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[Reuters] Japan says any bitcoin regulation should be international - Page 5  

post #41 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carlitos714 View Post

Should I sent you over to a local farmer here in San Diego who accepts bitcoin? And they tell me the fruits and veggies you buy from them is not real.

Coins might not have a value to you, but it does to other people. Here is the thing, currency is anything a group of people decide has value. And here is an example. You computer is worthless to my someone who just bought that new shiny HP computer yesterday, but to you it does have value. Its easy to understand.

These coins mean nothing to you, but if I go downtown San Diego I can go eat and drink beers using bitcoin. And if you lady friend needs a waxing, my wife accepts bitcoin as a form of payment at her spa. And you say they have no real value................

I am curious how does it feel when you pay for those items and then two hours later the rate has changed and you paid 300% more than you should have? Or when the rate drops do you go back to the vendor and give him more coins to make up for the lose he took?
post #42 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mopar63 View Post

I am curious how does it feel when you pay for those items and then two hours later the rate has changed and you paid 300% more than you should have? Or when the rate drops do you go back to the vendor and give him more coins to make up for the lose he took?
Well anyone that uses bitcoin for something beside black market shady stuff is a fool. The only way is to convert to a stable currency trough an exchange but in case of a crash nobody would want to give USD or EUR for bitcoin.
post #43 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by zoid.srg View Post

Its crucial to the economy that ALL currency is regulated.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkpriest667 View Post

Don't try to explain it to these objectivist cryptogeniuses. They obviously are much more informed, educated, and intelligent than those of us who have spent our lives understanding economic principles.


It will be regulated or it will fail or both. Anyone accusing fiats of being similar to cryptos, because they aren't backed by anything, doesn't understand currencies, commodities, or economic theory at all and I suggest those people take a money, banking, and credit class at their local university. (quick addendum you have to have a C or better in macro and micro econ to take that class as its a 4th year class)

It indeed has regulation. Just because it doesn't conform with old ideology doesn't mean it will fail. That ideology was based before such things could even be fathomed.

With the advent of technology over the past few decades this has been proven time and time again with other so called "impossible" things.

http://youtu.be/hdAnyC45ZbU?t=9m22s and then more around 12:30.
Edited by Outlawed - 3/2/14 at 9:12am
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post #44 of 57
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Originally Posted by Outlawed View Post


It indeed has regulation.


Please direct me to the regulatory body that is in charge or upholding the regulations on Bitcoin any cryptocurrency. Do they recognize the taxing authority of the sovereign governments in the areas they operate and trade in? Do they recognize the economic regulatory bodies that exist in those places? See there is saying you have regulation and then there is actual regulation.

We've got two philosophies behind the pro-crypto movement.

1) Regulation is evil and the reason cryptocurrency is good is that it is free of government regulation

2) There is regulation it's self regulation.



Both inherently flawed philosophies. Self regulation is how you get monopolies, which is why even free-markets need to be regulated by OUTSIDERS. When they are self regulated you get monopolies like standard oil and US steel. When they are regulated by industry insiders you get oligopolies like ATT/Sprint/Verizon/T-mobile and Comcast/Timewarner/Verizon. From what I can observe there is little to no regulation of bitcoin and no backed garuntee by any authority that it will hold value. The reason fiat currencies work is because they are backed by the taxing authority of their respective governments (or in the case of the HK Dollar by the issuer which is a trusted banking conglomerate)
 
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post #45 of 57
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Originally Posted by Mopar63 View Post

I am curious how does it feel when you pay for those items and then two hours later the rate has changed and you paid 300% more than you should have? Or when the rate drops do you go back to the vendor and give him more coins to make up for the lose he took?
Honestly I don't know. What I do know is they continue to accept bitcoin and my wifes Spa too. Bitcoin is a baby and there are many people that understand the potential especially business owners. Are you a business owner?

I am and I don't like those credit card fees one bit just like many business owners. I'm sure you have seen at stores signs "Cash only" or 50 cent charge for credit card transaction. It is evident credit cards give all of us the shaft. That is just one of bitcoins benefits

Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose that's how it goes. Its the same thing with the US economy a few years back. Many people lost a lot and those loses don't compare to what people have lost in bitcoin. I can go on and on, but I'm sure you get the point. I don't think bitcoin will take over the world, but it will be a clear alternative the military backed US paper dollar.
post #46 of 57
how can people compare real currency to bitcoins? currency=money that is insured and guaranteed by the nation that produces it. that means it is indirectly tied to actual physical and human resources. bitcoin is insured and guaranteed by no one
post #47 of 57
i dont understand why people think bitcoin is some revolutionary currency, its only value is based on physical currecy (USD etc). this whole mining craze would not exist if it were not for that, nobody is mining this to create a new currency, only to make a fast buck. it will eventually crash.
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post #48 of 57
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Originally Posted by perfectblade View Post

how can people compare real currency to bitcoins? currency=money that is insured and guaranteed by the nation that produces it. that means it is indirectly tied to actual physical and human resources. bitcoin is insured and guaranteed by no one

While I agree with this and I don't participate in crypto currency trade for this reason, people are what put a value on something. It doesn't matter what the item is (even intangible things), as long as there is a limit on it (artificial or not), there can be a value put on anything. It is this false sense of worth, which people are using as a medium for trade of "real" currency insured or uninsured by any one person, organization, or government.

You could easily replace the word "bitcoins" in your post with a multitude of technically worthless things and still be correct, yet people will still give them a value in "real" currency.

"how can people compare real currency to (diamonds, baseball cards, autograph of famous person, pixel items in a MMO....)? currency=money that is insured and guaranteed by the nation that produces it. that means it is indirectly tied to actual physical and human resources. (diamonds, baseball cards, autograph of famous person, pixel items in a MMO....) is insured and guaranteed by no one"

It simply doesn't matter, all of the replaced words I put in your sentence are all equally worthless until someone puts a sense of value on it.
post #49 of 57
This is absolutely brilliant to read all of the "economists" here claiming to know exactly what will happen biggrin.gif
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post #50 of 57
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Originally Posted by Shaded War View Post

While I agree with this and I don't participate in crypto currency trade for this reason, people are what put a value on something. It doesn't matter what the item is (even intangible things), as long as there is a limit on it (artificial or not), there can be a value put on anything. It is this false sense of worth, which people are using as a medium for trade of "real" currency insured or uninsured by any one person, organization, or government.

You could easily replace the word "bitcoins" in your post with a multitude of technically worthless things and still be correct, yet people will still give them a value in "real" currency.

"how can people compare real currency to (diamonds, baseball cards, autograph of famous person, pixel items in a MMO....)? currency=money that is insured and guaranteed by the nation that produces it. that means it is indirectly tied to actual physical and human resources. (diamonds, baseball cards, autograph of famous person, pixel items in a MMO....) is insured and guaranteed by no one"

It simply doesn't matter, all of the replaced words I put in your sentence are all equally worthless until someone puts a sense of value on it.

i think your missing the point here. the point of a currency existing is not "to be valuable." and yeah sometimes the way that people give value to items makes no sense (collectors items etc). but that's not the purpose of a currency. the purpose of a currency is to provide a stable and reliable means of commerce. if a currency fluctuates wildly in value (not stable, due to it not being regulated or controlled) and for the most part isn't even usable in everyday economic transactions, that's not a good currency. whether or not it is valuable is a different question
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