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AMD No longer a viable option for mid-high end? - Page 8  

post #71 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by Derp View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by cssorkinman View Post

My Intel rigs don't give me as good of a user experience as my AMD's , regardless of cost. Simple as that.My FX's are so much more nimble for everyday things

This quote really got me but it also makes me think you're just trolling Alatar.

You're just having some fun with him right?

Right?

eh-smiley.gif

He isn't. We've discussed it at length in the 8300 club. I've also got a 2720QM, 4670, and 4770k. My 8320 "feels" better. There have been others who came from Intel, usually 2500Ks, that say the same. Not common, but enough to take notice.

I've got a theory behind it, and it's pretty simple. Windows is an OS that runs hundreds of mini-threads. Just doing my thing normally it has 1060 threads open. As microscopic as the difference would be, 8 cores allows for doing more at once. If the OS can do more at once, it has more time to respond. The more time it has, the sooner it can. The sooner it does, the more responsive it feels.

Why did people say the iPhone felt smoother? It had a quicker screen reaction time. Why do people pay out the nose for 1ms response time monitors? They feel it is smoother, more responsive. Same concept, but in CPU form.

That's my explanation anyway. It's not just comparing to intel either, it makes my old 970BE feel like a dog too. My friend has a bunch of my old parts, including until recently, my 970BE. It was clocked at 4.2Ghz, he has an SSD, modern chipset, fast enough RAM, everything. I put in an 8320 that I got for $100 (Thankyou Microcenter) and before I even overclock the thing it gets a "whoa" out of him.

Completely unrelated but still on the "feel" topic, a number of us can "feel" when the chip is unstable and call crashes in advance. It's especially apparent on unstable memory overclocks. Could just be experiance, but I don't get a warning feeling when I'm screwing with my Intel stuff. *shrug*
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyrannocanis View Post

but dat 5ghz Overclock... Oh yeah biggrin.gif

Is fun right? You can have Zeus throw lightning bolts at these things, they don't fry. tongue.gif
Edited by KyadCK - 3/2/14 at 1:58am
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post #72 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alatar View Post

Problem with FX as gaming CPUs is consistency. FXs just aren't cut out for consistency. Sure they hang with the i5s in well threaded games like BF4 and look good in GPU bound benches where every CPU made in the last 4 years is on par but once you hit a game that can't utilize many threads so well you can well have your performance cut in half compared to an i5 or an i7. That may be an acceptable thing for an AMD enthusiast but it sure as hell isn't a good value proposition.
Not going to argue that since per core performance completely sucks due to their module design currently but the bottleneck is also largely dependant on resolution and It'll actually show in RTS or turn based strategy games. (Which for me would be a huge problem since I can't have CIv5 running even slower)
post #73 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyrannocanis View Post

This reminds me of what happened at microcenter last week when I bought my 9370.

Employee: How can I help you

Me: One FX 9370 please

Employee: Sure. can I ask what kinda stuff you do with your computer?"

Me: "Just games basically"

Employee: "Ooooooh....you know we've got some intel socket 2011 boards in and some deals on i7's to go with them?"

Me: "Your point?"

Employee:"Well intels, i7's especially, are much better for gaming."

Me: "According to whom?"

Employee: "Well id be more than happy to show you some benchmarks if you'd just follow....."

Me: "Is a Ferarri better at driving to the grocery store than a minivan? Technically. Will you notice a difference because of the speed limits? No. I said I wanted a 9370, not 'I dont know which cpu I want'."


Lol tongue.gif my i5 3450 already runs almost every game at 60 fps with my dual 7950's,(including crysis 3, and battlefield 4) I want the amd just to have it. You don't need a high end cpu for gaming as long as you have enough gpu power at hand. The average processor is more than enough for practically any game outside of physics heavy sims.

but dat 5ghz Overclock... Oh yeah biggrin.gif
He was just getting rid of 3820's nobody wanted rolleyes.gif
post #74 of 1593
Since the IPC of FX CPU's were known to be bad, who here actually disable one core per module just to get better single-core performance?
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post #75 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by nX3NTY View Post

Since the IPC of FX CPU's were known to be bad, who here actually disable one core per module just to get better single-core performance?

No one, because that isn't how it works.
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post #76 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

No one, because that isn't how it works.
Realocation of resources isn't the case indeed the gains are very minimal only waiting gains are solved yielding about 10% extra perf at best.
post #77 of 1593
Quote:
The average processor is more than enough for practically any game outside of

The problem i have is with people stating that the average CPU is more than enough for practically any games....... Aside from CPU bound ones! lmaosmiley.gif

That's kind of the point. If we didn't have insufficient performance in games, why would we buy anything stronger than a stock fx6300 or i7 920 for running them? They can't keep up with a lot of stuff if you're trying to get fps solidly over 60 and you need a monster of a CPU to make some games approach solid 120 - no matter how many graphics settings you are willing to turn down or how many oc'd 780's/290's you put in your rig
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post #78 of 1593
OK to be fair businesses care, and the truth is Intel is much stronger (as they should be, they are huge).


But stop comparing benchmarks and take a look at the general feel of things. For me my I7-3770 is quick, it does whatever I throw at it. But from my point of view if you are waiting for something to complete (e.g. rendering, or bleeding video conversions) most people go have the toilet or move away from their computer.

If the Intel chip does this in 10 minutes and the AMD does it in 20 minutes most people aren't going to care. Unless it's your profession and time really does equal money.


But for most people, general users, mobile users, gamers 10 minutes of your life really won't make people think "I so wish I wasted X amount more on that Intel chip" as as greedy as we people are we always want something for "cheaper". So even though say the 4770K may do something super speedy a lot will think "But I spend a lot on it" making it seem like wasted money smile.gif


Well that's my opinion, people think in money not performance sometimes. "Yeah but my chip did it in 30 minutes LESS"... "yes but no my wallet is slimmer" = worse value.



The only time I think you should be thinking you need an upgrade is if you feel yourself saying "why is this slow... ugh!". OK to be fair in gaming it can matter, that's why minimum FPS and frame variation is important. Me, 30 FPS is fine I can't tell difference over that. So why wouldn't I get an AMD chip if it can sustain that.


In terms of efficiency Kaveri is pretty darn good, as many have said most do not run their chips at 100%.


Oh and a final note, current CPUs are slow, the 4770K is slow. It's about time to make that transition to GPU based architecture and speed things up really. That's the point with HSA, because it's been there for years, harness it and wa-la.


Intel are great, AMD are great, what's not great? The software. If devs can program towards architecture you may not say AMD are so bad. Intel are just strong, raw strength. You've got your card now you need a suitable track to race it on.

You could develop a program to fully utilise AMD's hardware and leave Intel in dust. And again you could develop a program to fully utilise Intel's hardware and leave AMD in dust.


I'm moving from an I7-3770 to an Athlon, because I feel it gives better value, and why the heck not? Come on who sticks to a single chip for years? smile.gif hardware changes and us enthusiasts know the word "upgrade".


Also GPUs are the most power hungry things in your system, so unless that's down your 50W chip may not look so good.


/PERSONAL opinion
post #79 of 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alatar View Post

An FX isn't a "best of both worlds" solution. An i7 is.

They both are, in their respective price ranges.

Take me for example, I do a lot of encoding, multithreaded tasks, etc and my main game is bf3 (now BF4) online.

Is an FX-8320/8350 somehow not the better choice here for the price range?

Besides, people mock the single thread performance, and it's true its a fair bit behind, but what in all reality at even it's current level can it not play with very good frame rates?

Only worthwhile upgrade for someone like me is a six-core intel due to having four additional threads over my current setup, but at their price range it's a whole different league of cpu.

I mean seriously, an 8320 is $150 on amazon... That is less then half of the price of a NON K 4770... If that isn't a viable option for someone who does things like me (which is fairly common mind you) then I don't know what to think anymore. And we all know you can get to 8350 level with a multiplier change on a stock cooler so essentially an 8350 for $150.

Nothing intel has competes in that price range for overall performance. The cheapest, lowest spec desktop i5 (again, non-k) is $180.

The closest thing they have to this is the i3-4340, which I actually think is a great cpu for older titles and general tasks. However, with it truly being a dual core + ht, it simply cannot compete with an 8320/8350 overall and we all know this especially once overclocking is considered.

And even this cpu is $10 more then a 8320..

Point I'm trying to make comes down to the budget of the specific builder.
Edited by SoloCamo - 3/2/14 at 6:43am
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post #80 of 1593
I want my work done wether or not I go to the toilet.. But hey I might just be weird..
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