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XFX Core Edition 650W vs. 750W: which one should I buy? - Page 5

post #41 of 144
Depends what you want. There's a difference between low settings @60hz, vs trying to max stuff with msaa at 144hz
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post #42 of 144
Thread Starter 
You're once again right. I'm playing at 60Hz (my monitor says it's 59Hz LOL), and I'd like to try things I've never been able to try (TXAA, or anti-aliasing in general xD). I would also like to try all these good stuff for newer games; I know I can't ask for a gpu that will surely perform well in the next years, but I'd like to. Of course it must be worth the money, not something stellar. Same goes for the CPU.

What I'd really like to do is play something like PS2 emulators (I have the original games but can't be arsed to take my PS2 out from wherever the hell it is). With my current config I can almost get good speeds with some mad tweaking, but I think that the 4670K will give me the needed boost.

So.. yeah, I've looked at the GTX 760, which sounds really good, but again some thread on the webs discouraged me to go with it, since it has less cuda cores (but higher clocks) than the GTX 670 (IIRC), so that means OK for modern games, but it gives little credibility in the future...
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post #43 of 144
760 is somewhat equivelant to 660ti, a hair better usually. Little worse than 670.. but the 660ti and 670 were discontinued a while ago no? Not much point talking about them

Everything has less cuda cores, that's kinda how it works. 760 has 1152, 770 has 1536, 780ti has 2880. 760 will run stuff fine mostly maxed (i'm doing fine targetting ~140fps with a 770 and settings turned down, keeping important stuff but losing out on a lot - AA that doesn't look terrible is quite hard to pull off on some engines)
Quote:
so that means OK for modern games, but it gives little credibility in the future...

Yea, if you're not buying the strongest part, you can't hope to max stuff with msaa years from now and have great performance. If you could do that on a midrange card, it would be terrible beacause it would mean that graphics engines were not pushing hardware that was made years before them. That's not due to some funky math with cuda core amounts though, it's simply because a 780ti is significantly better than two 760's put together
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post #44 of 144
Thread Starter 
I may have taken too much by the "shopping frenzy", more like the shopping fright. The truth is I hate buying new things! There's always better things I could buy if I "save money for later", but thinking this way I'll never buy a thing.
So I just look for the "sweet spot" where I can get the most out of the shortest budget, saving money for the next component (same went for choosing the phone xD).
The real truth is, I play a real lot, but not for the "oh god seems real" effect. I play games that give me something to think about while playing (company of heroes to quote one), or games that amaze me for their story/gameplay (psychonauts anyone?). And MGS, yes, but that's another story. What I'd like to do after buying the pieces is play newer games and add in the "wow" factor, but being realist I don't think that if in 6 months I'll start removing AA, in a year I won't be able to max out cryisis 4 etc, I'd feel bad, I just want something at least as cool as my Zotac GTX 260² was in, say, 2009.
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post #45 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by FabTheZen View Post

Well the whole graphics card is a "maybe", since I haven't even started gathering info on gpu OC, and probably I'll never do it manually, only auto with programs like the ASUS one for the DCU...
Anyway TwoCables, your post is worth a sticky biggrin.gif thank you for sharing your knowledge with us! I'm sure this thread will help some people!
So what about sli power requirements? Why do they suggest 850W for a GTX770 SLI? Is it for the peak-rated PSU right?

 

All recommendations made by AMD, NVIDIA, and professional review sites are for peak-rated PSUs. Multiply them by .72 and you will usually get the approximate +12V capacity of the continuous-rated PSU that you can use (sometimes it's spot-on, other times it's simply close). For example, 850 x .72 is 612W. This is 51A, but 52A (624W) is usually the +12V capacity, not 51A. There are a few decent 650W PSUs that have a +12V capacity of 624w and some of the better 650W PSUs have a +12V capacity that's 54A, or 648W. So you see, a good 650W PSU is plenty for a mainstream system that has two GTX 770s in it.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by FabTheZen View Post

Ok thanks! I wonder why they don't say so in their specifications though... OK I'm going to buy the cheapest between the two XFX. If I overkill, will I risk something like not hitting the highest efficiency point?

I was looking in that store and I saw the be quiet! System power 7 600w 80+ silver (this one). Seems pretty cool, and costs less than the XFX. What do you think about it?

 

Can you imagine how much more work it would be for AMD, NVIDIA and the professional reviewers if they were to say, "this is for peak-rated PSUs"? It's much better for them to leave it alone and let the PSU enthusiasts and experts in the world do the educating. Besides, there are still peak-rated PSUs on the market.

 

Anyway, your average efficiency will be lower the more overkill the PSU is, but I am guessing that you'd have to be using like a 1000W PSU for a mainstream system that has like just one GTX 760 in it or something.

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post #46 of 144
You deserve your closing-on-5k reps btw TwoCables wink.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by FabTheZen View Post

I may have taken too much by the "shopping frenzy", more like the shopping fright. The truth is I hate buying new things! There's always better things I could buy if I "save money for later", but thinking this way I'll never buy a thing.
So I just look for the "sweet spot" where I can get the most out of the shortest budget, saving money for the next component (same went for choosing the phone xD).
The real truth is, I play a real lot, but not for the "oh god seems real" effect. I play games that give me something to think about while playing (company of heroes to quote one), or games that amaze me for their story/gameplay (psychonauts anyone?). And MGS, yes, but that's another story. What I'd like to do after buying the pieces is play newer games and add in the "wow" factor, but being realist I don't think that if in 6 months I'll start removing AA, in a year I won't be able to max out cryisis 4 etc, I'd feel bad, I just want something at least as cool as my Zotac GTX 260² was in, say, 2009.

It's hard to reccomend. 760 and 770 are somewhat close (what, 1.3x gap at similar clockspeeds? I'm not sure) so it really depends how trigger happy you are on the wallet, which settings you care about, how games run in the future (no idea yet) and what your tolerances for FPS etc are
Edited by Cyro999 - 1/12/14 at 2:39am
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post #47 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyro999 View Post

You deserve your closing-on-5k reps btw TwoCables wink.gif

 

Aw, thanks. :)

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post #48 of 144
Thread Starter 
I agree for the reps with Cyro! The graphics card is a future thing, at least writing those things down helped me forget the shopping fright (for a bit XD)
I'll let you know what are the prices are when they're back in stock, anyway the PSU issue is not pressing anymore, thanks to all of you posters!! Please check out the other threads I made, mostly the one about the motherboard, since it's the biggest head-scratcher I have these days!
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post #49 of 144
Thread Starter 
The PSUs are back in stock! The 650W costs 12€ less than the 750W. Do you still suggest going for the 650W for the 12€ saving?

Sorry, the time has passed, and I was starting to forget what TwoCables told me: I've revisited the previous posts, and I've seen what he recommended. continuous-rated 650W is enough for a mid-level SLI. I guess it's now just what I'm willing to do with my rig. I could end up never getting a SLI either, I just wanted some kind of future-proof-ness.... I think 650W are going to fit well for at least the newest single cards in the foreseeable future, right?

But would a 750W have noticeably less strain in handling one card to last longer? And for two?

Edit: I've made a test with Outervision's power calculator, and adding 15% of capacitor aging, along with fans and CPU OC (4500MHz @1.3V), the recommended power with a single GTX 780 would be 608W (minimum 558W), and 670W with 2xGTX 760. No chance of running 2xGTX 770 according to the site (recommends779W). Should I just forget the whole SLI thing and go with 650W, or even so, would I do a good thing investing those 12€ in the 750W PSU?
Edited by FabTheZen - 1/13/14 at 4:42pm
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post #50 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by FabTheZen View Post

The PSUs are back in stock! The 650W costs 12€ less than the 750W. Do you still suggest going for the 650W for the 12€ saving?

Sorry, the time has passed, and I was starting to forget what TwoCables told me: I've revisited the previous posts, and I've seen what he recommended. continuous-rated 650W is enough for a mid-level SLI. I guess it's now just what I'm willing to do with my rig. I could end up never getting a SLI either, I just wanted some kind of future-proof-ness.... I think 650W are going to fit well for at least the newest single cards in the foreseeable future, right?

 

Oh, absolutely - unless you get one of those high-end dual-GPU cards - then it might come close (or it might not... I don't know yet :P).

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by FabTheZen View Post

But would a 750W have noticeably less strain in handling one card to last longer? And for two?

 

These PSUs are made so well with such high-quality components that this is actually a non-issue. It would only be an issue for a lower quality PSU.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by FabTheZen View Post

Edit: I've made a test with Outervision's power calculator, and adding 15% of capacitor aging, along with fans and CPU OC (4500MHz @1.3V), the recommended power with a single GTX 780 would be 608W (minimum 558W), and 670W with 2xGTX 760. No chance of running 2xGTX 770 according to the site (recommends779W). Should I just forget the whole SLI thing and go with 650W, or even so, would I do a good thing investing those 12€ in the 750W PSU?

 

Capacitor aging is a non-issue with PSUs of this caliber. Run it again, this time make sure to select the following settings:

 

  1. Motherboard: "Regular - Desktop"
  2. CPU Utilization (TDP): 90%
  3. Hard Drive: Regular SATA (the High RPM option is for 10,000 RPM and faster) - I don't know if you chose High RPM, I'm just mentioning it because this is an extremely common one.
  4. USB: only put devices that are not a keyboard and a mouse because these are pre-calculated
  5. Fans: the "High Perf." fans are 8W for the 80mm, 11W for the 92mm, 8W for the 120 for some reason (it should be more!), and 21W for the 140mm. So, only choose these if you really do have fans this powerful.
  6. System Load: 75% (This is the most realistic for gaming)
  7. Capacitor Aging: none

 

So, what does the calculator estimate now?

 

Speaking of the word "estimate", PSU calculators shouldn't be called "PSU calculators"; they should be called "PSU estimators".

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i5-2500K @ 4.5GHz (1.368-1.384V fixed voltage) ASUS P8P67 EVO B3 (UEFI ver. 1850) GTX 780 ASUS DirectCU II (1228 / 6300, 1.180V) G.SKILL Ripjaws X 8GB (2 x 4GB) 1866MHz, CL9 
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250 GB Samsung 840 EVO (C:\) 250 GB Samsung 840 EVO (D:\) 150 GB WD VelociRaptor Samsung SH-S243N 24x DVD Burner 
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Samsung SH-S203N 20X DVD Burner Thermaltake Frio Win 7 Home Premium x64 SP1 Retail AOC G2460PG (24" 1920 x 1080 144Hz G-SYNC) 
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Filco Majestouch 104-key Cherry MX Blues w/NKRO Corsair HX650 (Bronze, ordered on 12-12-2009) CM 690 Intellimouse Optical (1.1A) 1000Hz polling rate 
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