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No experiance using TEC's, air cooling? - Page 2

post #11 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by MiiX View Post

That made me understand a bit more. As I know that the Corsair H50 is rated to dissapate 200 watts, Then this is plausible, right?
All I want is to freeze/fry a motherboard, just to see how TEC's work and get familiar with it, I dont want to spend lots of $$$ to do this. If I can get a $30 setup, I'd be thrilled. All I need as I see it is a 200qmax peltier and some plastic coating of some sorts. This is hardware that will go into the bin anyway, so dont worry about having it run more than an hour, since all I will do is to overclock the CPU till it hits the wall or dies of to much vCore...

So what I need is:
A Peltier (ebay)
Liquid plastic (ebay)
dielectric grease(got it)
H50 for peltier cooling(got it)
Thermal paste(got it)
lots of "to be thrashed" hardware (got it)

Please tell me this is all, I so wanna play daredevil with the trashware(hardware)

You need a 12volt 8amp power supply. You stated you have a spare 300watt power supply you could dedicate to the peltier, so I'm assuming it's just an oversight on your list.
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post #12 of 25
Thread Starter 
Indeed, i got 3 working computers, all with power supplies to themselves and a spare 300w 'test' powersypply that I usally use for testing fans, harddrives, etc
post #13 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by MiiX View Post

Indeed, i got 3 working computers, all with power supplies to themselves and a spare 300w 'test' powersypply that I usally use for testing fans, harddrives, etc

A single molex line can only support up to 8 amps. I'd run two Molex lines in parallel to the TEC, otherwise you might burn out a molex line, as youll probably draw a bit more than 8 amps at peak power.
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post #14 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZytheEKS View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by dixson01974 View Post

Basically if you are moving 200 watts of heat from the cold side to the hot side. Then you about 400 watts of cooling power on the hot side.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MiiX View Post

I got 3 old computers that run xp and is about to get tossed cause they are simply to old, but when I read about TEC's now, I wanted to have a go at it, if I fry one, Il just use the next one, so this is just to see "What can a TEC do" kind of setup
Then I can just forget to use my H50 etc. Damned.


I don't think that 200/400 thing is right, I think he got a little screwy with the rule...
True. It is more like 1.5 time the heat you are moving.
More like 200/300.
I use 2x the heat moved for a rule of thumb. I rather have little more cooling power then what I need.
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post #15 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by dixson01974 View Post

True. It is more like 1.5 time the heat you are moving.
More like 200/300.
I use 2x the heat moved for a rule of thumb. I rather have little more cooling power then what I need.

I think you may have just miss-typed, you want the TEC to move 2x the heat, not the thing cooling the TEC. XD
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post #16 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZytheEKS View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by dixson01974 View Post

True. It is more like 1.5 time the heat you are moving.
More like 200/300.
I use 2x the heat moved for a rule of thumb. I rather have little more cooling power then what I need.

I think you may have just miss-typed, you want the TEC to move 2x the heat, not the thing cooling the TEC. XD
No.
This is what you are saying.
If I have a FX-9590 which is 220 watts TPD. So I need to run one 440 watt TEC at full power (Not a good idea). The TEC at full power will still only move 220 watts of heat away for the CPU. A TEC can't move 440 watts if there only 220 watts to move. Most ppl will run it at half power. Sense there is only 12 v on most PSU, which equal half power. Your theory is half right. Yes you want a TEC that is twice as powerful then that you need, but you will only running it half power. Most TEC are rated for 24v+.

EDIT
TEC are design to hit 0c. The cooler you keep the hot side the easier you can hit 0c. The cooler the hot side you need 1.5 time the heat you are moving to keep the cpu cooler.
Edited by dixson01974 - 1/7/14 at 9:24pm
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post #17 of 25
Thread Starter 
IF i used my H50 to cool the hot side of the TEC, and had a block to the cold side which goes to a WC loop, would it give any temp difference? This would just be a separate part of the loop with QDC's so I could use it when wanted.

Picture of what im trying to explain:
post #18 of 25
Better idea then the first, but still has a few issues.

First is surface area - a decent TEC will be at least 50x50mm. I remember the base of the H50 not being perfectly circle, and has recessed portions where the bolts are that cuts down the effective area even further. You have to measure it to be sure it can completely cover a 50x50mm area without leaving any TEC exposed. If not, you will need a hot plate.

Second, a computer waterblock is designed to cool the die of a processor. The die itself is only a small part of the IHS, and that is where most waterblocks direct the flow. This leaves the edges of the block barely getting any cooling, since they will just be over hollow IHS or nothing at all. On a TEC though, you need the whole surface evenly cooled or else it will severely reduce the life expectancy of the TEC.

Third, in a chiller design like this you cannot have radiators. They will be heating the water that you just chilled with the TEC assembly. If you were running it in line with a direct die chiller then you could probably leave it with the rads because the water will be much higher then ambient at full load anyway unless you have TONS of rad space. IE(made up numbers for example): If you are running a direct die setup that dumps 200+watts from a TEC on top of the 150+ watts of a CPU, and add a simple waterblock TEC chiller, you may be only chilling the water from a toasty 35+c down to 30c. In that case, going through radiators at 23c ambient won't hurt anything. If you are chilling just a PC waterblock and lowering the loop temp from 30c down to 20c, now that same rad in the ambient temp is heating the water 3* and hurting your temps!


My suggestion?

Measure out the H50 base to see if you can fit at least a 50x50mm TEC. Find one rated considerably higher then you want, and run it undervolted to control heat output - you can get 400watt 24v TECs, that at 12v will run cooler then a normal ebay 12v 200watter. Now, when you get your waterblock (can be a dirt cheap old one from forums since socket compatability wont matter) try to get a square pin array or cross fin style one - not the circular center impingement types. Then you can take it apart and mod or rotate the center plate to make it a more effective cross flow block instead of forcing coolant into the center. Replace the 1x120mm rad with the cheapest 2x120mm rad you can find on the forums to keep the hot side as cool as possible (should be real cheap if you get a plain jane switftech or generic rad!) then put it all together and have fun. It won't break any records or freeze any sockets - Heck, depending on your TEC and rad setup it may be worse then just the H50 - but you will have fun and more importantly learn a lot about TEC setups.
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post #19 of 25
Thread Starter 
So much info, my head hurts, in a good way thumb.gif

My H50 can at max cover a 45mm square if I count outside the screws holding it in, if I inside the screws, its 35mm... So that wont work...

This makes my TEC idea go down, as I live in Norway there are no rads that are cheap due to the high shipping cost in Norway. If I can get my hands on a cheap WC setup that I can use for the hot side of the TEC, il post here again and see if I can get this going.

Thanks for all the help tho, appreciate it!
post #20 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by MiiX View Post

So much info, my head hurts, in a good way thumb.gif

My H50 can at max cover a 45mm square if I count outside the screws holding it in, if I inside the screws, its 35mm... So that wont work...

This makes my TEC idea go down, as I live in Norway there are no rads that are cheap due to the high shipping cost in Norway. If I can get my hands on a cheap WC setup that I can use for the hot side of the TEC, il post here again and see if I can get this going.

Thanks for all the help tho, appreciate it!

Build an evap cooler. They're big, quiet, ugly, and work far better than a closed loop cooler. You could use that for the hot side of the TEC as far as radiators, you'd still need to find a waterblock or something.
Edited by ZytheEKS - 3/6/14 at 4:51am
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