm fans to keep the noise down, maybe with a controller like the Lamtron CW611.

Maybe I should just get the UT60 when not using faster fans, but really like the overkill look that the Monstra got biggrin.gif
post #5 of 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fonne View Post

[...] The Phanteks PH-F140SP look really nice, but cant find any EU prices or shops, but will ask Aquatuning if they will get them. [...]

http://www.phanteks.cn/map.html

^ Under the map you can find links to Phanteks distributors for whatever country you choose. wink.gif

Personally, I'm not much of a fan of 140mm series rads, but that's mostly because 140mm fans tend to lack the static pressure vs noise capabilities that so many 120mm fans excel in. You'll see valid claims from 140mm series proponents that they offer more surface cooling area than the comparable sized 120mm series rad, and the percentage of supposed dead-zone behind the fan motor is less (this ignores the fact that many rads like the monsta have ~5mm or more of space between the fan blades and the rad's fins that acts as a sort of shroud that minimizes if-not eliminates dead-zones) but those supposed advantages of 140mm series rads over 120mm series rads just do not pan out in actual performance thanks to the weak comparative static pressure capabilities of 140mm fans to 120mm fans.

The Phanteks 140mm SP fan is supposed to have been designed with that in mind, and their claims of dB & static pressure stats do look really good in that respect (though still not that of a 120mm Gentle Typhoon or Noiseblocker), but it's still so new of a product I'm not aware of any actual testing that has been done with them yet to see how well they actually do perform on a rad.

Also, 140mm wider rad/fans tend to cause more issues with offset clearance for heatsinks, ram, and CPU power cables and such when mounted in the top above a motherboard in so many cases that 120mm rads/fans don't. That extra 10mm wider on either side can make a big difference between what will fit or not.
Edited by Unicr0nhunter - 11/12/13 at 3:24am
post #6 of 11
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unicr0nhunter View Post

http://www.phanteks.cn/map.html

^ Under the map you can find links to Phanteks distributors for whatever country you choose. wink.gif

Personally, I'm not much of a fan of 140mm series rads, but that's mostly because 140mm fans tend to lack the static pressure vs noise capabilities that so many 120mm fans excel in. The Phanteks 140mm SP fan is supposed to have been designed with that in mind, and their claims of dB & static pressure stats do look really good in that respect, but it's still so new of a product I'm not aware of any actual testing that has been done with them yet to see how well they actually do perform.

Also, 140mm wider rad/fans tend to cause more issues with offset clearance for heatsinks, ram, and CPU power cables and such when mounted in the top above a motherboard in so many cases that 120mm rads/fans don't. That extra 10mm wider on either side can make a big difference between what will fit or not.

Got a Caselab S3, so the space will not be a problem smile.gif ... Really a shame the 140mm fans marked it not bigger, the frontal area is quit a bit bigger than on a 120mm ...

Is also looking at the 240mm Monstra with 4x Gentle Typhoon or similar fans, but would really like the get the bigger area from the 280 ....

12x12x2 = 288 cm2
14x14x2 = 392 cm2

The front area on the 280mm is "way" larger, but the fans could be better it seems like ...
post #7 of 11
Thread Starter 
Alphacool NexXxoS UT60 Full Copper 240mm
http://www.aquatuning.de/product_info.php/info/p12346_Alphacool-NexXxoS-UT60-Full-Copper-240mm.html

+ 4x Scythe Gentle Typhoon Fan 800 rpm (Push/Pull) (Maybe a bit faster fans)
http://www.aquatuning.de/product_info.php/info/p6618_Scythe-Gentle-Typhoon-Fan-800-rpm---120x120x25mm--.html

Something like this really looks like a NICE setup when looking at performance / noise ... But the 280mm RAD got ~1/3 more front area, can it really be right that the better 120mm fans is worth the downsize in rad ?

Has been looking at my case, and really think that the Monstra will take to much space + dont perform better at low rpm, so it will be the UT60 - Just need to deside between 240 or 280mm.
post #8 of 11
Well, as I noted above, you'll find many here will defend their 140mm-series rads for many reasons. That said, it just hasn't been my experience, albeit limited, that the increased surface area of a 140-series rad matters more than good performing fans do.

My only experience with a 140mm series rad was when I stupidly 'upgraded' from an H100i to an H110 only to find my temps suffered quite a bit. I was slightly overclocking a pentium D and it would get HOT so I was really looking to help bring the temps down but the H110 couldn't do it. I even doubled up Corsair's H110 fans I got off ebay to do push-pull and they were so loud it was ridiculous and still didn't get back to the temps I had with my H100i with just the 2 SP120s and I used to just barely notice the fan noise on it, so I gave up on PWM and tried various other 140 mm fans on a fan controller including NB PK-3s, Aerocool shark 140s, and Noctua A14s, all fans I was recommended to try in this forum and others, and still couldn't get comparable temps unless I cranked the fans up basically to 100% which was unbearable. It wasn't long after that before 140mm series rads and I parted ways, perhaps for good.
post #9 of 11
Thread Starter 
Thanks for all your reply, really great thumb.gif

- Would like to see what somebody else is thinking, still not sure on 240 vs 280 smile.gif - Is trying to find a review where both 240mm and 280mm is testet in the same system, but cant find any ?
post #10 of 11
Thickness matters less when you are doing push/pull because the air is less likely to slow down, if at all. I had a ST30 and a Monsta in the same build previously, ST30 was push while the Monsta was push/pull, at the same RPM they both felt like they were pushing equal amounts of air. I would even say that the air was flowing through the Monsta faster. Keep in mind I had my fans running around 850 RPM.

As for 120 vs. 140, it really is personally preference. I have used 140 with Bgears before and it was a bit louder than AP-15s but they had a smoother lower motor tone. I will be using PK-3s when I buy a 280 radiator for my 750D since I really liked their noise profile when I checked them out with a friend who has them. Another option is using Bgears adapters with GTs but this will add about 10-12mm of total thickness, but they will definitely perform just as great as they do with 120 radiators.
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