Overclock.net › Forums › Industry News › Hardware News › [ZDnet]Fixing the PC market in the Post-PC Era: Build better PCs
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

[ZDnet]Fixing the PC market in the Post-PC Era: Build better PCs - Page 2

post #11 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by Booty Warrior View Post

It doesn't matter much when you have a dedicated GPU. But in an APU build, your RAM acts as system and graphic memory. Compare the raw bandwidth of even the highest clocked DDR3 with the GDDR5 we have in modern GPUs and you'll understand why faster memory is a must for APUs.

okay, i kinda understand.

but doesnt the IGPU have enough vram? whats the vram on those?



on an off topic note, is this really the reason why there is a price spike in ram?
http://www.extremetech.com/computing/166775-ram-pricewatch-memory-spikes-in-wake-of-hynix-fire-but-for-how-long
My Rig
(10 items)
 
   
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
I5 4670 H81m P33 MSI GTX 760 Hawk G Skill Ripjaws x series 2x4 
Hard DriveOptical DriveOSMonitor
WD blue 1TB Samsung dvd burner SH-224DB/BEBE Windows 7 Asus VN248H-P 
PowerCase
Rosewill Capstone 550w Corsair carbide 200r 
CPUMotherboardRAMHard Drive
Pentium G3220 MSI H81m-P33 G.SKILL Sniper Series 4GB PNY XLR8 SSD 120GB 
Optical DriveOSPowerCase
Cheapest Drive I Was Able To Find Windows 7 Corsair CX 450w NZXT Source 210 
  hide details  
Reply
My Rig
(10 items)
 
   
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
I5 4670 H81m P33 MSI GTX 760 Hawk G Skill Ripjaws x series 2x4 
Hard DriveOptical DriveOSMonitor
WD blue 1TB Samsung dvd burner SH-224DB/BEBE Windows 7 Asus VN248H-P 
PowerCase
Rosewill Capstone 550w Corsair carbide 200r 
CPUMotherboardRAMHard Drive
Pentium G3220 MSI H81m-P33 G.SKILL Sniper Series 4GB PNY XLR8 SSD 120GB 
Optical DriveOSPowerCase
Cheapest Drive I Was Able To Find Windows 7 Corsair CX 450w NZXT Source 210 
  hide details  
Reply
post #12 of 57
Well I can see why people are talking about DRAM prices instead of on point to the article. The author pretty much dances around a couple points and never "closes the deal." All he says is "hey build a better PC and we'll buy it." which I'm not sure how he can conclude that for every other consumer. Here's another point, he says "most businesses expect PCs to last three years." If you'd ask my place of work that question, it's easily 5 or more years. The age of "good enough" computing has taken root.

The only PC people are dropping money on are Macs. And that's partly due to the luke warm reception of Windows 8.

.....

Ya RAM is pricier because the factory space is all making NAND and LSI. It's not that expensive though.
post #13 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by IMKR View Post

can u explain why?
i was told / researched that ram speed doesnt matter much.

and 1600mhz vs higher values doesnt change performance much.

The GPU on the APU relies on your system memory. When it comes to GPUs, you want lots of bandwidth (frequency * bus width) and latencies are not as important. Dedicated GPU VRAM can run upwards of 6GHz while your system memory runs at a comparatively slow 1600MHz. Therefore, to get the most out of the GPU on an APU, you want faster memory.

If you use a dedicated graphics card then yeah, RAM speeds don't make a big difference since your GPU has its own dedicated VRAM.
Neutrino
(14 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i7 6700K Asus Z170I PRO GAMING Gigabyte GTX 1070 Mini ITX Corsair 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR4-3200MHz 
Hard DriveCoolingCoolingOS
Crucial MX300 750GB Scythe Big Shuriken 2 rev. B Cryorig XT140 fan Windows 10 Pro 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Topre Realforce 87u 55g Corsair SF450 Lazer3D LZ7 Logitech G303 
Mouse PadAudio
Steelseries 4HD Audio Technica ATH-M50 
  hide details  
Reply
Neutrino
(14 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i7 6700K Asus Z170I PRO GAMING Gigabyte GTX 1070 Mini ITX Corsair 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR4-3200MHz 
Hard DriveCoolingCoolingOS
Crucial MX300 750GB Scythe Big Shuriken 2 rev. B Cryorig XT140 fan Windows 10 Pro 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Topre Realforce 87u 55g Corsair SF450 Lazer3D LZ7 Logitech G303 
Mouse PadAudio
Steelseries 4HD Audio Technica ATH-M50 
  hide details  
Reply
post #14 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doomtomb View Post


Ya RAM is pricier because the factory space is all making NAND and LSI. It's not that expensive though.

what are these?
My Rig
(10 items)
 
   
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
I5 4670 H81m P33 MSI GTX 760 Hawk G Skill Ripjaws x series 2x4 
Hard DriveOptical DriveOSMonitor
WD blue 1TB Samsung dvd burner SH-224DB/BEBE Windows 7 Asus VN248H-P 
PowerCase
Rosewill Capstone 550w Corsair carbide 200r 
CPUMotherboardRAMHard Drive
Pentium G3220 MSI H81m-P33 G.SKILL Sniper Series 4GB PNY XLR8 SSD 120GB 
Optical DriveOSPowerCase
Cheapest Drive I Was Able To Find Windows 7 Corsair CX 450w NZXT Source 210 
  hide details  
Reply
My Rig
(10 items)
 
   
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
I5 4670 H81m P33 MSI GTX 760 Hawk G Skill Ripjaws x series 2x4 
Hard DriveOptical DriveOSMonitor
WD blue 1TB Samsung dvd burner SH-224DB/BEBE Windows 7 Asus VN248H-P 
PowerCase
Rosewill Capstone 550w Corsair carbide 200r 
CPUMotherboardRAMHard Drive
Pentium G3220 MSI H81m-P33 G.SKILL Sniper Series 4GB PNY XLR8 SSD 120GB 
Optical DriveOSPowerCase
Cheapest Drive I Was Able To Find Windows 7 Corsair CX 450w NZXT Source 210 
  hide details  
Reply
post #15 of 57
I disagree... Macs are declining as well, though not as fast. People are dropping money on tablets and I think its in manufacturer's best interest to build better tablets and less PCs.
Po' Pimpin'
(11 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardRAMHard Drive
i5 2500k @ stock Biostar TZ68K+ [A3] 4GB  Sandforce 1222 64GB SSD 
Optical DriveCoolingOSMonitor
LG 22x DVD-+RW  Stock Windows 7 x64 Acer S211HL 1080p 
PowerCaseMouse
600w Diablotek Linkworld Electronic Inland 
  hide details  
Reply
Po' Pimpin'
(11 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardRAMHard Drive
i5 2500k @ stock Biostar TZ68K+ [A3] 4GB  Sandforce 1222 64GB SSD 
Optical DriveCoolingOSMonitor
LG 22x DVD-+RW  Stock Windows 7 x64 Acer S211HL 1080p 
PowerCaseMouse
600w Diablotek Linkworld Electronic Inland 
  hide details  
Reply
post #16 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by IMKR View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doomtomb View Post


Ya RAM is pricier because the factory space is all making NAND and LSI. It's not that expensive though.

what are these?

Flash memory and Microprocessors
post #17 of 57
The article is kinda lacking in content so there does not seem to be much to discuss in there. In a nutshell the point made is that "tablets are the new disposable PC's which are good enough but you cant really work on them in effective manner". Author seems to be on opinion that DELL, HP and others have somehow started producing better PC's - Take for example DELL Alienware. There are two models intended for PC games. Starting prices are 700$ and 1500$ - in the front page you see that these have 270X and 290X GFX cards in them, that's good for gaming, right? Then you open up the spec sheet, for example the 700$ model and what do you see - a nVidia 645 in a 700$ gaming computer? Really? You can scrape together a custom build for ~500 EUR which has nVidia 760 in it! You do not get into 270X before you hit 1200$ mark with that cheaper alienware and at 1200$ gaming computer you can do already better than that.

So I have to disagree also with the authors opinion that the large OEM's have somehow started doing better PC's. You can see the same trend with their other offerings as well - some bottleneck components here and there, for example bold claim of "4 GB graphics card" in some "gaming" PC to only find some low end thing in there with 4 GB of DDR3 memory, etc. Sure, their highest end offerings are pretty decent and if you customize the setup and know what you are after you can usually put together pretty ok set but you will end up paying through your nose for that if you are going for major OEM. And they will probably still sell you the crappiest possible PSU, for example.
Kohver v.4
(25 items)
 
Kohver v.3
(21 items)
 
Soliton
(23 items)
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
Intel Core i7 3820 X79-UP4 Gigabyte 390X G1 Club3D 7870 Eyefinity 6 
RAMHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
64 GB Barracuda 3 TB WD Green 3 TB Crucial M4 256 GB 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveCooling
Crucial M4 64 GB Barracuda 4 TB Corsair LE 480HB Sythe big shuriken rev B 
CoolingCoolingCoolingOS
Nexxos 280mm radiator DC-LT Alphacool GPX 390M04 Windows 7 Pro 64 bit 
MonitorMonitorMonitorMonitor
DELL U2311H (x3) DELL U2312HM (x2) 9.7'' 2048x1536 (x3) IPAD3 retina Asus PB287Q 4K 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
CM Quickfire TK (red) Corsair AX-1200i Significantly modded Jupiter .. something alumi... Logitech G700s 
Mouse Pad
3M Ergonomic 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
Intel Core i7 3820 X79-UP4 Gigabyte 390X G1 Club3D 7870 Eyefinity 6 
RAMHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
64 GB Barracuda 3 TB WD Green 3 TB Crucial M4 256 GB 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingOS
Crucial M4 64 GB Barracuda 4 TB Sythe big shuriken rev B Windows 7 Pro 64 bit 
MonitorMonitorMonitorMonitor
DELL U2311H (x3) DELL U2312HM (x2) 9.7'' 2048x1536 (x3) IPAD3 retina Asus PB287Q 4K 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
CM Quickfire TK (red) Corsair AX-1200i Modded Sharkoon VS-3 Logitech G700s 
Mouse Pad
3M Ergonomic 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
Intel Core i7 3820 X79-UP4 Sapphire 7950 FleX OC XFX 6770 Eyefinity 5 
GraphicsRAMHard DriveHard Drive
Club3D 7870 Eyefinity 6 64 GB Samsung 750 GB F3 Barracuda 3 TB 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
WD Green 3 TB Crucial M4 256 GB Crucial M4 64 GB Barracuda 4 TB 
CoolingOSMonitorMonitor
Custom loop Windows 7 Pro 64 bit DELL U2311H (x3) DELL U2312HM (x2) 
MonitorMonitorKeyboardPower
9.7'' 2048x1536 (x3) IPAD3 retina Asus PB287Q 4K CM Quickfire TK (red) Corsair AX-1200i 
CaseMouseMouse Pad
Modded Chieftec Smart WH-02B-B-OB Logitech G700s 3M Ergonomic 
  hide details  
Reply
Kohver v.4
(25 items)
 
Kohver v.3
(21 items)
 
Soliton
(23 items)
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
Intel Core i7 3820 X79-UP4 Gigabyte 390X G1 Club3D 7870 Eyefinity 6 
RAMHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
64 GB Barracuda 3 TB WD Green 3 TB Crucial M4 256 GB 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveCooling
Crucial M4 64 GB Barracuda 4 TB Corsair LE 480HB Sythe big shuriken rev B 
CoolingCoolingCoolingOS
Nexxos 280mm radiator DC-LT Alphacool GPX 390M04 Windows 7 Pro 64 bit 
MonitorMonitorMonitorMonitor
DELL U2311H (x3) DELL U2312HM (x2) 9.7'' 2048x1536 (x3) IPAD3 retina Asus PB287Q 4K 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
CM Quickfire TK (red) Corsair AX-1200i Significantly modded Jupiter .. something alumi... Logitech G700s 
Mouse Pad
3M Ergonomic 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
Intel Core i7 3820 X79-UP4 Gigabyte 390X G1 Club3D 7870 Eyefinity 6 
RAMHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
64 GB Barracuda 3 TB WD Green 3 TB Crucial M4 256 GB 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingOS
Crucial M4 64 GB Barracuda 4 TB Sythe big shuriken rev B Windows 7 Pro 64 bit 
MonitorMonitorMonitorMonitor
DELL U2311H (x3) DELL U2312HM (x2) 9.7'' 2048x1536 (x3) IPAD3 retina Asus PB287Q 4K 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
CM Quickfire TK (red) Corsair AX-1200i Modded Sharkoon VS-3 Logitech G700s 
Mouse Pad
3M Ergonomic 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
Intel Core i7 3820 X79-UP4 Sapphire 7950 FleX OC XFX 6770 Eyefinity 5 
GraphicsRAMHard DriveHard Drive
Club3D 7870 Eyefinity 6 64 GB Samsung 750 GB F3 Barracuda 3 TB 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
WD Green 3 TB Crucial M4 256 GB Crucial M4 64 GB Barracuda 4 TB 
CoolingOSMonitorMonitor
Custom loop Windows 7 Pro 64 bit DELL U2311H (x3) DELL U2312HM (x2) 
MonitorMonitorKeyboardPower
9.7'' 2048x1536 (x3) IPAD3 retina Asus PB287Q 4K CM Quickfire TK (red) Corsair AX-1200i 
CaseMouseMouse Pad
Modded Chieftec Smart WH-02B-B-OB Logitech G700s 3M Ergonomic 
  hide details  
Reply
post #18 of 57
Too much prices fixing in their industry has killed it. Imagine if manufacturers, Microsoft, and rottenegg stop the price gouging and wholefully accept less profit margins. This would usher in an revolution for pc gaming. Windows license are stupid expensive for systems builders. If Linux / steambox ever takes off I surely hope it makes Windows irrelevant as a gaming platform. Hell, at that point there'd almost be no incentives to stick with Ms for the average pc gamer or mainstream pc user (if Linux were to be stupid proof)
post #19 of 57
I think the current drop in nand prices is worth a rise in dram cost. I just got a $225 480GB SSD of relatively decent performance. I wouldnt mind spending a little more on RAM as I personally feel any dissapointment has been negated.
post #20 of 57
Price of games is also key. I can't for the life of me figure out why I should pay $60 or probably around $90, with today's trends, for a PC game, if I can't resell it when I'm done playing or if I don't like it? Another reason why we should go back to consoles? It's a problem that's growing worse everyday and it's because we are putting so much money into our PCs for gaming. Developers see this trend and believe we have more money to spend than console gamers which isn't always entirely true. I mean, take a look. If you wanted to get a full and early experience out of Titanfall, BF4, COD Ghost and other recent games on PC, you are easily going to spend around $300+. That's insane.
Gaming Rig
(15 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel i5-4670K Asrock Z87 Extreme6 Powercolor RX 480 G-skill Ripjaws x-series  
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
Adata SPG 900X adata 120GB Antec H2O 620 Windows 10 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
MG279Q 27inch free sync CM Storm quickfire Seasonic 650W Fractal Design R5 
MouseMouse PadAudio
Logitech G502 ZERO Sennheiser PC-363D 
  hide details  
Reply
Gaming Rig
(15 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel i5-4670K Asrock Z87 Extreme6 Powercolor RX 480 G-skill Ripjaws x-series  
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
Adata SPG 900X adata 120GB Antec H2O 620 Windows 10 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
MG279Q 27inch free sync CM Storm quickfire Seasonic 650W Fractal Design R5 
MouseMouse PadAudio
Logitech G502 ZERO Sennheiser PC-363D 
  hide details  
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Hardware News
Overclock.net › Forums › Industry News › Hardware News › [ZDnet]Fixing the PC market in the Post-PC Era: Build better PCs