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Gigabyte Z87X-UD3H: Worth 30€ over the ASRock Z87 Extreme4? - Page 5

post #41 of 59
Quote:
Since the overclocking ability of the 2 motherboards seem the same (according to tomshardware even a little better for ASRock)

For the love of god don't quote tomshardware or anandtech for haswell overclocking. Both of them have not the slightest idea what they are doing and refuse to change anything aside from core multiplier and vcore. Many of their board comparisons, particularly for anandtech, use different settings on each board, and have a winner and a loser by fluke of a CPU liking one pair of random settings over another
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post #42 of 59
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johny Boy View Post

Why don't you purchase the Asrock board and provide us with your views / input's considering you are playing in 120$-160$ price bracket which sadly doesnt have Asus Hero board and MSI boards have VRM problems with terrible heat issues.I had one and i can say MSI was hottest board.Sorry but Hero/UD3H seems more like capable boards for longer run.
Best way to check about why certain board is better than other one is by reading ownership threads of each board that you want to buy.
I'd really like to, but the problem is I have a limited budget and I'm not a reviewer, so I won't get free/lent samples to use in evaluating. When I'll end my studies and I'll get my money, it will be my pleasure building rigs for the sake of it, maybe even reselling them as a mini-job. For now I'm forced to choose the best components with the already available knowledge. Anyway thanks for sharing YOUR experience with MSI! +rep incoming!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyro999 View Post

For the love of god don't quote tomshardware or anandtech for haswell overclocking. Both of them have not the slightest idea what they are doing and refuse to change anything aside from core multiplier and vcore. Many of their board comparisons, particularly for anandtech, use different settings on each board, and have a winner and a loser by fluke of a CPU liking one pair of random settings over another

Oh god, I chose to rely on them for OC info. That uncovers a paradox in my choice: I wanted a well OCable motherboard without even informing on how it's done on modern HW (I only know how to OC for Core2Duo CPUs...). So you think that's why they elected Biostar and ASRock as winners for the <$200 mobos?
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post #43 of 59
Mate i was in same boat for far too long than what you are right now.
Believe me it took me 2 months to select board for i7 just after a month of building FX based rig for myself which my brother took for his studies.
Seriously i never owned Asus board in my life as my previous Intel chip was p4 2.66 with MSI board as that was cheaper rig 10 years ago and i was happy to have a PC that was my apple butter.Then came to AMD's Athlon chips again with MSI boards and wow....but seriously those MSI boards for AMD have left me running after " after market " chip level repair guys far too many times than i wished for.
Then upgrade itch hit me hard with haswell and seriously i for name sake went with Hero board that was about 30$ more over UD3H / 100$ more over Ext4.But i wanted best for my money and i am loving it.Its not a full fledged ROG board but does everything that ROG boards does for far too less money.Then got two i5's on sale and one of them is a DUD paired with MSI G65 board which was hot as hell being replaced by M-D3H board and other with UD3H.

Please remember you wont be buying things on daily regular basis and you are still studying so spend wisely.Save few bucks more now on Ext4 and you might have to suffer later on.I went with heart for first time and logic for second time.Though i have kaput HDMI on UD3H so any board can fail so mate go with choice that suits you but that thing must outlast the price you are paying for it.
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post #44 of 59
Thread Starter 
Johny, you got all my feels xD
Joking apart, what you wrote is just me in a thread, I took the same time to choose a good smartphone, after years with a nokia n73. Now the same happens, but this time I care even more, since I would like not to buy another cpu+mobo for ~4 years, and I love personal computers way more than phones! The problem is just that! I don't want to make bad decisions, so I need all the time, but at the same time I can't wait to have a shiny upgrade. I wish it was easier to choose, but in the end I have to realize it's not the end of the world if I take the slightly worse decision (it could be spending less to have a lesser component, or the other way around choosing the beefier component, only to realize I really didn't need it).

So, what I wish(ed) for Christmas is the clarity of mind to make the right decision, and all the knowledge I can possibly gather about this wonderful piece of technology that is a motherboard!

ITT: weirdo talking about motherboards as his own children xD
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post #45 of 59
Quote:
Oh god, I chose to rely on them for OC info. That uncovers a paradox in my choice: I wanted a well OCable motherboard without even informing on how it's done on modern HW (I only know how to OC for Core2Duo CPUs...). So you think that's why they elected Biostar and ASRock as winners for the <$200 mobos?

It doesn't really matter how they selected them with that kind of testing methodology. It's ridiculously bad and an embarrassment to tech scene
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post #46 of 59
Thread Starter 
Don't you think we can reuse their testing at least as an index about how a motherboard behaves in light overclocking, since prolly non-experts will only modify clock rate? I am really just wondering, since I practically don't know how to OC a haswell CPU. (I'd like to study it now, but as i'm writing here, in the other browser tab I'm doing a university project, so kinda busy right now!)
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post #47 of 59
All of them will handle light overclocks fine. MITX will handle light overclocks fine. There's a minefield of ridiculously sabotaged or just otherwise terrible results out there particularly on Anandtech but on toms too. If you're not somewhat of an expert on OCing haswell you won't see what's good and what's bad; just ask around in the haswell overclocking thread with statistics etc if you are interested like that
Quote:
since prolly non-experts will only modify clock rate?

No, Haswell 101 includes setting VRIN LLC, setting and tuning VRIN, Vcore, Vring as well as core multiplier and uncore multiplier. You can basically use preset values for half of those if you're not pushing.
Edited by Cyro999 - 1/6/14 at 10:20am
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post #48 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by FabTheZen View Post

Please help. On sinhardware I only see the UD3H review, he ofc mentions the D3H is the exact same VRM configuration, but what about the Z87 Extreme4? With all that GB praising it seems to me that he lost some impartiality, by completely avoiding talking about brands other than GB.

After the Z77 disaster ASRock made, a lot of reviewers/experts say they have recovered well, and now asrock's z87 boards are comparable to asus and gigabyte's ones.

What are the difference between newer "hybrid/analog" VRMs we find on the ASRock z87 Extreme4 and the digital IR ones on the GB mobos? They seem to perform almost as good as the fully digital ones.
We can see on Sin's VRM list that Z87 Extreme4 has the same votes as, say, the UD3H. Since the overclocking ability of the 2 motherboards seem the same (according to tomshardware even a little better for ASRock), why should we prefer Gigabyte over ASRock this time?

Sin, if you can read this, please, this is a call for your help! I'd be very happy if you could answer this for us!!

Z87 Extreme4 has pretty good VRM with 6 phase doubling to 12. It shouldn't overheat, and would perform good. Gigabyte has slightly better VRM with true 8 phase design. Although it has less total phases, it uses better components per phase. UD3H is almost no compromise board for the price (if not Gigabyte's track record with BIOS updates).

Extreme4 has few compromises here and there (thin brown PCB, and etc), but overall it's one of the best bangs for your buck. There is also Biostar which don't support SLI, but it's even a better deal.

Don't really worry about analog vs digital. There isn't much difference in real world as long as they were both implemented good.
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post #49 of 59
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeXel View Post

Z87 Extreme4 has pretty good VRM with 6 phase doubling to 12. It shouldn't overheat, and would perform good. Gigabyte has slightly better VRM with true 8 phase design. Although it has less total phases, it uses better components per phase. UD3H is almost no compromise board for the price (if not Gigabyte's track record with BIOS updates).

Extreme4 has few compromises here and there (thin brown PCB, and etc), but overall it's one of the best bangs for your buck. There is also Biostar which don't support SLI, but it's even a better deal.

Don't really worry about analog vs digital. There isn't much difference in real world as long as they were both implemented good.

Thank you DeXel, that kinda soothes my soul!
Is the Extreme4 thinner than the D3H or just "standard" thin? I wonder if the thicker design of the UD3H really helps with heat spreading, or it's just marketing crap...
Also, would you suggest going for the Z87X-D3H (not the UD3H) for about the same price of the Z87 Extreme4? I would like to save the 30€ premium of the UD3H...

to Cyro999: sorry, I didn't get the mail about your post! I didn't know that, thx. I'll have fun in haswell OC section later!
Edited by FabTheZen - 1/6/14 at 2:11pm
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post #50 of 59
Thicker PCB helps with heat although not sure if it's any significant amount. There is nothing to heat up the PCB except VRM and CPU section. PCH is relatively cool and has low TDP.

D3H vs Extreme4 depends... I would say it's personal preference at that point since they both have their downsides. ASRock overal offers more though, but has lower build quality.
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