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AMD No longer a viable option for mid-high end? - Page 154  

post #1531 of 1593
Any good end-user/non-professional OCing reviews of the 970A-UD3P? If I can be reasonably confident that it's a capable OCer that won't light it self on fire or explode I'll have to revisit some of
Quote:
Originally Posted by Papas View Post

Gigabyte GA-MA770T-UD3P

I had one of these as well. Very good VRM on it for the money.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PsyM4n View Post

Well, that's a very good deal.

Yeah, it's a pretty impressive bundle.

I'd get one myself if I didn't already if I didn't already have way too much crap already.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

The UD3P takes it's VRMs form the Rev 4 lineup. It's good.

Promising.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

You buy an 8320 for multithreading. Not much to take out an i5. If you're buying an FX 8-core for single-thread work you're doing it very very wrong. I will not defend AMD's chips from a single thread point of view, but the 8 cores add up quickly, especially in VM duty as you noted earlier. And if multithread was not that important, why not get a 6300? Cheaper, less power draw, and as a result of less power draw, significantly more headroom.

A single core can run multiple threads, but multiple cores cannot work on a single thread.

A 4670k with a modest OC can certainly lose to a highly clocked Vishera in some tasks. However, it won't lose as badly in those well threaded tasks as the Vishera will in the lightly threaded ones.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

The boards in that price range are simply not good, and it isn't just the power delivery I'm concerned about at that point, it's the whole motherboard.

Firmware and power delivery is the bulk of a board. ASRock's firmware is pretty solid, and the power delivery is good enough. Most of the rest is fluff.

OCing a modern Intel platform doesn't touch anything but the CPU itself, nothing else needs to be run out of spec.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

Regardless, I would NEVER recommend any of the motherboards you are pointing to for intel for anyone thinking of making an actual computer

I cannot agree with this. The superficial appearance of quality, or an abundance of unnecessary features do not make a good board.

I am no stranger to very expensive, high-end boards (I've spent 400+ on a couple), but have often used budget boards to good effect.
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post #1532 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blameless View Post


I've used a few well regarded budget boards for FX eight-cores, they were disappointing.

I've used 2 (970A-UD3P,M5A97 evo R2.0) and they were/are very satisfying. They aren't sabers or ud5s but they were both pretty good.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PsyM4n View Post

You can't really go far with the stock amd cooler (a locked i5 doesn't need anything else apart from the stock cooler). As for the "cheap" AM3+ boards that can maintain such overclock... they can't really do it for long. The vrms on those use low power parts that literally die if pushed for long.

Those gigabyte UD3 AM3 boards for example, there's a reason why they have like 3-4 revisions. The previous revisions die horribly when pushed since the fets can't keep up with what's needed for an overclocked 8xxx, and the newest ones (that supposedly don't die) are not really on the cheap side.

This cooler is leaps and bounds more potent than the stock intel one exactly because vishera octos generate alot of heat and they can't get away with a POS like the one intel uses (which is fine for stock ofc). I can o/c an FX8320 with the stock one at 4.3Ghz, that's a ~22% o/c ,7.5% for the 8350.As for the motherboards you are just misinformed. If you want guarantee that you max out a vishera octo you'll need a sabertooth or the equivalent but high clocks are attainable and 100% sustainable with some cheap motherboards.
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post #1533 of 1593
I've got the 970A-UD3P, however I am currently overclocking on it with a locked processor frown.gif it seems capable, 310 BCLK (however that's a bit high for this little chip, 1035T).

Currently at 3.8Ghz @ 1.452v @ 290 BCLK. HT link @ 2343Mhz (stock is 2200Mhz) and CPU/NB @ 2636Mhz @ 1.150v (stock).

Seems solid in terms of its power delivery, load line calibration on this seems very solid too so I am not worried about it's power delivery at all.
post #1534 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeo01 View Post

I've got the 970A-UD3P, however I am currently overclocking on it with a locked processor frown.gif it seems capable, 310 BCLK (however that's a bit high for this little chip, 1035T).

Currently at 3.8Ghz @ 1.452v @ 290 BCLK. HT link @ 2343Mhz (stock is 2200Mhz) and CPU/NB @ 2636Mhz @ 1.150v (stock).

Seems solid in terms of its power delivery, load line calibration on this seems very solid too so I am not worried about it's power delivery at all.
what rev is the board?
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post #1535 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wirerat View Post

what rev is the board?

Rev 1.0.

I believe there is only one revision of this board anyway, there's only one BIOS for it too.

Came out late 2013. Think it wasn't long before December actually; when it was released that is.
post #1536 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuivamaa View Post

I've used 2 (970A-UD3P,M5A97 evo R2.0) and they were/are very satisfying. They aren't sabers or ud5s but they were both pretty good.
This cooler is leaps and bounds more potent than the stock intel one exactly because vishera octos generate alot of heat and they can't get away with a POS like the one intel uses (which is fine for stock ofc). I can o/c an FX8320 with the stock one at 4.3Ghz, that's a ~22% o/c ,7.5% for the 8350.As for the motherboards you are just misinformed. If you want guarantee that you max out a vishera octo you'll need a sabertooth or the equivalent but high clocks are attainable and 100% sustainable with some cheap motherboards.

I admit that I lacked information on the ud3r. Unfortunately it's not always possible to be updated whenever some new part comes out.

Apparently, simply mentioning the name and price of the board would be enough to prove that a viable solution now exists, and my related posts are thus invalid. Well, out of all participating in the recent discussion only one actually took the time to base his claim with this fact. The rest of you were like "burn fanboy, buuuuurrrrn! intel sucks, lemme ignore 95% of what you say and focus on that 5% for which I think I have a counter argument."

Even right now. You mention the M5A97 evo R2.0... which normally is closer to the 150$ mark than the 100$ mark (at least on amazon and ebay). Then the mention on the intel cooler sucking... where my post mentioned it for use on a locked processor.

Point is, if you want to prove me wrong, you're doing it wrong. Having a constructive conversation is also (of course) out of question with the kind of comments in this thread, from the majority of both the amd and intel supporters.
Edited by PsyM4n - 4/8/14 at 3:30am
post #1537 of 1593
The M5A97 EVO over where I am is around £74/$125, slap bang in the middle tongue.gif

However when I first bought my M5A97 PRO (Same as EVO) is was £84/$140. It was an amazing board but still quite expensive. My 970A-UD3P now cost me £64/$106 so much better deal.


Problem is at time of Bulldozer release (where I chipped in) my FX-6100 was £115/$192 + my PRO board at £84/$140. That's £199/$332.


And unfortunately as you can see that was a rubbish deal, I rolled the dice and I lost. My old Thuban 1045T on the other hand was the same price as my board and performed considerably better, especially so once overclocked. So unfortunately in my eyes the FX series is somewhat pants, I dislike them.


But then I have never tried out the new Piledriver chips, only an Athlon based on (which is pretty decent).


Unfortunately there are still people buying Bulldozer based chips, when you can get a used Thuban for similar price, or Deneb for that. So the only viable chip from AMD at the moment is a Piledriver based on.


Kaveri is great for its iGPU performance, so quite appealing to a small system (albeit ITX support is lacking). However I'd give the FX-4300 and possibly the FX-6300 a miss due to the fact that a 3-4 year old chip from AMD is superior in raw performance.

Instruction sets are what pulls FX ahead, but it's raw performance is unfortunately lower frown.gif multi-threading is great, but so is Thuban/Deneb.


If you are coming from an older based system then a FX is great, but some people here still own their Denebs/Thubans due to the fact that the upgrade isn't as profound as we wanted it to be. So the only viable "upgrade" in my eyes would be the FX-8320, no more and no less. More and you're hitting the expensive 8350 where if you are choosing a new system you may as well look at the I5-4670K or even locked models. Any lower and you're going back into Thuban territory and then Deneb's territory.


So fingers crossed AMD brings out something for the AM3+ platform or even something with a bit more oomf for FM2+.
post #1538 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by PsyM4n View Post

I admit that I lacked information on the ud3r. Unfortunately it's not always possible to be updated whenever some new part comes out.

Apparently, simply mentioning the name and price of the board would be enough to prove that a viable solution now exists, and my related posts are thus invalid. Well, out of all participating in the recent discussion only one actually took the time to base his claim with this fact. The rest of you were like "burn fanboy, buuuuurrrrn! intel sucks, lemme ignore 95% of what you say and focus on that 5% for which I think I have a counter argument."

Even right now. You mention the M5A97 evo R2.0... which normally is closer to the 150$ mark than the 100$ mark. Then the mention on the intel cooler sucking... where my post mentioned it for use on a locked processor.

Point is, if you want to prove me wrong, you're doing it wrong. Having a constructive conversation is also (of course) out of question with the kind of comments in this thread, from the majority of both the amd and intel supporters.

Let's clear some things because there is some misunderstanding going on. First the board. I am actually using it right now and it is this one :

http://www.amazon.co.uk/s/ref=nb_sb_ss_i_1_9?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=m5a97%20evo%20r2.0&sprefix=m5a97+evo%2Caps%2C337

I have no idea how much it costs in the USA but it should be around the 100$ mark (since it hovers around 90 euros over here). It is pretty ok with good airflow, not stellar but I have had rock solid 4.6Ghz with it, there's a guy in the vishera owners thread that hit 5Ghz with its predecessor ,the M5A97 evo first rev. You were probably thinking of M5A99 famly (150$ mark etc.).

My whole cooler intervention started because you mentioned that i5 comes with a cooler. At that point I really believed you might think that, just because FX 9xx0 didn't ship with a cooler, same happens with the 8xx0 series. That's all there is. Naturally If you want to get a decent overclock out of any chip out there,you'd want aftermarket cooling and same thing applies to both intel and AMD, at least right now. I don't argue you can raise the clocks a bit with the stock intel one but you can do the same with the 125W AMD one (the 95W part is ,well ,POS).
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post #1539 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blameless View Post

I cannot agree with this. The superficial appearance of quality, or an abundance of unnecessary features do not make a good board.

I am no stranger to very expensive, high-end boards (I've spent 400+ on a couple), but have often used budget boards to good effect.

You know what isn't superficial? Every ASRock board I've ever owned bends when I plug in the sata cables. That's just pathetic, and very much low quality. (To be fair, the boards were mid-range at best)

The cheaper boards are cheaper because they used cheaper parts to make them. I will never recommend them for the same reason I will never recommend a Catleap over an UltraSharp, Diablotek over Seasonic, and APEVIA over CoolerMaster. I won't tell someone to get a low-quality KB or Mouse over a good one that will last much longer to save $10.

Whether it's room to expand, room for upgrade, or just plain better components/features, I will hold a minimum bar. Those $70 ASRock motherboard are below that bar, and it has absolutely nothing to do with looks. They are $70 for a reason. It could be the caps, it could be that most of them only have two RAM slots, it could be they used cheaper connectors, thinner PCB, worse warranty, whatever. They are not up to par.

If you are hurting so bad for money that you must buy a $70 board to use that 4670k you just bought, you need to look at a different market or save up more, because it's an obvious indicator that you do not have enough money for what you are aiming for. I can fill the entire gap between $500 and $750 with mITX APU rigs with quality parts behind them, with most of the cost difference actually being optional cooling and SSD size. Above that you can get Intel with a real GPU, below that you may as well not even bother since you're going to have to cut so many corners people will think you work in a confetti factory.

Do buy quality first, with features you may find a use for in the future and with room to expand.

Don't buy low-end first because it's all you can afford, wishing you had better, and having to save up from scratch to get better things when you want/need them.

Parts are always getting cheaper. If you're that hard up you can buy used.

However, having written this whole rant, I acknowledge that there are those, including I am willing to guess yourself, that have lower bars for acceptance than I do. If you feel as strongly about the cheaper parts as I do about doing it "right" the first time, then we are not going to convince one another, though your side of the argument is welcome for explaining to and convincing others.

EDIT: 5000th post, woo.
Edited by KyadCK - 4/8/14 at 3:51am
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post #1540 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by PsyM4n View Post

Wait, is the ud3p at sub 100$ there? Cause it actually is a good choice, essentially the same as the 990fx ud3r4 on the power delivery side.

The intel processor would still draw much less than the fx though, even when overclocked.
Yup, that's a good board. Can't say anything about it. VRM heatsinked or empty topped?

But that's old man, it's not really for current processors. xD
not always, remember this graph:


That isn't a FX in spot number one.
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