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2GB V-RAM??? - Page 5

Poll Results: Still not enough? Keep your bias aside for a second :)

Poll expired: Mar 16, 2014  
  • 52% (28)
    Yes, it's enough
  • 28% (15)
    No, i believe it's still not enough
  • 18% (10)
    I'm still on the fence
53 Total Votes  
post #41 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by CynicalUnicorn View Post

C'mon, Crysis? That's the exception, not the rule. Still, if those are only "sitting on the edge" of 2GB, then that means 1GB should be just shy of 1440p's requirement assuming it scales linearly (and that 1.25GB should be just barely sufficient). So... Wow. That might explain why 8800GTXs can still run modern games on medium-high settings @ 60FPS at the cost of antialiasing. 512MB is still enough for 1080p in general apparently.
There is no way you're from Texas! tongue.gif

But it does not scale linearly. Never has. Resolution is only a part of the equation. If an game uses 2k textures that take up 1,5GB of vram thous textures take up that amount regardless of what resolution you are gaming at, be it 800x600 or 4k. Rendering resolution does not have that huge of an impact actually compered to other stuff and that's one of the reasons you can get by with 2GB so often.

Lets say an game uses 1.6GB of vram when playing at 1080p. Dump on 8xMSAA and you might see an additional 100mb perhaps 150mb of vram usage. That's still only 1.75GB so its an none issue.

Same thing if you just increase resolution alone. If the frame buffer was 100mb with no AA at 1080p then going surround 1080p will just triple that part totaling in 1.9GB so still under 2GB still fine.

Where the problem comes in is when you do high resolution + AA as AA scales of resolution. So if the framebuffer is 100mb at 1080p and 200mb at 1080p + AA then if you do that on 3 monitors you are suddenly looking at an 600mb increase in vram usage bringing the total to 2.2GB and that's when you got a problem.

Naturally those are crude and pretty inaccurate numbers but that's the gist of it.
Edited by Bit_reaper - 3/14/14 at 6:28pm
    
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post #42 of 198
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bit_reaper View Post


Well I'm going mostly on memory here but as I recall some of the games are

Crysis 3
Cyrsis 2 (with official high res/DX11patch)
Max Payne 3
Batman: Arkham City
Bioshock infinite

Thous are the ones I can think of the top of my head (though I'm sure there are more). A lot of thees sit right at the edge of 2GB when gaming @ 5760x1080p so you might get away with 4xmsaa but not 8x ect. Really AA is a big thing as it scales with resolution. In some ways that makes 5760x1080p more problematic to run compared to an average 4k setup as you tend to need less AA with an moderately sized 4k monitor/TV.

Also do keep in mind when testing that vram issues might not be apparent right away as in some games textures are loaded on demand but not flushed right away so the game might run fine for 1-2 minutes and then stutter for a bit run fine for another 1-2 minutes and so on as well as the fact that some areas situations use more and others less.

I already did a benchmark on crysis 3 a few posts ago, and trust me, crysis 2 isn't close to Crysis 3 in performance draw. #passed wink.gif Here's Batman Arkham city with the highest settings possible including PhysX, DX11 features and what not... Still not out of V-ram rolleyes.gif
No AA (Click to show)
x2 MSAA (Click to show)

Here is also Dirt 3 at X8MSAA 5120x2160 Runs like a charm... Check out that min FPS biggrin.gif
Settings (Click to show)
Test Summary (Click to show)
Quote:
Originally Posted by CynicalUnicorn View Post

There is no way you're from Texas! tongue.gif

I live here biggrin.gif; however, i'm not from here. I'm Nigerian, moved here about 2-3 years ago tongue.gif
Edited by Yungbenny911 - 3/14/14 at 7:18pm
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post #43 of 198
I noticed that going from 2gb vram to 3gb vram allowed the next level of anti aliasing to be applied , think i was running a 670 (2gb vram) and switched to a 7970 (3gb vram) playing bf3 with 2x aa with the 670 and could run 4x aa with the 7970. Pretty similar cards apart from the extra vram.
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post #44 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yungbenny911 View Post

I already did a benchmark on crysis 3 a few posts ago, and trust me, crysis 2 isn't close to Crysis 3 in performance draw. #passed wink.gif Here's Batman Arkham city with the highest settings possible including PhysX, DX11 features and what not... Still not out of V-ram rolleyes.gif
No AA (Click to show)
x2 MSAA (Click to show)

Here is also Dirt 3 at X8MSAA 5120x2160 Runs like a charm... Check out that min FPS biggrin.gif
Settings (Click to show)
Test Summary (Click to show)

OK fair enough. You are running out of GPU grunt on arkham so whether or not it goes over 2GB is an moot point.

What would like to know more about is your resolution setting.

In your OP you say
Quote:
i was able to downsample my 21:9 2560x1080p 75Hz Dell monitor to 5120x2160 30Hz
but that does not make any sense as 2560x1080p is the lower resolution so if you are putting that on an 5120x2160 monitor then that's upscaling not downsampleing.

Do you really mean that you are rendering at 5120x2160 and then displaying that on your 2560x1080p monitor? I'm assuming that is the case as in your Dirt screen shot the 5120x2160 is the rendering resolution. Further more I have to question your results when you get more FPS with the 2xAA then you do with it off so did you just miss label the results or is there something else going on.

I would also like to point out that we where talking about 5760x1080p with AA not 5120x2160p. While I'm not sure how that differences may effect the result I do think it would be interesting to see how 5760x1080p 8x/4xMSAA compare. After all 5760x1080p is by far the most popular surround resolution.

And like I said earlier don't just run the benchmark, take it in game and see if it actually runs smooth after moving around a bit. In my experience that can make all the differences
    
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post #45 of 198
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bit_reaper View Post


OK fair enough. You are running out of GPU grunt on arkham so whether or not it goes over 2GB is an moot point.

What would like to know more about is your resolution setting.

In your OP you say
Quote:
i was able to downsample my 21:9 2560x1080p 75Hz Dell monitor to 5120x2160 30Hz
but that does not make any sense as 2560x1080p is the lower resolution so if you are putting that on an 5120x2160 monitor then that's upscaling not downsampleing.

Do you really mean that you are rendering at 5120x2160 and then displaying that on your 2560x1080p monitor? I'm assuming that is the case as in your Dirt screen shot the 5120x2160 is the rendering resolution. Further more I have to question your results when you get more FPS with the 2xAA then you do with it off so did you just miss label the results or is there something else going on.

I would also like to point out that we where talking about 5760x1080p with AA not 5120x2160p. While I'm not sure how that differences may effect the result I do think it would be interesting to see how 5760x1080p 8x/4xMSAA compare. After all 5760x1080p is by far the most popular surround resolution.

And like I said earlier don't just run the benchmark, take it in game and see if it actually runs smooth after moving around a bit. In my experience that can make all the differences


1.) Downsampling: Also called OGSSAA : Ordered Grid SuperSampling AntiAliasing, is in this case the concept of rendering the game at a much higher, custom made, resolution than your monitor is capable of displaying and subsequently having the GPU rescale the image ( as in downsample ) to that of your monitor's native resolution to which the end result is a "cleaner", sharper and less aliased image.

SOURCE thumb.gif

2.) Yes, i mislabeled the results...

3.) I'm also interested, but i think it would be similar to previous tests i have done on my system. As you can see in the benchmark results below. 1080p + SMAA x4 was still not as power hungry as 1440p + NO AA. 5120x2160 is almost twice the pixel size of 5760x1080p, so X8MSAA on the surround monitor shouldn't be as demanding as 5120x2160, but it might be close. I'll see if i can create a custom resolution and compare them.

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post #46 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yungbenny911 View Post

1.) Downsampling: Also called OGSSAA : Ordered Grid SuperSampling AntiAliasing, is in this case the concept of rendering the game at a much higher, custom made, resolution than your monitor is capable of displaying and subsequently having the GPU rescale the image ( as in downsample ) to that of your monitor's native resolution to which the end result is a "cleaner", sharper and less aliased image.

SOURCE thumb.gif

2.) Yes, i mislabeled the results...

3.) I'm also interested, but i think it would be similar to previous tests i have done on my system. As you can see in the benchmark results below. 1080p + SMAA x4 was still not as power hungry as 1440p + NO AA. 5120x2160 is almost twice the pixel size of 5760x1080p, so X8MSAA on the surround monitor shouldn't be as demanding as 5120x2160, but it might be close. I'll see if i can create a custom resolution and compare them.


This is going a bit off topic but I would like to point out that Downsampling in the way you are doing it, well the way I think you are doing it, as in enabling gpu scaling and then making an custom high resolution that you enable in game. That is not the same thing as "real" SuperSampling as in real SSAA you have additional filtering that is applied in order to avoid down scaling artifacts like moire patterns. That's why I stopped using that method and instead opted to use nvidia inspector and force true SSAA.

On topic. The reason I asked for 5760x1080p 8xMSAA is that it has an different performance demand. It might free up more gpu time that could give playable frame rates and if so then it would be pretty important to know if the vram could cause the FPS to tank (same goes for PhysX, that's additional GPU load that takes almost zero vram). Remember when the FPS drops due to vram limitations it does not go down to 0 it usually goes down in to the 10-15 range as the system is limited by the speed at which the vram can be freed up and loaded with the needed texture.
Edited by Bit_reaper - 3/14/14 at 7:46pm
    
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post #47 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bit_reaper View Post

This is going a bit off topic but I would like to point out that Downsampling in the way you are doing it, well the way I think you are doing it, as in enabling gpu scaling and then making an custom high resolution that you enable in game. That is not the same thing as "real" SuperSampling as in real SSAA you have additional filtering that is applied in order to avoid down scaling artifacts like moire patterns. That's why I stopped using that method and instead opted to use nvidia inspector and force true SSAA.

On topic. The reason I asked for 5760x1080p 8xMSAA is that it has an different performance demand. It might free up more gpu time that could give playable frame rates and if so then it would be pretty important to know if the vram could cause the FPS to tank (same goes for PhysX, that's additional GPU load that takes almost zero vram). Remember when the FPS drops due to vram limitations it does not go down to 0 it usually goes down in to the 10-15 range as the system is limited by the speed at which the vram can be freed up and loaded with the needed texture.

How bout someone with a 4k monitor try this and we stop arguing about methodology? Im sure theres someone on OCN with a 4k monitor and at least 1 770. Or 680 since they perform basically the same.
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post #48 of 198
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sugarhell View Post

Also downsample is not an accurate method to see the vram usage at 4k res
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bit_reaper View Post

This is going a bit off topic but I would like to point out that Downsampling in the way you are doing it, well the way I think you are doing it, as in enabling gpu scaling and then making an custom high resolution that you enable in game. That is not the same thing as "real" SuperSampling as in real SSAA you have additional filtering that is applied in order to avoid down scaling artifacts like moire patterns. That's why I stopped using that method and instead opted to use nvidia inspector and force true SSAA.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deadboy90 View Post

How bout someone with a 4k monitor try this and we stop arguing about methodology? Im sure theres someone on OCN with a 4k monitor and at least 1 770. Or 680 since they perform basically the same.

Here's proof.gif that downsampling is VERY accurate for testing. I have a lot of time on my hands at the moment, so why not? You guys would only learn more from it. I apologize in advance for crappy low-light images thumb.gif

I have two monitors, a 2560x1080p 75Hz monitor, and a 1920x1080p 120Hz monitor, so what i did to compare downsampling with native resolution was... I downsampled my 1920x1080p monitor to 2560x1080p @ 75Hz, and did a crysis 3 benchmark on both monitors. The benchmark stops when prophet jumps down into that shelter you see him in, and as you can see, both monitors are even showing the same frame rate tongue.gif.
Downsampled Monitor (Click to show)
Native Resolution Monitor (Click to show)

Detailed Benchmark Results:
Downsampled Monitor Control Panel Settings (Click to show)
In-Game Settings (Click to show)

Downsampled 2560x1080p Monitor:
Frames, Time, Min, Max, Avg
12619, 300000, 23, 72, 42.063


Native 2560x1080p 75Hz Monitor:
Frames, Time, Min, Max, Avg
12704, 300000, 22, 71, 42.347

Edited by Yungbenny911 - 3/15/14 at 2:14am
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post #50 of 198
Proves OP's point. Framerates went to hell with AA enabled. First bottleneck - CPU/GPU grunt.
Also, you may end up getting above 2GB of VRAM usage, but I guarantee that you don't need all of the data it cached.
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