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AMD No longer a viable option for mid-high end? - Page 106  

post #1051 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by mav451 View Post

As for (rhetorical) question of what team you play on, I was once on the AMD team.
I actually still have these two chips on my desk lol. See this picture I just took. Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Kqu1UYB.jpg

Trivia - name the platform and average overclock of the chip on the left. Go!
Opteron 146 @ 3GHz

based on instinct and experience
post #1052 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by AMDATI View Post

9590 truly is the AMD-only-user centric part, because it relies on people with money to burn choosing to go with AMD despite cheaper and better performing alternative and cost effective options. In short, no matter how you look at it, the 9590 loses to both the 4770k and 3930k in price to performance ratio in every scenario one can conceive.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AMDATI View Post

9590 truly is the AMD-only-user centric part, because it relies on people with money to burn choosing to go with AMD despite cheaper and better performing alternative and cost effective options. In short, no matter how you look at it, the 9590 loses to both the 4770k and 3930k in price to performance ratio in every scenario one can conceive.

So Kaveri Vs intel or AMD standalone cpu+gpu.....Nope
So 8XXX Vs Intel....Nope.
So 9XXX Vs Intel...Double nope.

All ultimately lose on price to performance ratio, whether out of the box or in the long run.
Kaveri standalone vs. Intel standalone,Kaveri wins in gaming. Now before you have any excuses,both are APU's and AMD is pushing Kaveri for game/entertainment use. If you'd like to run benchmarks all day,well then buy an Intel cpu.
AMD 83xx competes with Intel and the 3770K and 4670K,a $150 CPU competing with a $230 one is impressive if you ask me, the 83xx are mid-end processors and aren't even made to compete with the $340+ i7.
AMD 9xxx,you buy that because you can,if you can afford a 9xxx you know what you're getting into.
Buying a 9590 is like buying a Dodge Viper because you have money to burn,it's not as fast as the Corvette,and it gets poorer gas mileage (power use) but you get the huge V10 (cores).
So yeah I dunno what you're "Nope-ing" at.


Quote:
Originally Posted by mav451 View Post

As for (rhetorical) question of what team you play on, I was once on the AMD team.
I actually still have these two chips on my desk lol. See this picture I just took. Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Kqu1UYB.jpg

Trivia - name the platform and average overclock of the chip on the left. Go!
Looks like you haven't had a AMD chip in quite a while? I'm gonna guess Opteron on socket 939,I can't remember how well they OC though.
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post #1053 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by AMDATI View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by cssorkinman View Post

Why are they comparing the stock 9590 to overclocked I 7's , can't they compete at stock???

They are a little bit low on the cinebench 11.5 scores I get 8.60 or so at 5 ghz even with ram set at 1333 mhz.

In the studio max it's a virtual tie.

Um...that chart clearly shows the stock 4770K besting the 9590, which has no overclocking headroom. Ohhh no I'm sorry there's overclocking headroom.....4.7Ghz to 5.0Ghz......much wow!

To be honest, the 9xxx have about the same headroom as the haswells.
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post #1054 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by 996gt2 View Post

A single GTX 780Ti or 290X is about 2-3 times the performance of your 7870. Please don't misunderstand. I'm not trying to say your card sucks or anything like that. What I'm saying is that GPU performance has increased a lot with the current generation of cards (780Ti, 290X), and it has reached a point where AMD chips DO bottleneck even a single high-end GPU. Yes, a FX8350 is not going to bottleneck a 7870. Nobody will deny that. But a 290X is quite literally like 2 to 3 7870s.

I have posted numerous benchmarks already to prove this point, it's up to you to interpret them. Put it this way, if you go to Techspot and look at all of the game tests where they have tested CPU performance, you will find that AMD cards bottleneck high-end cards like the 290X about 75% of the time.

My oh my: AMD vs. Intel, the ultimate gaming showdown: 5GHz FX-9590 vs. i7-4960X
http://www.extremetech.com/computing/170023-amd-vs-intel-the-ultimate-gaming-showdown-5ghz-fx-9590-vs-i7-4960x
Quote:
But does it compete, in both configurations? Absolutely yes.
Got a one track mind there do ya?
Quote:
Originally Posted by AMDATI View Post

9590 truly is the AMD-only-user centric part, because it relies on people with money to burn choosing to go with AMD despite cheaper and better performing alternative and cost effective options. In short, no matter how you look at it, the 9590 loses to both the 4770k and 3930k in price to performance ratio in every scenario one can conceive.

So Kaveri Vs intel or AMD standalone cpu+gpu.....Nope
So 8XXX Vs Intel....Nope.
So 9XXX Vs Intel...Double nope.

All ultimately lose on price to performance ratio, whether out of the box or in the long run.
Either you skip an argument you would definitely lose (probably best decision) or you skew the argument to derail the train of thought. Case in point:

People talk stock performance and it goes against the argument so then talk about the price. So then people talk price or price/performance ratio and again it goes against the argument, so back to stock performance. ie:

4770K beats 8350 at stock garnering the point that AMD cant compete at stock so someone shows the 9590 (stock) beating said 4770K. So then the argument gets move to price and then the 8320 is brought into the fray as being a superb Price/performance chip. Then the stock performance of the 4770(or pick-a-Intel) is shown as to proclaim the inferior stock performance of the 8320 so then someone brings up the 9590... .

Pick one.

And for the love all that is holy, if you aren't going to respond to my Kaveri posts then refrain from commenting on Kaveri. You need more education which I have linked lots of material to help you, to at least allow you more informed opinions.

Edit: Found this:
Quote:
the 9590 loses to both the 4770k and 3930k in price to performance ratio

Oh so close. You are right about the 4770K not the 3930K.
Edited by Durquavian - 3/30/14 at 5:36pm
post #1055 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by cssorkinman View Post

To be honest, the 9xxx have about the same headroom as the haswells.
wait what? 3.5ghz to 4.5ghz plus = 4770k, fx9xx 4.7ghz to 5.7ghz? Yea on ln2.
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post #1056 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by AMDATI View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuivamaa View Post

One problem with techspot is that it occassionaly cooks tables.

I'm not seeing how the tables are being cooked. all I'm seeing is that you have to underclock the 3770 down to 2.5ghz just for the 8350 overclocked to 4.5Ghz to be comparable in performance.

Assuming you actually could comprehend bar graphs, if only there was some sort of graphics
Quote:
Originally Posted by 996gt2 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by cssorkinman View Post

The 9590 would out perform the 4770k .

1: The 9590 is more expensive than a 4770K (no CPU cooler included, and you're gonna need a beastly cooler with a 9590 just to run it @ stock speeds)

2: The 9590 @ 5 GHz is still slower than a stock 4770K in many cases. LOL

cinebench115.png

video-encoding3.png

3dstudio-max.png

Wow, benchmarks for a video encoding software that isn't even named and two 3 year old rendering suites.

As a 3d modeler, I can tell you that you wouldn't be caught dead using Cinema 4d 11.5 (from 2011) or 3DS Max 2011 as they're ancient and look awful compared to the latest versions.

Remember when I talked about cherry picking?

You don't understand what the graphs mean that you're posting, other than "look at the bar graphs!"

If you actually did, you'd flat out ignore 3 year old software in a field where there's still major advancements happening every year. Not to mention that CB 11.5 is well known to strongly favor Intel and that 3DS Max 2011 is more than likely using Mental Ray, and Nvidia product,and Nvidia products always run terrible on AMD CPUs (like PhysX).

The fact that those graphs come from a site that is so bad that they can't even list which renderer they used for 3ds max makes me question the legitimacy of it entirely.

But Cinebench r14 makes things way, way more competitive. I do think it's against the rules to link to other forums, but if you do some digging you'll find that FX 8350 around 4.7ghz to 5ghz scores about 750 to 800 points. And a stock 4770k scores lower 700s.

So in fact, if you're not using ancient rendering software (which no one in the real world would do), the 9590 does win stock.
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post #1057 of 1593
I was hoping to avoid this, but it really fits the current state of the thread. The benchmark I previously mentioned:

Online Graphing
graph

Now, as seen in the above perfectly valid graph, Intel (Green) clearly wins against AMD (Red), although by a small margin.

Now, of course some of you will question the reliability of the above graph and say that something on it is wrong or something. I do not care. My perfectly reasonable opinion is that AMD is better and I can selectively prove it. If for some reason you put valid facts on the table that prove otherwise, I will consider them invalid, ignore them, and wait until I find the chance to prove my point, which is (as I already mentioned) that Intel is better than AMD cause I am right, and you're wrong...

... and that's pretty much it. Have a good night (or day?).
post #1058 of 1593
So like I asked before, why dont we come up with our own benching analysis (for those that would like to participate) along with any other information plausible (POS cost, cooler cost, kill a watt measurements etc) and end the discussion of theories. It doesnt even need to be under this thread, as its a cluttered mess to begin with.

Or do we prefer to chase for chinks in the armor?
    
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post #1059 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by cssorkinman View Post

Friends and family benefit from my upgrades quite often smile.gif

That's a good way too!
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post #1060 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by PsyM4n View Post

I was hoping to avoid this, but it really fits the current state of the thread. The benchmark I previously mentioned:

Online Graphing
graph

Now, as seen in the above perfectly valid graph, Intel (Green) clearly wins against AMD (Red), although by a small margin.

Now, of course some of you will question the reliability of the above graph and say that something on it is wrong or something. I do not care. My perfectly reasonable opinion is that AMD is better and I can selectively prove it. If for some reason you put valid facts on the table that prove otherwise, I will consider them invalid, ignore them, and wait until I find the chance to prove my point, which is (as I already mentioned) that Intel is better than AMD cause I am right, and you're wrong...

... and that's pretty much it. Have a good night (or day?).

 

LOL, I haven't had that good of a laugh in a long time on this forum.

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