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[Puget Systems] AMD A10-7850K Performance Review - Page 19

post #181 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by phill1978 View Post

its amazing how many people lurk waiting for AMD to fail.

I think it's more amazing how many people lurk waiting to trash any reasonable observation of computer hardware or stated performance difference whenever that reasonable observation does not hold AMD in the best possible light. I often feel like there must be some sort of "unspoken law" against any negative commentary towards the performance of an AMD product, as it always comes with the risk of dealing with an unwarranted overcompensating backlash of character assassinations and non-rational arguments riddled with double standards. If I had a nickle for every time I have spoken a well established truth about IPC differences in this forum, and been assaulted with character assassinations and been held to unreasonable standards to prove a point that is well established by benchmarks all over, I'd have at least a dollar wink.gif

Regards,
Eric
     
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post #182 of 286
Oh, you get trolls on both sides. I'm not sure which is worse, the Intel fanboys being smugly superior because AMD is stupid or the AMD fanboys saying that Intel is overpriced and stupid.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alatar View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Durquavian View Post

Actually there were a lot of people that purchased AM3+ simply because they thought Steamroller was coming to it. So that theory doesn't really hold true 100%.

And these people hopefully learned a valuable lesson about PC hardware.

Still better than Intel's "new architecture? New chipset!" thing. AM3+ was supposed to be Zambezi and Zambezi only, but that got scrapped. Piledriver was supposed to have a 5M/10C part on FM2, but that got scrapped. 1090FX was also supposed to exist, and that too was scrapped. We all know what happens when you assume though. wink.gif
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post #183 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdocod View Post

I think it's more amazing how many people lurk waiting to trash any reasonable observation of computer hardware or stated performance difference whenever that reasonable observation does not hold AMD in the best possible light. I often feel like there must be some sort of "unspoken law" against any negative commentary towards the performance of an AMD product, as it always comes with the risk of dealing with an unwarranted overcompensating backlash of character assassinations and non-rational arguments riddled with double standards. If I had a nickle for every time I have spoken a well established truth about IPC differences in this forum, and been assaulted with character assassinations and been held to unreasonable standards to prove a point that is well established by benchmarks all over, I'd have at least a dollar wink.gif

Regards,
Eric



see there are 4 types of people. AMD fantards , Intel fantards , AMD rational owners, Intel rational owners .. somewhere in between is the answer. My observations are merely that for most users we have reached a point quite some time ago due to resolution increased and GPU improvements where by an existing reliance on the CPU has become necessary only by legacy design creating a bottleneck on older coded games and lower resolutions..

But as we move forward I believe 2014 is a landmark. We now have ways of utilising the GPU more proactive for all manner of tasks. In a way the pure CPU on its own is dead from a hardware standpoint, we just need to wait for the software to catch up.
post #184 of 286
I'd simply say that AMD fans go on defense because the average AMD related topic sooner or later is bound to receive obscene amounts of threadcrapping.
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post #185 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdocod View Post

I think it's more amazing how many people lurk waiting to trash any reasonable observation of computer hardware or stated performance difference whenever that reasonable observation does not hold AMD in the best possible light. I often feel like there must be some sort of "unspoken law" against any negative commentary towards the performance of an AMD product, as it always comes with the risk of dealing with an unwarranted overcompensating backlash of character assassinations and non-rational arguments riddled with double standards. If I had a nickle for every time I have spoken a well established truth about IPC differences in this forum, and been assaulted with character assassinations and been held to unreasonable standards to prove a point that is well established by benchmarks all over, I'd have at least a dollar wink.gif

Regards,
Eric
Simply put, IT IS BECAUSE YOU ARE NOT RATIONAL. You post benches from 10 years ago and claim it has basis today, or make sideways comparisons without regard to the facts at hand. Now if you were to be a bit more reasonable, say without the condescending attitude toward experience then maybe your words would be taken with more regard. But fact is you come off as an AMD hater and every point you make has clear connotations to such.

And as I always tell you:

Without regard.
post #186 of 286
On a positive note...

If those cache performance improvements from the wccf tech review are accurate, there may be some real world workloads that show greater performance increases than what the Puget review has established as a sort of "baseline" for consideration. Note the "hitman" benchmark there with the discrete GPU showing what appears to be ~30+% improvement when normalized to the same clock speed.

I'm still left puzzled when I see memory bandwidth hovering around 20GB/s when it's running at a speed that should be good for 30-40GB/s. There's so much potential for the GPU performance to scale up here, yet the memory controller is still standing in the way.... I wonder if more bandwidth could be squeezed out by tinkering with timings.


Durq,

I encourage you to direct your criticisms at actions and ideas with a rational, calm explanation of your position. An exaggerated emotion filled character assassination of me, only proves the point I was making.

On the other hand. I may get bored around here if everyone drops their emotional connection to hardware and brands. hmmm...


Future rational OCN conversation:

A: "This hardware does not perform as well as that hardware."

B: "Yes, my observation is in agreement with yours."

C: "Yes, I see the same results here as well."

A: "So that's it?"

C: "Yep, oh well."

B: "See yall next week"
Edited by mdocod - 1/12/14 at 1:39pm
     
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post #187 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by CynicalUnicorn View Post

Still better than Intel's "new architecture? New chipset!" thing. AM3+ was supposed to be Zambezi and Zambezi only, but that got scrapped. Piledriver was supposed to have a 5M/10C part on FM2, but that got scrapped. 1090FX was also supposed to exist, and that too was scrapped. We all know what happens when you assume though. wink.gif

To be fair, AMD's track record with their APU sockets and chipsets is about the same as intel's with their mainstream stuff. And the only reason AM3+ has lasted so long is because it's hopelessly outdated.
 
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post #188 of 286
I think Carrizo was confirmed on FM2+ as well, and it's backwards compatible with Richland and Trinity. That's four, though realistically three and a quarter, different architectures compatible on the same socket. LGA 2011 stuck around for a very long time and is only being changed for DDR4 support, so props to Intel's enthusiast line.
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post #189 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alatar View Post

To be fair, AMD's track record with their APU sockets and chipsets is about the same as intel's with their mainstream stuff. And the only reason AM3+ has lasted so long is because it's hopelessly outdated.

The only "outdated" part of AM3+ is the lack of PCIe 3.0, USB3.0 and the chipset not being on die, all of which could be fixed in an AM4 update quite easily...PCIe 3.0 doesn't even really matter that much either to most users here, they'd only use the bandwidth for GPUs (If they even needed it) and 990FX has equal total bandwidth to Z87, Z77, etc because while it's only PCIe 2.0, it's 16x/16x instead of 8x/8x. The CPUs are more than fast enough for most users, the chipset was all SATA 6Gbit/s when Intel only had 2x6Gbit/s ports on Z68, etc. Z77 and Z87 didn't add that much, honestly..
    
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post #190 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by phill1978 View Post

but how many play these at 1080p or 1440p ? As you go up the resolutions the CPU impact becomes less even on older games. Talking about newer games from the last 2 years onwards the majority focus hard on the GPU not the CPU. But I cant argue that these APU's are fairly weak CPU wise, they are.

A question for a gamer wanting to maximise performance and have something a bit different is can the cost saving of the APU be put onto a better dedicated GPU (especially if you bought a cheaper quad Kaveri Athlon non igp) and net you the same or better real world performance than a intel system running a cheaper GPU but a more expensive and more powerful Intel CPU ?

the answer might be in one or two cases the intel is faster but in most at 1080p/1200p/1440p etc.. the weaker AMD CPU with a faster dedicated GPU would be better

cost is usually always the balance here

There are quite a few games that are notoriously CPU bound even at high resolutions. RTS games like Sins of a Solar Empire and Starcraft 2 being primary culprits.
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