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AMD No longer a viable option for mid-high end? - Page 57  

post #561 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by AMDATI View Post

In most games, not necessarily brand new, you get something like the mid 20's in FPS @ 1680x1050 with low-med quality settings, without AA. That's virtually bottom of the barrel gaming.

the i5 4430 performs quite a bit better with an r7 250 GPU, than the 7850k does with the same GPU...and it's just $5 price difference. And by the time you've bought both of either, you've spent $260 on APU/GPU....and are still getting rather subpar gaming performance either way.

heck at that rate, I could massively beat the 7850K with a 6 core vishera and a 750ti GPU for around $260 too....and even the 750ti is barely a lower mid range gaming card.

Loser; APU. And the worst part? it loses to AMD's own non APU's, let alone intels CPU's, and Nvidia's GPU's in ALL areas; performance, cost effectiveness, etc.

Tell you what. Try going and reading reviews from people who actually bought and use this cpu.
post #562 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by AMDATI View Post

No, I am not describing Llano, I am clearly describing Kaveri.


http://www.techspot.com/review/781-amd-a10-7850k-graphics-performance/page6.html
again... http://www.techspot.com/review/781-amd-a10-7850k-graphics-performance/page6.html


it's clear as day, just because this isn't 1998, doesn't mean resolution has no impact on FPS. if it can barely get 27fps at low-med settings at 1680x1050, I don't expect it to do any better at 1080p....and I sure as heck don't expect it to do well down the road with future titles.

This is silly because you are literally refuting the facts, to justify your own inaccurate conclusions.

I have proven that AMD APU's are less cost effective and less performing than separate CPU/GPU configurations.

Too weak for even mid range gaming, too expensive for anything less than gaming. Welcome to Kaveri.

This is your opinion, reviews show otherwise, and with launch drivers even (plenty of room for improvement).


New game, extreme 1080p settings.

Overclock it and you can even play skyrim on 1080p high. With even faster memory it would go quite higher even.
http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/cpus/2014/01/30/amd-a10-7850k-and-a10-7700k-kaveri-review/9

Kaveri has the performance, the problem is the price tag of A10-7850k since it competes with discreet solutions.
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post #563 of 1593
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuivamaa View Post

This is your opinion, reviews show otherwise, and with launch drivers even (plenty of room for improvement).


New game, extreme 1080p settings.

Overclock it and you can even play skyrim on 1080p high. With even faster memory it would go quite higher even.
http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/cpus/2014/01/30/amd-a10-7850k-and-a10-7700k-kaveri-review/9

Kaveri has the performance, the problem is the price tag of A10-7850k since it competes with discreet solutions.


I'm not seeing how this is positive for AMD. You can compare i3's and i5's to it.....but with the cheaper costs of them, you could buy a dedicated videocard with the money left over, and get better performance.

In all instances, a separate CPU+GPU come in cheaper, while delivering more performance than the 7850k.


"Kaveri has the performance, the problem is the price tag of A10-7850k since it competes with discreet solutions."

sounds a lot like a self serving excuse.



As for the link, I'm really not enjoying the bechmarks. Skyrim technically isn't all that demanding of a game. how many years old is it now? 32fps....@ 1920x1080.....High settings only, with no AA. And that's WITH 2100Mhz memory!

I mean heck, the price difference between DDR3 1333 and 2100Mhz can be virtually double.


I can get 8gb of DDR3 1333 for $40.

for DDR3 2133, about $70+
for DDR3-2400, about $80+

(assuming the person chooses minimal priced products)

and that's another issue....if I already have 8GB of RAM....it would still be an extra cost to have to replace it with a higher speed RAM just to squeeze a few more FPS out of an APU. That's extra cost plain and simple. Of course, if you have a separate CPU/GPU, then obviously you just don't need that extra memory speed, and hence, less cost over all.


So let's see...

Kaveri: $185
DDR3 2400: $80

total: $265


Now let's keep in mind, kaveri requires its own socket. if a person already has an intel or am3+ board, then they most likely won't require a new socket for an upgrade path on a non APU system. People may also already have DDR3 memory as well.

FX 6300: $119
GTX 750ti: $150
(no need to buy new memory)

total: $269

CPU and GPU performance difference? MASSIVE. And the 750ti is barely considered mid range.


Let's also keep in mind that the 750ti is just a more expensive, not necessarily hugely better performing version of an older GPU. The main difference is its energy efficiency. So you can actually get similar GPU performance for cheaper than the 750ti.

Personally, I don't find the performance of either of these GPU's acceptable for even mid range gaming, BUT this is more about comparison...and Kaveri just doesn't cut it. I don't even want to imagine the performance 2 years from now. Not to mention there's even older GPU's from 4 years ago that you could get used for $50 or less that perform better than Kaveri, further lowering the cost.
Edited by AMDATI - 3/15/14 at 1:42pm
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post #564 of 1593
No, it is the older piledriver Athlons when combined with a discreet that pose a threat to kaveri SKUs.Still, when A10 7700k hits 120 euros it will be a very solid choice.

FM2+ is a new and active socket with upgrades well into 2015 or even 2016 it seems. The difference between RAM of various frequencies isn't big nowadays (and don't pretend you'd gimp any decent gaming pc with 1333 modules) for those that wanna start building a new pc. You can try to twist it,then turn it 360 degrees as well, the only thing kaveri needs is a price reduction (it has started) and A8 7600 to hit the shelves.
Edited by Kuivamaa - 3/15/14 at 3:10pm
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post #565 of 1593
I would never pick up an AMD CPU for high end builds until they get their act together.
 
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post #566 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clairvoyant129 View Post

I would never pick up an AMD CPU for high end builds until they get their act together.


The 8320 or 8350 are from $150 to $180 cheaper than a i7-4770K. AMD is not asking you to pick an AMD processor for a high end build. So pray tell how would you?
post #567 of 1593
Wow, so much trolling in this thread. If all you wanted to do was rant, there's a separate forum for that.
Overclock.net Rants

Your arguments really don't make any sense AMDATI, since you can't make up your mind and keep the same opinion for more than a few posts.


Anyway, APU's are a great value, use little power when compared to a CPU + Dedicated GPU combo, and don't make much heat. Sure, Intel has high-performance chips that can beat it, but for mid-range computers, AMD is still a good choice. Once you start getting into high-end parts, most programs will begin to demand more processing power than AMD's processors can output at stock.
    
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post #568 of 1593
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuivamaa View Post

No, it is the older piledriver Athlons when combined with a discreet that pose a threat to kaveri SKUs.Still, when A10 7700k hits 120 euros it will be a very solid choice.

FM2+ is a new and active socket with upgrades well into 2015 or even 2016 it seems. The difference between RAM of various frequencies isn't big nowadays (and don't pretend you'd gimp any decent gaming pc with 1333 modules) for those that wanna start building a new pc. You can try to twist it,then turn it 360 degrees as well, the only thing kaveri needs is a price reduction (it has started) and A8 7600 to hit the shelves.

I literally just showed you the price differences, and they're significant enough to be nearly double. Let's keep in mind, RAM is actually a little more expensive now than it was a little while ago.


DRR3 1333 or 2400 isn't going to make a lick of difference in gaming performance on a non APU system. It really won't set back the CPU or GPU in terms of performance.

Quote:
the only thing kaveri needs is a price reduction

And the only thing the GTX 780 needs is a price reduction, or the only thing the i7 4770k needs is a price reduction, or the only thing the FX 9350 needs is a price reduction..........Not really a great argument on your part, because you can apply it to anything at any performance level.

By the time that price reduction comes around there will still be something else more cost effective. It's like you're living in this bubble where prices only go down on things you want to make an inaccurate point of.
Edited by AMDATI - 3/15/14 at 4:06pm
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post #569 of 1593
8320 at Newegg $159

i7-4770K at Newegg $339

More than double the price? Tell me how the 8320 is not a great value? You could buy the 8320 and a ASUS M5A99 PRO 2.0 for $114.99 after rebate and have $60 to add to the price of an SSD or a video card.
post #570 of 1593
8320 competes with 4670k, not 4770k.

In the end, you have to compare an $800 8320 system to an $860 (newegg price difference right now) 4670k system
Edited by Cyro999 - 3/15/14 at 4:57pm
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