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AMD No longer a viable option for mid-high end? - Page 63  

post #621 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by 06yfz450ridr View Post

it not all about fps its about the experience, if you are managing your refresh rate or higher and it plays smoothly, is the extra fps worth it? not really.

An intel setup would provide better min and max fps which in turn would deliver a better experience. Why go with a 9370 over a cheaper 4670K? What was your reasoning behind it?
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post #622 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stay Puft View Post

An intel setup would provide better min and max fps which in turn would deliver a better experience. Why go with a 9370 over a cheaper 4670K? What was your reasoning behind it?

The only reasoning that i've seen thusfar is higher multithreaded performance than i5 if you don't go into the bios for either cpu
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post #623 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stay Puft View Post

An intel setup would provide better min and max fps which in turn would deliver a better experience. Why go with a 9370 over a cheaper 4670K? What was your reasoning behind it?
its not all about min max. Look at the FX Intel thread where a guy posted benches and results between the 2. Look at the pics in this thread, I posted one of the fps graphs. AMD is generally alot smoother=better gameplay.
post #624 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by cssorkinman View Post

Stock FX processors outperformed the most modern Intel I7's also at stock in the same benchmark. No more misleading than any other benchmark score in my opinion.

Benchmarks that no longer reflect the reality of a given situation are inherently misleading.

x264 is regularly updated and it's binaries can simply be dropped into nearly any program that uses it. Using older versions of x264 in any real encoding task is pointless and counter productive.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cssorkinman View Post

I clicked on the link you provided , but just couldn't bring myself to download it.

It's clean, if that's what you are worried about.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Durquavian View Post

I thought about giving it a shot, but the popups kept me from being able to. Maybe another way to DL.

Here: http://www.sendspace.com/file/5vczk2
Quote:
Originally Posted by cssorkinman View Post

If the workload is similar to pov ray the vast majority of people who aren't overclockers could finish it faster with a 9370 than a 4770k.

This is an utterly unrelated argument. PoV Ray isn't what's being discussed.

PoV Ray is a highly niche tool for creating ray traced graphics.

x264 is the backbone of the majority of h.264 software encoders used today and is used daily by millions of people.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdlvx View Post

So, is there a reason why the people with Intel in their rigs focused on the x264 bench I posted (which I mentioned was older, but it's about a year old, not TWO) and completely ignored the POV-RAY benchmark?

Because no one was making obviously false claims about the Pov-Ray benchmark, and because Pov-Ray is only used by a tiny fraction of the number that use x264.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdlvx View Post

Haswells gains in x264 and Dolphin emulator come strictly from AVX2.

This is false.

Dolphin sees a substantial performance improvement on Haswell even in pre-AVX2 builds. It's likely that this improvement is due to the improved L1 cache performance and increased number of buffers, which could help with dynamic recompilation and register renaming.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PsyM4n View Post

Not in the case of Dolphin. Just because they are making avx2 builds doesn't mean that the said instructions are used effectively in practice.

The speed gain on Dolphin is a direct result of micro-architectural advancements. It's not AVX2 related.

Yes.

None of the builds I've seen benchmarks on, the same builds that show a 30% IPC gain over Sandy, even support AVX2.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyro999 View Post

And cache performance IIRC

Haswell has a faster L1 cache and a slower L3 cache than Sandy/Ivy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PsyM4n View Post

The cache performance is part of the micro-architectural advancements. It's part of the bunch, not something different.

Also true.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyro999 View Post

The only reasoning that i've seen thusfar is higher multithreaded performance than i5 if you don't go into the bios for either cpu

There are some situations where 8-core FXes are faster than i5s, even when both are tweaked equally well.

Still, I could never justify the purchase of an FX-9370 over a 8320 or 8350, and if I am going to recommend a CPU in the 300 dollar ballpark, 95% of the time I'm going to recommend an i7.
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post #625 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by Durquavian View Post

its not all about min max. Look at the FX Intel thread where a guy posted benches and results between the 2. Look at the pics in this thread, I posted one of the fps graphs. AMD is generally alot smoother=better gameplay.

What games were used? can you link me to the graph thx
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post #626 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by diggiddi View Post

What games were used? can you link me to the graph thx
sorry, on phone but if you click the pics used in thread or on my profile it is there. Keep in mind I am not not saying one is better than another just that each has their advantages and disadvantages.
post #627 of 1593
well at the time ( like 2 years ago I believe) I was debating between a 3570k and the fx 6300 but I was on a very strict budget at the time due to school and really couldnt afford the higher priced intel rig with a decent gpu for bf3 .

I opted for a 6300 at the time and a msi board and 550w TT tough power psu they both ended up being garbage and my psu died in a few weeks and the msi board I got was a horrible overclocker. I sent the motherboard back to newegg and saw an open box sabertooth 990fx r2.0 for 129 which I immediately bought as well as a new psu. I ended up grabing a used 550ti for 70 bucks at the time and ran sli for a while which actually played great.

I then was building my aunt a new pc for photoshop etc and gave her my fx and grabbed a 8320 which I had a for a little while. I upgraded a friends aging rig with a new 7870 ghz but his old core 2 quad was holding him back and his cpu was not overclockable. I intended on building him a rig with my 8320 and spare board etc so I grabbed the 9370 which was $200 shipped at the time hoping to achieve a 5ghz stable overclock which I still cant seem to reach with this cpu and be stable.


all in all if I were to do it again I cant say which side I would choose but the 4670k is good gaming cpu, which runs much cooler than my 250w+ cpu since its running 1.56v to achieve only 4.83 ghz stable


all in all I didnt think my pc would be like it is today, I just kept upgrading, It was already to late to switch since I would need a new water block, motherboard etc.

I'm happy with what it is but for most people its not worth the hassle and the money for a custom loop to keep this thing cool.
 
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post #628 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by Durquavian View Post

sorry, on phone but if you click the pics used in thread or on my profile it is there. Keep in mind I am not not saying one is better than another just that each has their advantages and disadvantages.

I've read the thread in question and the numbers in both Metro LL and Mafia 2 have raised some doubts - certainly enough for me to start looking up numbers on my own.

1) Mafia 2 - stock vs. stock
(8320 vs. 3570K)
Tasm (the OP) presents the results as the following:
95fps - AMD
68fps - Intel

See some other numbers here and here:
http://www.rage3d.com/reviews/cpu/amd_vishera_fx8350_launch_review/index.php?p=14
http://www.hardwarereview.net/Reviews/AMD%20Bulldozer/AMD-Bulldozer.htm

2) Metro LL
This time, TASM doesn't specify that he's benching stock, so I will assumed OC vs OC.
18.58 avg (9.03, 32.30) - AMD
13.78 (3.54, 44.63) - Intel

Looking elsewhere, I see the following:
http://www.techspot.com/review/670-metro-last-light-performance/page6.html Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show) http://gamegpu.ru/action-/-fps-/-tps/metro-last-light-test-gpu.html

3) I recall reading this piece earlier this year, from PClab.pl
http://pclab.pl/art55238-8.html Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show) Tasm - the thread creator, was running the comparisons with a 7950 after all tongue.gif

My advisement is that the OP re-run both of those tests. Apart from that, it was an educational thread.
I would also argue that the generalization of modern Intel overclocking takes a bit more than simply "changing a multiplier."
You'll notice most layman OCers struggle with Haswell, while the *median* result at OCN is closer to 4.55GHz tongue.gif
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post #629 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by mav451 View Post

I've read the thread in question and the numbers in both Metro LL and Mafia 2 have raised some doubts - certainly enough for me to start looking up numbers on my own.

1) Mafia 2 - stock vs. stock
(8320 vs. 3570K)
Tasm (the OP) presents the results as the following:
95fps - AMD
68fps - Intel

See some other numbers here and here:
http://www.rage3d.com/reviews/cpu/amd_vishera_fx8350_launch_review/index.php?p=14
http://www.hardwarereview.net/Reviews/AMD%20Bulldozer/AMD-Bulldozer.htm

2) Metro LL
This time, TASM doesn't specify that he's benching stock, so I will assumed OC vs OC.
18.58 avg (9.03, 32.30) - AMD
13.78 (3.54, 44.63) - Intel

Looking elsewhere, I see the following:
http://www.techspot.com/review/670-metro-last-light-performance/page6.html Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show) http://gamegpu.ru/action-/-fps-/-tps/metro-last-light-test-gpu.html

3) I recall reading this piece earlier this year, from PClab.pl
http://pclab.pl/art55238-8.html Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show) Tasm - the thread creator, was running the comparisons with a 7950 after all tongue.gif

My advisement is that the OP re-run both of those tests. Apart from that, it was an educational thread.
I would also argue that the generalization of modern Intel overclocking takes a bit more than simply "changing a multiplier."
You'll notice most layman OCers struggle with Haswell, while the *median* result at OCN is closer to 4.55GHz tongue.gif

Rage 3d and hardware review.. Two no name sites ive never heard of before today. Why should i take anything they say to be truthful?
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post #630 of 1593
The reason I pointed it out wasn't to tout one superior to another but that there is always more to the story. Look at most benches and you see Intel with slightly higher min, usually a bit higher max and then an avg that is usually a couple of frames higher. But that is what you should question. Why aren't the avg higher on Intel? No one generally asks, they take the info at face value. AMD usually only hits that min rarely and their graphs tend to be alot less jumpy. Intel tends to hit its minimum more frequently and their maxed tend to be just before or after with alot more jumping. The graph doesn't change the min/max/avg but is pertinent though mostly overlooked.

I am certain a great deal of this can be tweaked out for both. I don't see either company as a bad choice. But you have to admit most benches and reviews have very little to say to us here at OCN.
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