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[TC] The Console Market Is In Crisis - Page 14

post #131 of 142
I think that some of you are forgetting that things have grown awfully stagnant.

Tahiti GPU came out a long time ago. x86 CPUs like 2600k have been the fastest consumer CPUs you can buy for a while (not including just throwing on more cores). Even Piledriver right now isn't anything massive, or even Steamroller for that matter.

The thing is when 360 and PS3 came out, we were still making huge strides in performance. There was a huge difference between FX series Nvidia and 6000/7000 series Nvida. The same for 9700 pro and x1000 series.

But while CPUs improved dramatically in that time period, Nvidia entered G80 rebrand forever and ATI stumbled with 2000 and 3000 series.

But my point is that the PC market for gaming (looking at CPUs) was massively stagnant then. And consoles did well.

Now we are at a point where everything is stagnant, CPUs and GPUs, yet we haven't seen anything trickle down because things are moving so slowly.

However as always it seems like people want to directly compare PC hardware to console hardware. WIndows, which is designed to run Pentium 4s at the oldest, is getting compared to highly optimized OSes and software designed for one set of hardware.

I do not think some of you realize just how much compatibility with the massive amount of PC hardware hurts performance. And with consoles you don't have it.

But I digress, I'm somewhat off topic.

The thing is that 7870 came out a long time ago and it's still a mid-range card (well, the GPU, it's been rebranded). In fact we are dealing with GTX 700 series being rebrands and R9 series being rebrands .

Consoles are just stuck, they don't have any big jumps to make. And we might actually be seeing an over-reaction (from Sony at least). PS3 was powerful for its time but it was difficult to develop for. So Sony released something that's really easy to develop for but not nearly as powerful in comparison to competition as Cell was.
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post #132 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chakravant View Post

Not really. I'm still gaming with pre-2005 parts (my platter drive, some fans, etc.) in my rig right now. If you upgrade and spend wisely (in the US, always buy your parts on Dec. 30th or 31st), you could easily exceed a console in value and power over time (with the PS3/360 generation being a notable exception). It just takes time, dedication, and savvy.

Time is also considered "cost" with an arbitrary value, which is different depending on the person. You may value your time little enough to justify doing the work of researching and upgrading, but others will not.
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post #133 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by felon View Post

To be honest I just skim through the replies. The price point is one of the most important factors, you cannot choose to "not argue it", just because it doesn't suit you. Theres no way a 7950 will run BAD COMPANY 2 let alone gta v

You can't comment on GTA V performance so kudos. I chose not to say anything in the performance per dollar since I already acknowledge consoles as being the best value, I instead took you up on your over blanketing statement that 2005/2006 hardware can't play modern titles.

Video of 8800 GTX in BC2: Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
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post #134 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tsumi View Post

Time is also considered "cost" with an arbitrary value, which is different depending on the person. You may value your time little enough to justify doing the work of researching and upgrading, but others will not.
You've got me there. I do value time relatively little, and my own less than others.
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post #135 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azefore View Post

You can't comment on GTA V performance so kudos. I chose not to say anything in the performance per dollar since I already acknowledge consoles as being the best value, I instead took you up on your over blanketing statement that 2005/2006 hardware can't play modern titles.

Video of 8800 GTX in BC2: Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

Not 2005 hardware as I previously mentioned. I specifically mentioned what cards were out at the time but that seemed to have went right over your head. Also congrats, you found one title that barely maintains 40fps. Keep in mind that many COD titles run at 60fps on the 360. now how about bf4, and cod ghosts on a 8800gtx? Yea stop trying. The 800$ top of the line card cannot match the 2005 console hardware
post #136 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by felon View Post

Not 2005 hardware as I previously mentioned. I specifically mentioned what cards were out at the time but that seemed to have went right over your head. Also congrats, you found one title that barely maintains 40fps. Keep in mind that many COD titles run at 60fps on the 360. now how about bf4, and cod ghosts on a 8800gtx? Yea stop trying. The 800$ top of the line card cannot match the 2005 console hardware

That's 1080p with high settings which are still above the consoles versions sorry to say. Also as my last point look up the 'RSX' gpu used in the PS3, might be surprised its an NV47 based chip.

8800GTS playing BF4(GTX not available): Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

It will also play COD just fine as it is fine in Black Ops 2. Thanks for playing.
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post #137 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azefore View Post

That's 1080p with high settings which are still above the consoles versions sorry to say. Also as my last point look up the 'RSX' gpu used in the PS3, might be surprised its an NV47 based chip.

8800GTS playing BF4(GTX not available): Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

It will also play COD just fine as it is fine in Black Ops 2. Thanks for playing.

That's a g92 8800gts, it's the 512 version released in late 2007. The g80 is significantly slower and was 320mb and 640mb. Nice try again, people got their hands on that card in 2008. And i specifically said the 7950gt will not run bad company 2. I was aware that the ultra would crawl on it.

Noticed how i stayed off the 8800ultra and concentrated on the 7950gt.
So lets just go along with what you're trying to say here. You use a card from late 2007 (seems like you've been changing the years ever since you started), the card gets 40-50fps on singleplayer on bf4 on medium(where you got 1080p with high settings from I have no idea, how about watching the video). So you have one of the best pc cards for the time, getting 40-50fps on medium, on bf4, and this is your argument here? really? Not only are you 2 years late, but again the pricetag, and most importantly, this is singleplayer. Multiplayer would take a huge performance hit. Yet the 2005 console, has multiplayer, and runs bf4 just fine

Keep in mind most of the COD titles run at 60fps on the 360, another thing to consider before attempting on taking on a losing argument.
Thanks for playing, but I know my hardware, and the timelines. Not only is your timeline way off, but you (or if not you someone else), mentioned the 7950gt, which is more accurate for the time, so stick to that, and stop pushing the years. Next thing you know you'll be giving me examples with 2010 hardware
Edited by felon - 3/15/14 at 7:33am
post #138 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by felon View Post

That's a g92 8800gts, it's the 512 version released in late 2007. The g80 is significantly slower and was 320mb and 640mb. Nice try again, people got their hands on that card in 2008. And i specifically said the 7950gt will not run bad company 2. I was aware that the ultra would crawl on it.

Noticed how i stayed off the 8800ultra and concentrated on the 7950gt.
So lets just go along with what you're trying to say here. You use a card from late 2007 (seems like you've been changing the years ever since you started), the card gets 40-50fps on singleplayer on bf4 on medium(where you got 1080p with high settings from I have no idea, how about watching the video). So you have one of the best pc cards for the time, getting 40-50fps on medium, on bf4, and this is your argument here? really? Not only are you 2 years late, but again the pricetag, and most importantly, this is singleplayer. Multiplayer would take a huge performance hit. Yet the 2005 console, has multiplayer, and runs bf4 just fine

Keep in mind most of the COD titles run at 60fps on the 360, another thing to consider before attempting on taking on a losing argument.
Thanks for playing, but I know my hardware, and the timelines. Not only is your timeline way off, but you (or if not you someone else), mentioned the 7950gt, which is more accurate for the time, so stick to that, and stop pushing the years. Next thing you know you'll be giving me examples with 2010 hardware

I'm trying to devote as little to humoring you as possible here because continuity seems to be a big issue here.

You don't know where I got 1080p with high settings from? Check post #133

A CoD title on 360 at varying resolutions, not seeing too much 60fps consistency on singleplayer let alone multiplayer:

You mention the pricetag again like a debater grasping for straws when I've said I already agreed with the price/value point........................................................................le sigh

If you can disprove a 7950GT's performance in modern titles I'd like to see/hear/read it but there's little to no benchmarks or in-game recordings of such, especially of GTA V which isn't out yet that you assume any of the mentioned cards won't play.

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post #139 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azefore View Post

I'm trying to devote as little to humoring you as possible here because continuity seems to be a big issue here.

You don't know where I got 1080p with high settings from? Check post #133

A CoD title on 360 at varying resolutions, not seeing too much 60fps consistency on singleplayer let alone multiplayer:

You mention the pricetag again like a debater grasping for straws when I've said I already agreed with the price/value point........................................................................le sigh

If you can disprove a 7950GT's performance in modern titles I'd like to see/hear/read it but there's little to no benchmarks or in-game recordings of such, especially of GTA V which isn't out yet that you assume any of the mentioned cards won't play.

I don't need to disprove anything. I owned the 7950gt back in 2006.
I'm the one grasping for straws? You've been using newer and newer hardware in your examples, proving my point. I don't know what your video there even shows. The bf4 settings were at medium, and could not maintain 60fps. I don't know why you even showed that bf4 video. It's is a disaster at proving your point..and again you are years late. You clearly do not know your hardware, the fact that you even need "disproving" that a 7950gt would not run anything recent, shows how deluded you are. You are so deluded it's not even funny anymore, mentioning a 7950gt with GTA V in one sentence? are you out of your mind? the 7950gt couldn't even run dirt 3 at medium, would struggle even on minimum to maintain 30fps. You have not a single clue on what you're talking about. I have to sit here and educate you, bet you were completely clueless about COD running at 60fps on the 360. It is very obvious that you have no experience with older hardware at this point, specifically the hardware in the 2005-2008 range. Please just do everyone a favor, and just stop. I've been doing this for much longer than you, child
post #140 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by felon View Post

I don't need to disprove anything. I owned the 7950gt back in 2006.
I'm the one grasping for straws? You've been using newer and newer hardware in your examples, proving my point. I don't know what your video there even shows. The bf4 settings were at medium, and could not maintain 60fps. I don't know why you even showed that bf4 video. It's is a disaster at proving your point..and again you are years late. You clearly do not know your hardware, the fact that you even need "disproving" that a 7950gt would not run anything recent, shows how deluded you are. You are so deluded it's not even funny anymore, mentioning a 7950gt with GTA V in one sentence? are you out of your mind? the 7950gt couldn't even run dirt 3 at medium, would struggle even on minimum to maintain 30fps. You have not a single clue on what you're talking about. I have to sit here and educate you, bet you were completely clueless about COD running at 60fps on the 360. It is very obvious that you have no experience with older hardware at this point, specifically the hardware in the 2005-2008 range. Please just do everyone a favor, and just stop. I've been doing this for much longer than you, child


Quote:
Originally Posted by felon View Post

The 360 priced at 399$ on its release date in 2005..Wow you've gotten more than 20fps "easy" on high/med. Some 360 games run at 60fps if you haven't noticed, such as MW2, a few other COD titles, and dead rising, probably quite a few more but not familiar with the others. They all run at 60fps on the 360. GTA V maintains around 30fps, and it's definitely not a "low" setting. Probably somewhere in the med range without anti aliasing. In anycase, no way your 7950 would run GTA V when it comes out for PC nor would it even launch bf3 or cod ghosts

I'll let the bolding talk, however, I haven't changed hardware at all, I've stayed with 3 products this entire time if you bothered to be more respectful and read replies instead of just taking pot shots once you see me put in a reply (ie. 8800 GTS (1st gen and G92), 8800 GTX, 7950 GT)

Clueless? I hope you'd like to hear that a good selection of CoD titles are just scaled up from quite low resolutions, for instance:



The previous CoD video I posted showed that the xbox 360 can't maintain 60fps in one of many CoD titles, I never said that there aren't 60hz enabled games or that the consoles can't do 60 fps, I merely stated that a good majority are capped at 30 fps max and even if they get bumped to 60 fps it is not consistent on a regular basis.

Yup and thanks for the petty insult at the end as well, so much for keeping a small debate civil.

Here's the only video of a supposed 7950GT playing Dirt 3 I found on youtube (see where I'm getting at with no credible sources of fps or statistics of the 7950GT in modern titles?) Doesn't look bad to me but obviously there's no detailed info on the settings used:

I honestly hope you're not taking this discussion too seriously
Edited by Azefore - 3/15/14 at 10:40pm
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