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Why you might not want to buy a Corsair RM PSU - Page 10

post #91 of 649
We choose suppliers based on a number of reasons. For one reason or another, whenever we've come close to working with Delta in the past, we've gone another way. They make excellent power supplies, but then again, so does Flextronics.

We have nothing against Delta and may work with them on future products if the opportunity arises.
post #92 of 649
Maybe some enthusiasts feel like Corsair as a whole wasn't being open enough or in dialogue with the community about "failures" of the RM series, I don't know.

Even though I could look at a spec sheet for the CX series, for example and think to myself "I wouldn't put one in my rig" I do know friends with mid/high end systems that do use units like the CX series and will swear by them as they've had perfect performance over its lifetime.

That said, I do think it depends who you talk to, and if shilka would rather not recommend the RM series to other users then thats his prerogative, but I do think its constructive as you've demonstrated George it promotes conversation and dialogue that helps to dispel certain myths or rumors that may be circulating.

Maybe when i stop being a CM fanboy i'll switch to Corsair in future, but man their tweets keep my chucklin.
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post #93 of 649
Shilka has a valid point however, if johnnyguru's claims on reddit are right Corsair ought to send new samples out to [H] and have a RM series Rev2 review (see Intel p67 --> z68)

A thermistor is less than a dollar in bulk.

If the RM units are faulty there should be a recall /exchange and the units ought be fixed and sent back out to the customers. I don't think keeping quiet and waiting for people to RMA is a good idea

Those CS and RM units are from GreatWall, that's something people expect from OCZ not Corsair.
Edited by AlphaC - 1/24/14 at 6:55pm
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post #94 of 649
Crikey. Big man george went mental on this one
Edited by DaveLT - 1/24/14 at 8:06pm
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post #95 of 649
Although I'm hardly in a position to throw stones at the moment, I do think there are valid engineering complaints people have re: the RM series. The most salient of which is the use of Tier 3 capacitors in a confined space with little airflow. The first time I saw the RM750 internals I thought, "Those are CapXon capacitors, in an airless box." You and Jonny have expressed the reasoning behind using these parts, and apparently they are calculated to last out the warranty. They might even have passed accelerated aging tests, I forget if you mentioned that. But if I were the PM, with that layout, I think there were better ways to cost-down $1.50 than using CapXon instead of, say, Taicon or Teapo or SamXon. Doesn't have to be Tier 1 Japanese, just Tier 2. And your claims of it being calculated to last, based on temperature and ripple current spec, are not reassuring considering that CapXon has inflated and fudged their datasheets before. I also feel the dismissive slant that some of your representatives have taken to these concerns has contributed to the bad feelings some people are getting toward this series, especially with the overheating issue and the QC blip on the CSM units.

I'm just saying, I see where people are coming from.
Edited by Phaedrus2129 - 1/24/14 at 8:06pm
post #96 of 649
Quote:
Originally Posted by CorsairGeorge View Post

[snip]
Time after time we've proven that even when we use a product that was similar to a product that was already on the market (our CWT units that were similar in platform to the Thermaltake units), we make changes that result in happier customers.

[snip]
We do not buy standard units off the shelf. We make significant modifications to the layouts and specifications, including fans, electrical components, etc.

I'm not going to address the other things because they stand on their own. Some of these things I've been saying over the years.

As for these two cherry-picked items,

1. I'm pretty sure I see a reference to Corsair HX750 / HX850 vs. Thermaltake Toughpower XT 575W / 675W / 775W / 875W, though maybe I'm forgetting something else too. To be honest, this is an example I think of myself sometimes, how you souped up CWT DSG. Or is my timeline off? I thought the Corsair units were out before the Thermaltakes, or at least that's when reviews appeared (2009 vs. 2010). Or was it some CWT PUQ / PUQ-G units or even back to some of the PSH-based power supplies? Hm...

2. Along those lines, by "modifications to the layouts" I don't know of a way to interpret it other than significant PCB changes, changing the circuit and components or at least routing the wiring (well, PCB traces) differently or possibly just heatsink / physical components changes. I don't really recall significant PCB changes (by casual visual inspection, which is admittedly not at all a way to thoroughly investigate anything as complicated as these PCBs) in recent power supplies when compared to similar offerings from competitors, not that I'd think that whatever the OEM had in the first place necessarily needs a change—it probably doesn't. Am I just not looking that hard, do you mean something else, or perhaps are the substantial differences in say AX1200, AXi, or other more custom offerings that aren't on commonly used platforms? I can't say I recall seeing a different layout on say CX than what competitors offer, TX V2 than what competitors offer, AX than what competitors offer, etc. This is all differences in fans, fan modes, components choices, cabling, customer service, price, etc. aside.

I'm not saying I expect a difference; rather I'm curious to see what I've missed or if it's just a misunderstanding.


Now for a different and more important matter, what's with the obsession with hybrid fanless modes, anyway, to have them on so many of the product lines? I care more about acoustical noise than the vast majority of users, and I don't really see the point. Run a lot of these fans at low speeds and nobody's going to hear them anyway except maybe the guys that are in the market for completely fanless power supplies, and that doesn't really seem to be your target market. And with some forced airflow, you could give some of those capacitors baking near the heatsinks a bit of a better fighting chance, huh? Okay, maybe at low fan speeds you're not really making an incredible temp difference where it counts, but still.

And the more complicated the fan control needs to be, especially around the turn on/off area with the hysteresis control and all that, the more chances there are for problems, which is something you already saw on the earlier units rolled out with the feature, right? Especially on platforms that didn't already have this to begin with.

Do the users demand it? Is it a marketing checkbox kind of thing? Does it really help? I mean, it's probably not a big deal either way, but I'm not convinced you're on the right side of things, especially with the midrange units getting the feature. You're also certainly not the only ones doing it.

I guess it's cheaper to implement than upgrading the fan quality, caps and ICs and other components, getting bigger heatsinks, etc., and running slower fan speeds throughout the load range.
Edited by mikeaj - 1/24/14 at 8:54pm
post #97 of 649
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phaedrus2129 View Post

Although I'm hardly in a position to throw stones at the moment, I do think there are valid engineering complaints people have re: the RM series. The most salient of which is the use of Tier 3 capacitors in a confined space with little airflow. The first time I saw the RM750 internals I thought, "Those are CapXon capacitors, in an airless box." You and Jonny have expressed the reasoning behind using these parts, and apparently they are calculated to last out the warranty. They might even have passed accelerated aging tests, I forget if you mentioned that. But if I were the PM, with that layout, I think there were better ways to cost-down $1.50 than using CapXon instead of, say, Taicon or Teapo or SamXon. Doesn't have to be Tier 1 Japanese, just Tier 2. And your claims of it being calculated to last, based on temperature and ripple current spec, are not reassuring considering that CapXon has inflated and fudged their datasheets before. I also feel the dismissive slant that some of your representatives have taken to these concerns has contributed to the bad feelings some people are getting toward this series, especially with the overheating issue and the QC blip on the CSM units.

I'm just saying, I see where people are coming from.

And had the discussion remained there, I don't know if I would have had a problem.

But it didn't. Like I said, there are legitimate questions about capacitor choice and other items on all sorts of power supplies. And these are correct to bring up.

But let's not sit here and pretend that this didn't get ugly and unprofessional.

It's not about disagreement or discussion - that's expected.

It's about acting like adults and having a rational, reasonable discussion.

This type of thread is something I'd expect to see on youtube comments, not OCN. I mean, hell, somebody photoshopped a racist caricature cartoon with a Corsair logo. Personally I feel sorry for whoever thinks that was even adding anything to the discussion.

You guys want to criticize the product, that's fine. You want to have an intelligent discussion, I welcome and embrace that.

But this adolescent namecalling is the type of thing that brings a great forum like OCN into the weeds. I'm 35 years old, so I've seen this happen to a number of great forums in the past. Once people stop having a reasonable discussion and start acting like morons, the more mature and responsible members leave. And then all that's left is loud idiots.

I don't want to see that happen to OCN, and of course, because this one is targeted at Corsair, I get a little bit sensitive about it. Especially when there are factual inaccuracies spouted by people who just don't know any better, and they end up misleading people who come here seeking reasonable information.
post #98 of 649
Thread Starter 
Anyone that claim i am biased against Corsair are wrong

A thing i want to talk i was informed that the problem with the missing 5v grounding bridge WAS!!! fixed so that part of this thread WAS!!! removed

As far as i know all this is information is right if someone can prove its not then of course it will be fixed

You cant complain about me being biased when i do admit i was wrong and DID removed wrong information

I have talked about just about any unit with substandard parts before and often do

So here is another example this time why you should not buy an NZXT HALE 82 V2

http://www.overclock.net/t/1461934/why-you-should-not-buy-an-nzxt-hale-82-v2#post_21654893

Anyone that claim i am biased and i hate Corsair and that i talk about only Corsair units and nothing else

You are wrong i talk about everything that is not very good no matter the brand or OEM

I could go on and on but that would just waste everyone´s time i made a point which i stand by no matter if everyone agrees or not

Also that cartoon picture of Corsair WAS going too far i will side with George on that one as its a Nazi cartoon
Edited by shilka - 1/25/14 at 7:06am
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post #99 of 649
I suppose the reason people think there is bias against Corsair here is because the thread has been heavily discussed, when a discussion erupts over such popular brands, which many of us feel comfortable as a go to when doing a build or repair, tensions and opinions do get raised.

Over the past few years, reviews have gone from debating whether a PSU would go up in smoke to minute differences in ripple and voltage regulation, way beyond the understanding of the majority of people who look at the numbers and pick the ones that look 'best'which I myself am guilty of from time to time.

My point is, we are now narrowing down minute differences between available supplies, coil whine for example is often only noticeable when a machine is cold and just starting to be heavily used.
These are little niggles, that will in no way have any measurable detriment to the performance of a PC.

Provided the supply is used within spec, and doesn't have a warranty failure of any kind, you can expect years of service, backed by some of the industries longest warranties, many supplies from our favourite manufacturers come with 5 or even 7 years warranty, which is in fact way beyond my upgrade time anyway.

Keep a level head guys, and shop smart.
Edited by BakerMan1971 - 1/25/14 at 7:05am
    
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post #100 of 649
Well, now that a Corsair representative is around it would be a good idea to ask if the low wattage RM series got the fix-up treatment as the higher wattage models did.

Well, did they? Is there a new revision with the 5v bridge fixed?


Also, now that we're at it, are there any plans for multiple rail power supplies from Corsair? As an extra safety measurement and such... It doesn't have to be written on the specs sticker or listed on the product box and such (if you're so concerned about marketing). Listed or not, it will be a plus and gather potential customers who wish for extra protection and the likes.
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