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[SOLVED] HDTV ADVICE: I made a decision. - Page 6

post #51 of 123
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Furad View Post


So tell me, if plasma is so great, why is it dying? Keep in mind I have a samsung plasma 50".

4k LED is going to be the new standard regardless of what you prefer.

I know you didn't direct this at me, but I found something that might be an answer. Good conversation either way. 

 

These are comments to an article found HERE.


 

Quote:

Gas0linE // Nov 29, 2012 at 11:46 am

The reason LED sells more than a plasma, is because the average joe who walks into a place like BestBuy which has LED plastered all over the place and thinks that LED is the best because its newer. Most people who buy a TV is usually un- educated, but still care for picture quality. They are not at al familiar with off angle viewing, banding, motion resolution, color accuracy, in fact they get it out of the box and watch it in Dyanmic or “Torch” mode not knowing any better. IMO its not that people don’t care about picture quality, its more on the line of un educated people. That is exactly why most home theater professionals will prefer a Plasma because it ultimately is the better choice for picture quality. Just because someone buy’s a LCD/LED TV doesnt not at all mean they “do not care about picture quality” It just means they are not as educated in the different types of technology out there.

 
  • John // Nov 29, 2012 at 11:25 am

    These Plasma vs. LCD discussions remind of the battle between VHS and Betamax. The latter recorded a better picture but VHS offered longer recording times with a slightly inferior picture. Guess who won. Obviously consumers don’t care much about picture quality. VHS recorders became cheaper and cheaper because of economy of scale. Same thing happening with LCD TV, they are becoming a lot cheaper than plasma TVs.

     
  • Gas0linE // Nov 29, 2012 at 9:15 am

    @Tom We can both agree to disagree here. I am referring to more high end TV’s. Not your average 200-400 budget TV. (Black Friday TV) I’m sure no one is going to pop 2-3 grand down on a nice TV if they didn’t care about picture quality. It’s also why I said “Most” people, not “all” people.

    Besides, your argument is irrelevant here. For the people who do not care about Picture quality, (which makes no sense to me if your going to buy a new TV) this article does not pertain to those individuals. Again, it’s common sense that people are not going to spend 3k on a TV like a VT50 if they “didn’t care about picture quality” I am not so sure I know of anyone who is in the TV buying market who doesn’t care about picture quality to some degree. If your gonna spend any kind of money on a TV, if your smart, you should care about picture quality somewhat.

    again, when I refer to “Most” people, I am referring to people that are spending 2 grand or so on a HDTV.

     
  • Tom // Nov 29, 2012 at 7:55 am

    GasolineE said “Most people buy a TV for its picture quality.”

    I wish I could agree with you, but I don’t think they do. If they did, more people would watch HD but even those who have that option through their cable or satellite system simply don’t because they don’t care about picture quality. If they did, there would (hopefully) be a lot less picture stretching. I work in the industry so have followed the arguments for years but I get my wakeup call everytime I go home to my parents or in-laws. Just last weekend my sister in law, who is my age and an intelligent person, told me she couldn’t see the difference between the SD and the HD picture. I was astounded. I don’t think she can’t tell the difference, though. I think what she really meant to say is that she just didn’t care.

    The form factor is what sold people on HDTV flat screens. They just liked the way it looks.

 

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post #52 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by Furad View Post

So tell me, if plasma is so great, why is it dying? Keep in mind I have a samsung plasma 50".

4k LED is going to be the new standard regardless of what you prefer.

Too expensive to produce 4k plasmas, the jump to 4k LCD was much cheaper, thus more margin in their pocket. It has nothing to do with LCD being a superior tech. My next set will be a 4k OLED, but that will be a while.
post #53 of 123
LCD's dont offer the motion resolution of plasma even 4k on LCD's only offer around 1280 lines horizontally of motion resolution, with 1080p sets offering typically about only 300-550 lines ! and yes when i say lines i do mean 1280x800 resolution on 4k, so that is something like 3840x1280p on motion yet im not sure if there is a negative impact on vertical also?

where as a good plasma can manage 900-1080p lines on a 1080p set sometimes a tad lower but usually full frame resolution.

This is why a 4k plasma would of been a good thing as you would see a lot more detail in motion rather than just in still / slow shots. which is how 4K is being shown at conventions to mask the issue or with Ridiculous input lag inducing 480hz frame interpolation which is useless for gaming.

Plasma is dead in 2014 according to reports from this years CES. So for great motion resolution, low'sih input lag and an enormous picture id recommend a projector such as an EPSON. The irony is Plasma's sales declined in the early years due to scaremongering about image burn. Then LCD got brighter and flatter wooing the crowds. Now with OLED you have the flatness, the decent motion (need to check if its on par with plasma) and the blacks but you have screen burn back.

people want OLED monitors, lets hope they fix it.. but it seems fairly inherent.
Edited by Pip Boy - 2/22/14 at 4:40am
post #54 of 123
Thread Starter 

So I went to a few stores this morning. Best Buy and Walmart. Neither of them had the VIZIO E550i-B2. But they did have the A0 version, which is last years model. Much uglier than the 2014 (B2) model. 

 

Neither store had the Samsung PN52F5500 but  Best Buy did have the 5300 which is the "Non-smart" version. These two were side by side, and so I was able to at least get a decent comparison going. 

 

Here is what I saw at Best Buy:

 

 

LED top/ PLASMA bottom (720p version of the 5300)

 

 

The white levels is what really shocked me about the plasma. So gray! 

 

Here is a quick video of the LED and PLASMA (top right is the 2013 E series VIZIO, botom right is the PN551F5300)

 

 

Overall, I found the plasma MUCH darker than the VIZIO. (I know lighting, store settings, and etc effect this, but I had no idea it was this big of a difference.)

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

So I went over to Wal-mart. And they didn't really have the best sample size either. But I was able to make some good observations. 

 

They also had the last year VIZIO like Best Buy, but not the same Samsung Plasma. I was able to compare the Vizio to some random Samsung plasma though. 

 

 

Again, on the plasma, darks were just gray, whites were also just gray. The plasma just had a bit of a blah feel to them. A blank LED screen was BLACK a blank PLASMA screen was GRAY, and a SHINY gray at that. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Plasma has a gray starry sky, and a washed out yellow. 

 

 

 

Very gray whites on the plasma, just like at best buy. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Deeper blacks on the LED  ????

 

 

 

The thing that I noticed about the plasma was that is had better color reproduction, but not by a lot. You have to look for it. 

The motion blur was not as impressive as I though the plasma would be either. It was there I guess, but I had to REALLY look for it. The plasmas really didn't blow me away in that regard. 

The blacks on the LED, although darker, did wash out and hide details in the shadow. 

The plasmas seemed to give a more realistic picture, but that was only when it wasnt a dark or light scene where I was just aghast at how freaking gray and dim they are. 

People say the heat thing isn't a big deal with newer plasmas now, with that in mind, I was actually very surprised about how much heat I did feel. 

Viewing angles were noticeably better on the plasmas, but again not over obvious. And I had to get to some pretty extreme angles to really see a difference. And the LEDs were not unveiwable at those angles, just a "little hazy". And at angles where i would never even try to watch TV from, and angles that would be almost impossible to view from in the room its going in. 

The plasma glare was pretty bad too. Pretty noticeable. Again, I will not be doing the majority of my viewing in light, but what about the times that I am? 

 

 

With the LED I was comparing to the plasmas being an older version of the E550i-B2 I can only imagine these differences being more in favor of LED on the newer VIZIO. The blacks should be better and more detail should be shown. Viewing angles may be even better. 

Design is a big selling point for me on a TV as well. Its trivial to some, but to me I want it to look good on the wall too. And after seeing the Sammy in real life, its is really just BLAH. Nothing overwhelming or underwhelming about it. It was ugly and plain all at the same time. Also it has a huge bezel compared to the newer Vizio. 

The difference between 51" and 55" was a LOT more than I thought it was going to be. Much more real-estate comes in those 4 diagonal inches. 

 

With all this being said, I am very much leaning towards the Vizio. I may be going to COSTCO today to see the Vizio in the flesh. 


Edited by Jolly Roger - 2/22/14 at 11:25am
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post #55 of 123
Thread Starter 

Just got back from COSTCO.  

 

Now I am a little more unsure, because I have now seen true black. 

 

They had the E550i-B2 and something VERY similar to the PN51F5500, they had the PN51F5350A. Which is essentially the same panel. 

 

I really wish I could have turned off the lights and played with the display settings. 

Either way, this is what I saw:

 

LED on the LEFT

 

PLASMA on the RIGHT

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

This video REALLY shows the difference of the true black and LED black. 

 

 

The contrast between the two are compelling, yet my question for plasma is still: WHERE ARE THE TRUE WHITES?

 

 

I am more torn now, having scene them together. Also, after seeing the Vizio, I question if the dynamic zones were activated or not.

 

The dimness of the plasma still gets me. If the store has the settings on the display "blown out" for display, what will it look like when I get it home and set up correctly, probably more dim? 

 

 

Again, not a real difference in motion blur. Almost identical to me. Didn't see a huge difference. In fact, I don't think I could tell you in a blind test which was which. 

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post #56 of 123
Its a tough decision that's for sure.

I am in the process of the same thing.

I may end up going with a projector.
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post #57 of 123
Man, all the plasmas you posted looked super dull...
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post #58 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by Furad View Post

Man, all the plasmas you posted looked super dull...

They're in a place with lots of lighting and aren't even calibrated. What did you expect? They're never going to look great in those terrible settings haha.
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post #59 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackhawk4 View Post

They're in a place with lots of lighting and aren't even calibrated. What did you expect? They're never going to look great in those terrible settings haha.


But one thing is for sure, the plasma in the one pic I could see the window reflection! Unless Jolly Roger is going to sit in his living room with the lights off then I would've picked the led right then and there.


Hey, jolly do you have a costco membership or a sams club one?
Edited by Fishinfan - 2/22/14 at 10:12pm
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post #60 of 123
Plasmas tend to have a better price the last time I was in the market for a TV.
If I were to buy a new TV now, I'd definitely go LED. They're thinner and have less power consumption.
And I have had one plasma 'blow' on me. Had to have it repaired.
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Overclock.net › Forums › Consumer Electronics › HDTV › [SOLVED] HDTV ADVICE: I made a decision.