Overclock.net › Forums › Industry News › Hardware News › [wccf] Intel Haswell Refresh Lineup For Q2 2014 Unveiled – Core i7-4790 Leading The Pack
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

[wccf] Intel Haswell Refresh Lineup For Q2 2014 Unveiled – Core i7-4790 Leading The Pack - Page 16

post #151 of 158
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pheesh View Post

the next charge for CPU/gfx performance is going to be to power VR
Well there was a rumor that Intel is going away from the onboard voltage regulators with these refreshed chips. In that case it would make sense they would not be compatible with previous motherboards. I like the editorializing by that site though. I don't think Intel has that big of an interest in reducing the pool of people that would upgrade their processors on LGA1150 (which they make money on) just so they could sell a few more chipsets (which they barely make money on).


That would be a much better reason than a micro code lockout thumb.gif But also indicates they kinda screwed up on haswell gen 1 for enthusiast k models, surly the k models were not a primary design consideration with this 4th gen till now, sorta pisses me off, but that's free enterprise.

Quote:
Originally Posted by f0rteOC View Post

Maybe see if someone is selling a binned chip in the OCN marketplace. If not, you might get lucky and get a high-clocking 4770K. thumb.gif

Yes, just springing for a 4.7 chip may be the easy way out thumb.gif


Edit: So I read the new Pentium 20th anniversary unlocked dual cores will run on 8 and 9 series broads, but no 4970k.

This does not seem like an engineering lock-out, more like a BS deal for z87 owners with apparently the same physical socket!
Edited by the finisher - 3/22/14 at 4:00pm
New stuff
(15 items)
 
Mini Gamer
(14 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
4790k @ 4.7Ghz Asus Maximus Formula VI EVGA GTX780 Hydrocopper skyn3t bios EVGA GTX780 Hydrocopper skyn3t bios 
RAMHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
32GB Gskill 2400Mhz = fast ram disk :-) 850 pro 840 evo 500GB 840 evo 500GB 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingOS
1 TB WD black 1 TB WD black Custom water cooling ;-) Win 7 pro 
MonitorPowerCase
Waiting Enermax Revolution 85+ 1050 watt Tt 900 Super Tower 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i5 760 @ 4.2 EVGA P55 sli micro EVGA GTX780 SC ACX Corsair Dominator 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveOptical Drive
Intel SSD X25-M G2 x2 WD VelociRaptor WD1500HLFS x2 WD Black WD1001FALS LG GGW-H20L Super Multi Blue 
CoolingOSMonitorMonitor
Thermalright Silver Arrow  Win 7 pro  LG 26" 1920*1200  Envision 22" 1680*1050 
PowerCase
CORSAIR Professional Series Gold AX750 NZXT Vulcan modded 
  hide details  
Reply
New stuff
(15 items)
 
Mini Gamer
(14 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
4790k @ 4.7Ghz Asus Maximus Formula VI EVGA GTX780 Hydrocopper skyn3t bios EVGA GTX780 Hydrocopper skyn3t bios 
RAMHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
32GB Gskill 2400Mhz = fast ram disk :-) 850 pro 840 evo 500GB 840 evo 500GB 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingOS
1 TB WD black 1 TB WD black Custom water cooling ;-) Win 7 pro 
MonitorPowerCase
Waiting Enermax Revolution 85+ 1050 watt Tt 900 Super Tower 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i5 760 @ 4.2 EVGA P55 sli micro EVGA GTX780 SC ACX Corsair Dominator 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveOptical Drive
Intel SSD X25-M G2 x2 WD VelociRaptor WD1500HLFS x2 WD Black WD1001FALS LG GGW-H20L Super Multi Blue 
CoolingOSMonitorMonitor
Thermalright Silver Arrow  Win 7 pro  LG 26" 1920*1200  Envision 22" 1680*1050 
PowerCase
CORSAIR Professional Series Gold AX750 NZXT Vulcan modded 
  hide details  
Reply
post #152 of 158
Quote:
Originally Posted by the finisher View Post

This does not seem like an engineering lock-out, more like a BS deal for z87 owners with apparently the same physical socket!
Hopefully a modded BIOS can get around that. Seems like a dumb cash grab from Intel...
post #153 of 158
It does seem odd, as I'd think they would have a larger potential market if the new chips worked on both chipsets, Sell more k cpus doh.gif
New stuff
(15 items)
 
Mini Gamer
(14 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
4790k @ 4.7Ghz Asus Maximus Formula VI EVGA GTX780 Hydrocopper skyn3t bios EVGA GTX780 Hydrocopper skyn3t bios 
RAMHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
32GB Gskill 2400Mhz = fast ram disk :-) 850 pro 840 evo 500GB 840 evo 500GB 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingOS
1 TB WD black 1 TB WD black Custom water cooling ;-) Win 7 pro 
MonitorPowerCase
Waiting Enermax Revolution 85+ 1050 watt Tt 900 Super Tower 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i5 760 @ 4.2 EVGA P55 sli micro EVGA GTX780 SC ACX Corsair Dominator 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveOptical Drive
Intel SSD X25-M G2 x2 WD VelociRaptor WD1500HLFS x2 WD Black WD1001FALS LG GGW-H20L Super Multi Blue 
CoolingOSMonitorMonitor
Thermalright Silver Arrow  Win 7 pro  LG 26" 1920*1200  Envision 22" 1680*1050 
PowerCase
CORSAIR Professional Series Gold AX750 NZXT Vulcan modded 
  hide details  
Reply
New stuff
(15 items)
 
Mini Gamer
(14 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
4790k @ 4.7Ghz Asus Maximus Formula VI EVGA GTX780 Hydrocopper skyn3t bios EVGA GTX780 Hydrocopper skyn3t bios 
RAMHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
32GB Gskill 2400Mhz = fast ram disk :-) 850 pro 840 evo 500GB 840 evo 500GB 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingOS
1 TB WD black 1 TB WD black Custom water cooling ;-) Win 7 pro 
MonitorPowerCase
Waiting Enermax Revolution 85+ 1050 watt Tt 900 Super Tower 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i5 760 @ 4.2 EVGA P55 sli micro EVGA GTX780 SC ACX Corsair Dominator 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveOptical Drive
Intel SSD X25-M G2 x2 WD VelociRaptor WD1500HLFS x2 WD Black WD1001FALS LG GGW-H20L Super Multi Blue 
CoolingOSMonitorMonitor
Thermalright Silver Arrow  Win 7 pro  LG 26" 1920*1200  Envision 22" 1680*1050 
PowerCase
CORSAIR Professional Series Gold AX750 NZXT Vulcan modded 
  hide details  
Reply
post #154 of 158
Quote:
Originally Posted by fateswarm View Post

Yes, exactly. GPUs are bottlenecking CPUs of Intel.

If we could, we'd be ray tracing in real time on 3 X 8K monitors. Because you know what? It would look better/more real and the human eye can still see aliasing on most configurations of even 4K. *antialiasing is practically high quality sophisticated blurring. It will only look optimal in terms of resolution if we never have to use it again.

GPUs are bottlenecking CPUs in general, AMD is slower than Intel but they're not that much slower.

That is unless you want to tell me that the stuff I experienced running an FX was all a dream or something and even then, I still have the chip and can easily put my HD7950/HD7850 in and show clear GPU bottlenecks in various games.
We can see aliasing but it has nothing to do with the GPU beyond giving us more performance for higher resolution, give us higher DPI and it's harder to see it until it gets to the point where you can no longer see the stairs effect at all unless you have your nose on the screen. I'm curious to see what that 24" 4k screen from Dell looks like in real life and how obvious aliasing would be on that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by the finisher View Post

Hope this is false, but probably not mad.gif

http://www.legitreviews.com/hands-on-with-devils-canyon-intel-haswell-refresh_137746

"The one bad bit of information is that it appears that Devil’s Canyon will only be supported by the Intel 9-series motherboards. Intel is very tight lipped on what they are saying, but if this is true they will be locking down what boards support these new CPU’s by the CPU micro code in order to push sales of their new Z97 platform. We originally thought the Haswell Refresh would be for the 8 and 9 series! Both are LGA1150 processors, so one would hope that it would be supported on Intel 8-series boards!"


If this is true I'm no longer a Intel fan, not that I am fan of any company, but this is a kick to the groin. I picked up all the parts for my new build in the last few months, including a new Maximus VI Formula. I have been waiting for the haswell refresh, because the current package of this chip sucks. I guess I'll get a cheap 4770k from MC, and hope i get lucky, probably de-lid.rolleyes.gif

If Intel cares, I've waited since X58 and P55 since building a new rig, if this happens it will be even longer next time. They already have long term problems with the death of Moores law, and ARMs lead in mobile on a inferior process. Now their greed will be their undoing.

This hobby has definitely become less fun to me.

And here I was considering upgrading to this.
Oh well, guess I'll just get a better 1155 board on eBay.
Quote:
Originally Posted by the finisher View Post

Thing is sounds like a "business" decision from keeping 4970k off the z87, not engineering.

It definitely is.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pheesh View Post

Well there was a rumor that Intel is going away from the onboard voltage regulators with these refreshed chips. In that case it would make sense they would not be compatible with previous motherboards. I like the editorializing by that site though. I don't think Intel has that big of an interest in reducing the pool of people that would upgrade their processors on LGA1150 (which they make money on) just so they could sell a few more chipsets (which they barely make money on).

...Why would they do that? They did it to help increase efficiency and it appears to have very little in the way of drawbacks.

And besides, even if they get very little money on each chipset sold that's still extra profit for them, I'm guessing if this is true that a suit used theoretical numbers and came up with potential sales being bigger than any losses from people who just won't upgrade to the refresh now.
Edited by Brutuz - 3/23/14 at 12:51am
My system
(22 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i5 3770k @ 4.7Ghz ASRock Z77 Pro3 Powercolor Radeon HD7950 3GB @ 1150/1350 4x4GB G.Skill Ares 2000Mhz CL9 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveOptical Drive
Samsung 840 250GB Western Digital Black 1TB WD1002FAEX Samsung Spinpoint EcoGreen 2TB Pioneer DVR-220LBKS 
CoolingCoolingCoolingOS
Noctua NH-D14 Scythe Gentle Typhoon 1850rpm Corsair AF140 Quiet Edition Arch Linux x86-64, amdgpu 
OSMonitorMonitorKeyboard
Windows 10 Bloatfree Edition BenQ G2220HD BenQ G2020HD Ducky Shine III Year of the Snake, Cherry Blue 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Silverstone Strider Plus 600w Lian Li Lancool PC-K60 SteelSeries Sensei Professional Artisan Hien Mid Japan Black Large 
AudioOther
ASUS Xonar DX NZXT Sentry Mesh 30w Fan Controller 
  hide details  
Reply
My system
(22 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i5 3770k @ 4.7Ghz ASRock Z77 Pro3 Powercolor Radeon HD7950 3GB @ 1150/1350 4x4GB G.Skill Ares 2000Mhz CL9 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveOptical Drive
Samsung 840 250GB Western Digital Black 1TB WD1002FAEX Samsung Spinpoint EcoGreen 2TB Pioneer DVR-220LBKS 
CoolingCoolingCoolingOS
Noctua NH-D14 Scythe Gentle Typhoon 1850rpm Corsair AF140 Quiet Edition Arch Linux x86-64, amdgpu 
OSMonitorMonitorKeyboard
Windows 10 Bloatfree Edition BenQ G2220HD BenQ G2020HD Ducky Shine III Year of the Snake, Cherry Blue 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Silverstone Strider Plus 600w Lian Li Lancool PC-K60 SteelSeries Sensei Professional Artisan Hien Mid Japan Black Large 
AudioOther
ASUS Xonar DX NZXT Sentry Mesh 30w Fan Controller 
  hide details  
Reply
post #155 of 158
Wat? CPUs (of Intel, on i7 or better) are only bearly a "bottleneck" only on multimonitor or extreme resolution setups. But that's not what the majority of people do. Even those with 2 or 3 monitors that aren't in overclocking testing usually only use the center one. It's like saying a truck is slow if it tows 10 cars. Of course, it's supposed to do 1.

And it depends on the program. It's VERY EASY to make a s***ty game that overuses the CPU or vice versa. This about the average, not 1 example you found to hijack the discussion.

And the ray tracing example (or other less GPU intensive examples) wasn't just about CPUs. BOTH will be needed. It was a way to show that if you think we are "done" in terms of performance you are mistaken.
Edited by fateswarm - 3/23/14 at 7:56am
PC
(9 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
4790K 4.6G 1.24v/1.74v, 5.1G 1.35v validation. GA-Z97X-Gaming 7 Tri-X R9 290 1100/1350 +0.012v G.Skill 2400 c10 
CoolingMonitorPowerCase
Noctua NH-D15 24EA53 IPS 76Hz OC EVGA 1000 G2 Phanteks Enthoo Pro 
Audio
SoundMagic E10 
  hide details  
Reply
PC
(9 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
4790K 4.6G 1.24v/1.74v, 5.1G 1.35v validation. GA-Z97X-Gaming 7 Tri-X R9 290 1100/1350 +0.012v G.Skill 2400 c10 
CoolingMonitorPowerCase
Noctua NH-D15 24EA53 IPS 76Hz OC EVGA 1000 G2 Phanteks Enthoo Pro 
Audio
SoundMagic E10 
  hide details  
Reply
post #156 of 158
Quote:
Originally Posted by fateswarm View Post

Wat? CPUs (of Intel, on i7 or better) are only bearly a "bottleneck" only on multimonitor or extreme resolution setups. But that's not what the majority of people do. Even those with 2 or 3 monitors that aren't in overclocking testing usually only use the center one. It's like saying a truck is slow if it tows 10 cars. Of course, it's supposed to do 1.

And it depends on the program. It's VERY EASY to make a ****ty game that overuses the CPU or vice versa. This about the average, not 1 example you found to hijack the discussion.

It's only a few games, but what can you do if you want to play those? It's especially WoW and SC2, both games where you can get pretty invested emotionally in what you do, so it feels more annoying than it would in some single player game. The low FPS are also happening exactly in the moments where you'd need high FPS the most.

That said, you are of course right in that it's the developer's fault. The design documents should have explicitly said to target a 60 FPS minimum on a strong dual core or something.
post #157 of 158
Quote:
Originally Posted by deepor View Post

It's only a few games, but what can you do if you want to play those? It's especially WoW and SC2, both games where you can get pretty invested emotionally in what you do, so it feels more annoying than it would in some single player game. The low FPS are also happening exactly in the moments where you'd need high FPS the most.

That said, you are of course right in that it's the developer's fault. The design documents should have explicitly said to target a 60 FPS minimum on a strong dual core or something.

Well no you have a point. I happen to know a little about MMO programming and it's not just their fault. They are not really bad programmers, after all they spent billions on it.

The thing is those games have a lot of work to do independently of GPU work is my impression. For example say you have 40 people's characters next to you. You don't only have to calculate their graphics but also the interactions and to collect and sort the data etc.

So yeah, there are legit examples of high intensity on CPU.

But I doubt that applies to those saying it for FPS games here. Chances are if your game looks similar and plays similar with another and the other is much faster your programming sucks.
PC
(9 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
4790K 4.6G 1.24v/1.74v, 5.1G 1.35v validation. GA-Z97X-Gaming 7 Tri-X R9 290 1100/1350 +0.012v G.Skill 2400 c10 
CoolingMonitorPowerCase
Noctua NH-D15 24EA53 IPS 76Hz OC EVGA 1000 G2 Phanteks Enthoo Pro 
Audio
SoundMagic E10 
  hide details  
Reply
PC
(9 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
4790K 4.6G 1.24v/1.74v, 5.1G 1.35v validation. GA-Z97X-Gaming 7 Tri-X R9 290 1100/1350 +0.012v G.Skill 2400 c10 
CoolingMonitorPowerCase
Noctua NH-D15 24EA53 IPS 76Hz OC EVGA 1000 G2 Phanteks Enthoo Pro 
Audio
SoundMagic E10 
  hide details  
Reply
post #158 of 158
UPDATE

I'm most interested in the unlocked Pentiums if they're soldered , there doesn't seem to be an unlocked i7-4790K according to http://www.cpu-world.com/news_2014/2014040201_Clock_speeds_of_Haswell_Refresh_CPUs_confirmed.html
Quote:
Originally Posted by http://www.anandtech.com/show/7872/unlocked-haswell-pentium-due-mid2014 
In order to celebrate 20+ years of the Pentium brand, Intel is releasing a fully unlocked Haswell (4th generation) processor in the middle of 2014. Current Pentium processors in this range are dual core models without hyperthreading, with 3MB of L3 Cache and limited HD (Haswell) integrated graphics. Intel is aiming that an unlocked Pentium processor will open up cheaper gaming systems based on the Pentium brand.

The Intel Pentium G3420 for example is a dual core 3.2 GHz processor (no Turbo Boost) with a 53W TDP and Intel HD Graphics. If we were to apply the almost +50%-+100% overclock of the older Core2Duo systems here, we would be looking at 4.8 GHz to 6.4 GHz frequency. Given the overclockability of the current Haswell K processors, 4.8 GHz is more likely than 6.4 GHz in this part.

We have asked Intel if this new part will be given a K moniker, and how the pricing of the part will feature among the other processors, although we have been told that this information is not currently being released. Part of extreme overclocking back with Core2Duo was taking that cheap processor and doubling the clock speed with a few simple option changes – given that this CPU is based on Haswell (it sounds like it will come with the Haswell refresh CPUs, though not confirmed) we can get an insight into how the lower binned CPU parts might perform. Whether these will act as viable CPUs in gaming PCs, I hope to
get one in to find out.
Quote:
Originally Posted by http://www.cpu-world.com/news_2014/2014041201_Intel_Haswell_Refresh_CPUs_to_launch_in_May.html 
As a part of "Haswell Refresh", Intel is going to replace all desktop non-"K" processors. Overall we will see more than 20 models, starting from value-priced Celeron G1840, G1840T and G1850, and up to premium Core i7-4785T, i7-4790, i7-4790S and i7-4790T. Intel will also introduce budget Pentium G3240, G3240T, G3440, G3440T and G3450, and mid-class Core i3-4150, i3-4150T, i3-4350, i3-4350T and i3-4360. Mainstream segment will be represented by Core i5-4590, i5-4590S, i5-4590T, i5-4690, i5-4690S and i5-4690T, and possibly by Core i5-4460S and i5-4460T. For the most part, the "Haswell Refresh" CPUs will have 100 MHz higher base and turbo clock speeds than their predecessors, which will result in a small performance increase, up to a few percent compared to last year's SKUs. Unlocked "Haswell Refresh" models will be available in the third quarter.
^ suggests the Pentium G3240 and G3440 are not unlocked

The initial price-"leaks" are semi- discouraging at $70-100 for the Pentium CPUs if they're locked
http://www.pcconnection.com/product/intel-processor-pentium-g3240-3.1ghz-3mb-boxed/bx80646g3240/16923521
http://www.pcconnection.com/product/intel-processor-pentium-g3440-3.3ghz-3mb-boxed/bx80646g3440/16923512

To put it in into perspective, a $100ish A8-7600 has 45W TDP but draws more than that once the GPU is counted ; a $80 Athlon X4 750K (100W TDP) would be competitive with any locked Pentium in general use except for single threaded workloads. And if you put into the perspective that there's $120 i3 Haswell , the faster Pentiums need to be unlocked to sell for $100ish. Once you factor in Microcenter selling i3-4340 bundles you better have a darn good reason to buy a Pentium.
Edited by AlphaC - 4/13/14 at 10:39am
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Hardware News
Overclock.net › Forums › Industry News › Hardware News › [wccf] Intel Haswell Refresh Lineup For Q2 2014 Unveiled – Core i7-4790 Leading The Pack